You caught us Catholics!!! It is repitition!!!

[jmcrae]

I became a servant when I believed on Jesus as my Lord and Savior.

So, everyone who believes in Jesus is a teacher of doctrine? Not according to St. Paul in I Corinthians 12.

Not just that… the Word of God states that as a “whosoever” I can also be SAVED.

Of course you can.

No need for a “magesterium” or Pope figure.

Jesus disagrees with you. Matthew 16:18; John 21:15-19.

Mar 13:34 [For the Son of man is] as a man taking a far journey, who left his house, and gave authority to his servants, and to every man his work, and commanded the porter to watch.

And who are these servants? (The appointed leaders of the Church.) And what house is this? (The Church.)

What would happen if one of the below-stairs servants appointed himself to be the porter, while the one appointed by the Master to be the porter was still doing that job? (Chaos would ensue.)

 

[jmcrae]

Mat 7:15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.

This one bears repeating.

Stay away from any self-appointed person who thinks he knows God’s will for your life. Listen only to the Catholic Church!

 

[believers]

So, everyone who believes in Jesus is a teacher of doctrine? Not according to St. Paul in I Corinthians 12.

Of course you can.

Jesus disagrees with you. Matthew 16:18; John 21:15-19.

And who are these servants? (The appointed leaders of the Church.) And what house is this? (The Church.)

What would happen if one of the below-stairs servants appointed himself to be the porter, while the one appointed by the Master to be the porter was still doing that job? (Chaos would ensue.)

Jesus disagrees with me? He said…

No, I’m not buying it… Petros and petra are different.

Mat 16:18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter (Petros), and upon this rock (petra) I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

Jhn 21:15 So when they had dined, Jesus saith to Simon Peter, Simon, [son] of Jonas, lovest thou me more than these? He saith unto him, Yea, Lord; thou knowest that I love thee. He saith unto him, Feed my lambs.

Jhn 21:16 He saith to him again the second time, Simon, [son] of Jonas, lovest thou me? He saith unto him, Yea, Lord; thou knowest that I love thee. He saith unto him, Feed my sheep.

Jhn 21:17 He saith unto him the third time, Simon, [son] of Jonas, lovest thou me? Peter was grieved because he said unto him the third time, Lovest thou me? And he said unto him, Lord, thou knowest all things; thou knowest that I love thee. Jesus saith unto him, Feed my sheep.

Jhn 21:18 Verily, verily, I say unto thee, When thou wast young, thou girdedst thyself, and walkedst whither thou wouldest: but when thou shalt be old, thou shalt stretch forth thy hands, and another shall gird thee, and carry [thee] whither thou wouldest not.

Jhn 21:19 This spake he, signifying by what death he should glorify God. And when he had spoken this, he saith unto him, Follow me.

 

[pete_29]

The Catholic Church has Prayed over, Meditated on, Thought about, Suffered for, and discussed the Word of God for nearly two thousand years and you want me to believe that you understand God better than the Church because of what you have learned in your lifetime. I just can’t see that happening, sorry.

 

[believers]

This one bears repeating.

Stay away from any self-appointed person who thinks he knows God’s will for your life. Listen only to the Catholic Church!

You mean stay away from churches that give the title of “Father” to their priests.

Your church has broken this rule.

Mat 23:9 And call no [man] your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven.

 

[RobHom]

I’ll be sure to build my faith on the Word of God so that I don’t fall into that category.

I certainly hope you do, but at the present time it would appear that you are not.

Mat 7:1 Judge not, that ye be not judged.

It would seen that you are a bit judgmental…

Mat 7:3 And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother’s eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye?

Uh-huh…

Mat 7:5 Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother’s eye.

Uh-huh…

Mat 7:13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide [is] the gate, and broad [is] the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:

Uh-huh… ditto~~~

Mat 7:15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.

And yet, considering all, especially that, you take the prideful and arrogant position that you are a “true prophet”, and deign it proper that we take your word at “face value” and discard all that we know to be true?

Tell me, are you of that “ilk” that believes you have the “mind of God”??? And are privileged to sit in judgment of others?

You do a lot of quoting of scriptures, but in reality say little of substance… sorry, but you need to reevaluate your position, and as well you need to reevaluate who you really are in the grander scheme of things.

