Will "Altar Girls" lead to Women Priests?

[Dum_Spiro_Spero]

I find it ironic in parishes that allow only males to serve…especially in exclusively Traditional Latin Mass parishes, there is an over abundance of young men/boys serving…and the number of registered families in those parishes are usually significantly smaller than the local NO Cathedral…yet they produce more vocations and more Altar Boys…that should tell you something.

Just wanted to say that I agree with this statement, especially the last sentence, especially in my parish. I attend NO Masses because I am in a rural area, and that is the only ones offered here. The priest at my parish is already stretched between two parishes, and he has a lot on his plate. My mom has served as the sacristan for a long time, and why? Because no one else has stepped up to take the job. She lines up Mass intentions for those who have died. Once a month, she and my dad (in formation to be ordained a deacon) take Communion around to the homebound. She used to handle all the decorating in the church, but thankfully we got some people to start taking that over.

So where are all the men to offer their services?

Sometimes I think people don’t want to step up is because they are afraid of being tied down to something. If they put as much work into their church as they did into their job, maybe we wouldn’t have this problem.

With that being said, I am a girl (moving off to Benedictine College as a freshman in a little over a week) and I served at Mass when I was younger (please remember that I’m in a rural area…we pretty much needed those extra servers so the guys wouldn’t be so overwhelmed). I am a mandated reader. I also played the piano for Mass. I think what I did was completely acceptable. If you don’t want female altar servers, then attend Mass where there are none. As such, I doubt any of us will change each other’s minds, and I don’t want to argue. Just my two cents.

 

[edwest2]

No. It is not possible. The concept of “women priests” exists only outside of the Church.

God bless,
Ed

 

[Milesius]

What I am saying is that if men don’t go to church because there are women there, than they are pathetic. If boys refuse to be altar servers because girls do it, they should seriously get a talking to from their parents.

Women are not an alternate species. It is possible to talk to them, to serve with them, to work on committees with them. If any man told me he wasn’t more involved because there were a lot of women, I cannot see that as anything other than an excuse.

And FWIW, I think in a lot of cases things are dominated by women because men haven’t stepped up.

Raging against it and insulting men is not going to change the nature of men which is to avoid doing what they perceive as girly stuff.

 

[FirstCalled]

You mean there are no laypeople in the sanctuary in the past?

haha, caught me on that one Constantine. IMHO, male altar servers have a clear path toward Priesthood and discernment.
However, with the NO mass and lectors, EMHCs I personally get the feeling that more and more people, both men and women, have a lesser understanding of the priestly role in the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass. With greater ability to take a part in the mass comes less of an incline toward pursuing a priestly role for the men I believe. It looses it’s appeal.
At least, that is the majority opinion of people I have spoken with in my church and surrounding churches.

 

[truoc]

As an abuse injected by the modernist enemies of the Church…meant to hurt the Liturgy…to weaken and cripple it. This abuse spiraled out of control until Rome capitulated and now we fast forward to today…Pretty successful if you ask me. And the worst part is that good meaning Catholic actively participate because they don’t know any better…the complain about the current state of The Church, yet simultaneously they are part of the reason for its decline.

How did the abuse start (or when I guess)? I really am curious because I’ve seen altar girls pretty much my entire life… never a lot, but a few.

 

[truoc]

False equality

I was just trying to point out it is a circular argument. While it might be true that boys are less inclined to be altar boys if there are altar girls, that couldn’t have been the original reason boys lost interest and girls were permitted.

Now another poster said it started as an abuse. If that’s the case, then my argument is false because my argument assumes there weren’t enough boys to fill the roles so it was open to all children.

 

[Monty61]

my DD25, :

Please explain what you mean by DD25. As a Navy vet, to me DD25 means the 25th destroyer (a type of ship, usually small, usually used to chase submarines, abbrieviated DD) . Obviously this is not how you mean it!

 

[jmcrae]

A smart parent would also point out that while women cannot be priests, there are more female Saints than male Saints. The goal is to go to heaven and become a Saint, not to fulfill one’s ego on earth.

Why do you assume that girls who serve at the Altar are doing so merely out of ego? How is it that simply being male causes one’s motives to be pure, but simply being female causes one’s motives to be selfish?

This seems very sexist, to me.

 

[kozlosap]

Please explain what you mean by DD25. As a Navy vet, to me DD25 means the 25th destroyer (a type of ship, usually small, usually used to chase submarines, abbrieviated DD) . Obviously this is not how you mean it!

I’m sorry! LOL - DD25 mean Dear Daughter aged 25! It’s just some shorthand that is used on many different forums! I understand how it can be very confusing!

 

[Milesius]

I was just trying to point out it is a circular argument. While it might be true that boys are less inclined to be altar boys if there are altar girls, that couldn’t have been the original reason boys lost interest and girls were permitted.

Now another poster said it started as an abuse. If that’s the case, then my argument is false because my argument assumes there weren’t enough boys to fill the roles so it was open to all children.

Girls were permitted before boys lost interest.

And back to my earlier point, it not just boys have lost interest because of altar girls, men in general have lost interest in nearly all forms of Christianity because it has become dominated by feminine values in most places.