You hypothesize this: Now that I am a servant… I now have the authority to preach the Gospel. Who and what gives you “authority”…??

 

[RobHom]

You mean stay away from churches that give the title of “Father” to their priests.

Your church has broken this rule.

Mat 23:9 And call no [man] your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven.

That boneless argument was slaughtered eons ago…

And you are redundantly proving your lack of understanding regarding “scriptures”… Care to try again?

 

[jmcrae]

Jesus disagrees with me? He said…

No, I’m not buying it… Petros and petra are different.

Mat 16:18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter (Petros), and upon this rock (petra) I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

No, since Jesus was not speaking Greek at the time. (The Greek edition of the Gospel of Matthew is not the Holy Spirit inspired version; it is only a translation.) He said, “Thou art Kepha and upon this Kepha I will my Church, and the gates of Hell will not prevail against it.”

Jhn 21:15 So when they had dined, Jesus saith to Simon Peter, Simon, [son] of Jonas, lovest thou me more than these? He saith unto him, Yea, Lord; thou knowest that I love thee. He saith unto him, Feed my lambs.

Jhn 21:16 He saith to him again the second time, Simon, [son] of Jonas, lovest thou me? He saith unto him, Yea, Lord; thou knowest that I love thee. He saith unto him, Feed my sheep.

Jhn 21:17 He saith unto him the third time, Simon, [son] of Jonas, lovest thou me? Peter was grieved because he said unto him the third time, Lovest thou me? And he said unto him, Lord, thou knowest all things; thou knowest that I love thee. Jesus saith unto him, Feed my sheep.

Jhn 21:18 Verily, verily, I say unto thee, When thou wast young, thou girdedst thyself, and walkedst whither thou wouldest: but when thou shalt be old, thou shalt stretch forth thy hands, and another shall gird thee, and carry [thee] whither thou wouldest not.

Jhn 21:19 This spake he, signifying by what death he should glorify God. And when he had spoken this, he saith unto him, Follow me.

Jesus made Peter to be the Chief Shepherd of the Church. (Should the sheep go off and form their own flocks, and elect each other to be their shepherds - sheep shepherding sheep - if they don’t happen to like the kind of grass that the shepherd is leading them to? )

 

[believers]

The Catholic Church has Prayed over, Meditated on, Thought about, Suffered for, and discussed the Word of God for nearly two thousand years and you want me to believe that you understand God better than the Church because of what you have learned in your lifetime. I just can’t see that happening, sorry.

The church is not an institution full of rituals, man-made traditions, pageantry, relics, man-made temples. It is an invisible body of believers abiding in the Word of God.

 

[RobHom]

Jesus disagrees with me? He said…

No he didn’t.

No, I’m not buying it… Petros and petra are different.

Mat 16:18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter (Petros), and upon this rock (petra) I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

You are a victim of “linguistic revisionism”. You’ll buy any line tossed to you that “validates” your leaving the Catholic Church, won’t you??

As to the rest of the scriptures you “quoted”… they were in the context little more than obfuscation of the issue…

Whats your real bone to pick?

 

[RobHom]

The church is not an institution full of rituals, man-made traditions, pageantry, relics, man-made temples. It is an invisible body of believers abiding in the Word of God.

I can see that you really don’t believe in what you claim to believe. Do you ever read the Bible?

 

[believers]

No, since Jesus was not speaking Greek at the time. (The Greek edition of the Gospel of Matthew is not the Holy Spirit inspired version; it is only a translation.) He said, “Thou art Kepha and upon this Kepha I will my Church, and the gates of Hell will not prevail against it.”

Jesus made Peter to be the Chief Shepherd of the Church. (Should the sheep go off and form their own flocks, and elect each other to be their shepherds - sheep shepherding sheep - if they don’t happen to like the kind of grass that the shepherd is leading them to? )

That means you cannot trust the Word of God. To you, it isn’t pure as God said it is. You must reason out your faith and add or change what the Word of God actually says. AS IT IS WRITTEN, The Word of God uses Petros and petra. God is not the author of confusion. You say Kepha and kepha. NOT AS IT IS WRITTEN. Are you seriously going to believe that? That is not in the Word of God

1Cr 14:33 For God is not [the author] of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.