 

[kozlosap]

Girls were permitted before boys lost interest.

And back to my earlier point, it not just boys have lost interest because of altar girls, men in general have lost interest in nearly all forms of Christianity because it has become dominated by feminine values in most places.

I guess I never learned at home, in school, in college or grad school that there were different moral values for men and women. Have there been different social expectations of the different sexes - of course, but as far as core values, I pray that we as humans strive to have the same values.

 

[Milesius]

I guess I never learned at home, in school, in college or grad school that there were different moral values for men and women. Have there been different social expectations of the different sexes - of course, but as far as core values, I pray that we as humans strive to have the same values.

First I didn’t say moral values, and I am not surprised you never learned that men and women react differently to different values in any of those places as the differences between the sexes have been buried and denied for the last 50 years.

People can object to what I say but until we recognise that there is a problem in Western Christianity were men are concerned Christianity will continue to die in the West.

Anyway the problem is too complex to go into here anyone interested should read a very good book about the topic called The Church Impotent by Leon Podles.

 

[JacktheCatholic]

Glory to Jesus Christ!

When I was Catholic, I was completely put off by the whole idea of altar girls. I am almost positive that one would not find them at a Tridentine Mass, but they are rather common amongst the Novus Ordo types. Does anyone think that altar girls will eventually lead to female deacons and eventually priests? I think it’s only a logical step (unless the practice is to completely cease, of course), but that it would most likely cause a schism in the Church of Rome.

Anyone have thoughts about this?

In Christ,
Andrew

At our church we only allow guys to be altar servers.

I attended a Mass where there were altar girls and my thoughts are that these girls are going to be very confused when they realize they will never be allowed to become a deacon or priest. I even told the Priest of that church that this is what my concerns are. The priest assured me that he teaches the altar servers that only men can be deacons and priests.

It is a shame really. Those girls should be boys or men that can discern as an altar server if they have a calling as a deacon or priest. And again it only causes the girls to be misled and others too. It seems we have priests that need a refresher course on the CCC.

 

[Dum_Spiro_Spero]

Exactly…women push for feminization of every aspect of our culture and even in our Church…what we are seeing today is the end result of that push. Loss in church memberhip, homosexuality running rampant, dead beat dads, dead beat husbands, loss of vocations, poor male role models, abortions, etc…They push and push for the feminization of all men and want to be included in everything that is exclusively all male…Well, the results stink and I think the proof is in the pudding as they say.

Girls were permitted before boys lost interest.

And back to my earlier point, it not just boys have lost interest because of altar girls, men in general have lost interest in nearly all forms of Christianity because it has become dominated by feminine values in most places.

 

[jmcrae]

I pray that we as humans strive to have the same values.

So do I.

I can’t think of a single “feminine value” - justice, temperance, beauty, cleanliness, moral purity - that ought not to be shared by any right-thinking Christian, male or female.

 

[jmcrae]

t is a shame really. Those girls should be boys or men that can discern as an altar server if they have a calling as a deacon or priest.

And just how exactly are they supposed to effect this change in themselves?

This is also the first time I’ve ever seen it suggested that the boys who serve at the Altar should only be permitted, if they sense a vocation to the diaconate or to the priesthood. The majority of the Alar servers I know are looking forward to start dating soon, and eventually to marry.

 

[Milesius]

So do I.

I can’t think of a single “feminine value” - justice, temperance, beauty, cleanliness, moral purity - that ought not to be shared by any right-thinking Christian, male or female.

Those are virtues not values.

A feminine value would be more along the lines of stressing emotions and personal relationships over a masculine value such as striving for excellence or success.

 

[kozlosap]

First I didn’t say moral values, and I am not surprised you never learned that men and women react differently to different values in any of those places as the differences between the sexes have been buried and denied for the last 50 years.

People can object to what I say but until we recognise that there is a problem in Western Christianity were men are concerned Christianity will continue to die in the West.

WOW, I’m sorry you used the word “values” and I interpreted it in the manner I was taught. Having been involved in teaching teenagers professionally and at church, I can assure you that in this world it is important that 'all" people regardless of gender hold the core values taught in the Ten Commandments as precious. When discussing men feeling left out of the Western Church, you are talking about something else entirely. The Western World has many faults, I grant you that, but a person makes the most of the cards he is dealt, or sits and whines about it. Find a community where men are venerated and women are taught to keep quiet. I certainly don’t think that Christianity is dying in the West - changing maybe, but not dying. How was the Church more masculine in 1910?

 

[Bluegoat]

Raging against it and insulting men is not going to change the nature of men which is to avoid doing what they perceive as girly stuff.

You don’t think a lot of men it seems. I don’t think I am the one insulting men. You are saying that they are incapable of seeing their religion as more than girly stuff, and of actually interacting with women; that they are shallow and immature.

 

[kozlosap]

Those are virtues not values.

A feminine value would be more along the lines of stressing emotions and personal relationships over a masculine value such as striving for excellence or success.

Sorry, I was away from computer and didn’t refresh the page, SO -

Where have you been for the last thirty years? More women are graduating from college and grad school and opening their own businesses than men. I consider that striving for excellence and success.