Psa 119:140 Thy word [is] very pure: therefore thy servant loveth it.

Pro 30:5 Every word of God [is] pure: he [is] a shield unto them that put their trust in him.

Hbr 4:12 For the word of God [is] quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and [is] a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

 

[believers]

I can see that you really don’t believe in what you claim to believe. Do you ever read the Bible?

Then I invite you to reproof me with the Word of God.

 

[jmcrae]

You mean stay away from churches that give the title of “Father” to their priests.

While we’re at it, what about that heretic who called Abraham “Father” … oh, wait, that was Jesus.

Your church has broken this rule.

When Jesus gave this teaching, He said, Call no one your father, call no one your teacher, call no one your Rabbi, call no one your master.

Did He mean that we are to generate ourselves physically and spiritually from nothing? That we should not go to school or learn how to read and write? That we should not study to know our religion? That we should not be taught a trade, in order to make a living?

No.

He did not mean that no one can fulfill these roles in our lives, but rather, only to remember that, every human father is also a son; every human master is also an apprentice; every human teacher is also a student; and every human Rabbi is also a member of the congregation. He did not mean that these titles were to be abolished from our vocabulary, nor that people could not still be called by these titles.

Mat 23:9 And call no [man] your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven.

Our Father in Heaven is the Source of our being who has no source (father) of His own - the uncreated Creator.

 

[pete_29]

Jesus disagrees with me? He said…

No, I’m not buying it… Petros and petra are different.

Mat 16:18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter (Petros), and upon this rock (petra) I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

Jhn 21:15 So when they had dined, Jesus saith to Simon Peter, Simon, [son] of Jonas, lovest thou me more than these? He saith unto him, Yea, Lord; thou knowest that I love thee. He saith unto him, Feed my lambs.

Jhn 21:16 He saith to him again the second time, Simon, [son] of Jonas, lovest thou me? He saith unto him, Yea, Lord; thou knowest that I love thee. He saith unto him, Feed my sheep.

Jhn 21:17 He saith unto him the third time, Simon, [son] of Jonas, lovest thou me? Peter was grieved because he said unto him the third time, Lovest thou me? And he said unto him, Lord, thou knowest all things; thou knowest that I love thee. Jesus saith unto him, Feed my sheep.

Jhn 21:18 Verily, verily, I say unto thee, When thou wast young, thou girdedst thyself, and walkedst whither thou wouldest: but when thou shalt be old, thou shalt stretch forth thy hands, and another shall gird thee, and carry [thee] whither thou wouldest not.

Jhn 21:19 This spake he, signifying by what death he should glorify God. And when he had spoken this, he saith unto him, Follow me.

Jesus wasn’t Greek, so He wouldn’t have used the words petros and petra, He would have used the Aramaic equivelent which was kepha? wasn’t it? So the petros petra argument is irrelevant.

 

[believers]

While we’re at it, what about that heretic who called Abraham “Father” … oh, wait, that was Jesus.

When Jesus gave this teaching, He said, Call no one your father, call no one your teacher, call no one your Rabbi, call no one your master.

Did He mean that we are to generate ourselves physically and spiritually from nothing? That we should not go to school or learn how to read and write? That we should not study to know our religion? That we should not be taught a trade, in order to make a living?

No.

He did not mean that no one can fulfill these roles in our lives, but rather, only to remember that, every human father is also a son; every human master is also an apprentice; every human teacher is also a student; and every human Rabbi is also a member of the congregation. He did not mean that these titles were to be abolished from our vocabulary, nor that people could not still be called by these titles.

Our Father in Heaven is the Source of our being who has no source (father) of His own - the uncreated Creator.

Oh wait a minute… I specifically said a church giving the title of “Father” to their priests. I’m not talking about you or I calling someone father. I’m talking about the Vatican handing out titles of “Father” so and so.

Mat 23:1 Then spake Jesus to the multitude, and to his disciples,

Mat 23:2 Saying, The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses’ seat:

Mat 23:3 All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, [that] observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not.

Mat 23:4 For they bind heavy burdens and grievous to be borne, and lay [them] on men’s shoulders; but they [themselves] will not move them with one of their fingers.

Mat 23:5 But all their works they do for to be seen of men: they make broad their phylacteries, and enlarge the borders of their garments,

Mat 23:6 And love the uppermost rooms at feasts, and the chief seats in the synagogues,

Mat 23:7 And greetings in the markets, and to be called of men, Rabbi, Rabbi.

Mat 23:8 But be not ye called Rabbi: for one is your Master, [even] Christ; and all ye are brethren.

Mat 23:9 And call no [man] your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven.

 

[pete_29]

The church is not an institution full of rituals, man-made traditions, pageantry, relics, man-made temples. It is an invisible body of believers abiding in the Word of God.

Evidently your church is because you’re using man made interpretations to justify your position.

 

[RobHom]

“believers”… Right about now, you should be aware that you are treading on a very slippery slope, wearing smooth bottomed shoes on a slanted and oiled glass surface.

The reason I say this…is because all you have done and are doing thus far is winding yourself up and parroting, aka regurgitating, the same old pablum that others before you have done. Nothing new, nothing that has stood the test of time, and certainly nothing with any merit or proof to it beyond your opinion. And most certainly nothing that supersedes the writings of the Early Christian Fathers or the Bible.

You have resorted to making attacks as thinly veiled inflammatory remarks that bear no truth whatsoever.

You have been asked questions, all of which you have ignored. That little ? at the end of a sentence means you have been questioned. Is there a problem answering, or is it that you know that you are on the slippery slope and losing altitude rapidly?

There is not one iota of what you have presented that bears a mote of substance, so the only thing that you are presently accomplishing is helping Catholics who have kept the faith to do so even more ardently. Thank you!!

 

[NonCatholic]

Revelation 5:8 When He had taken the book, the four living creatures and the twenty-four elders fell down before the Lamb, each one holding a harp and golden bowls full of incense, which are the prayers of the saints.

Explain these prayers.

It is the prayers of all the saints through all the ages. It is difficult to explain here, but if all the prayers for the return of Christ were put into a box for storage until a later time, then this would be when the box was opened because the time is here for the return of Christ. Here is a link on this passage that may help and much greater detail.
gty.org/Resources/Sermons/66-22

Revelation 6:9-11: I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain because of the word of God and the testimony they had maintained. They called out in a loud voice, “How long, Sovereign Lord, holy and true, until you judge the inhabitants of the earth and avenge our blood?” Then each of them was given a white robe, and they were told to wait a little longer.

This shows that those who have died are at least somewhat aware of what is happening on earth. Since they now share in God’s glory (Romans 8:17), it doesn’t surprise me.

It may be that, but I believe it is more like you haven’t got your body yet and it’s been a while, when Lord when?

I really appreciate you for bringing these versus to the forefront…good work! Also, Revelation at least starting at chapter 4 are speaking of future events for the most part. Revelation is the only book in the Bible that comes with a promise of a blessing explicitly, although I believe it is all a blessing, but I find it interesting and very challenging because some of it seems obvious, but a lot is mind boggling…something I look forward to understanding better as I continue my study of the Word.

God bless you friend!

 

[jmcrae]

That means you cannot trust the Word of God. To you, it isn’t pure as God said it is. You must reason out your faith and add or change what the Word of God actually says. AS IT IS WRITTEN, The Word of God uses Petros and petra. God is not the author of confusion. You say Kepha and kepha. NOT AS IT IS WRITTEN. Are you seriously going to believe that? That is not in the Word of God

Yes it is. The Greek is only a translation. The original Holy Spirit inspired words were the very words spoken by Christ at that moment in Aramaic - Kepha, and kepha.

Or are you making an idol of the Bible, and saying that what is made of ink and paper has greater authority than Christ Himself? :ehh:

1Cr 14:33 For God is not [the author] of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.

Psa 119:140 Thy word [is] very pure: therefore thy servant loveth it.

The word is Jesus; it is not the ink and paper of today’s modern Bible.

Pro 30:5 Every word of God [is] pure: he [is] a shield unto them that put their trust in him.

Again, this word is God’s spoken word to the community as a whole; it is not the ink and paper of the Bible. (Keep in mind, when the Psalms were first being sung, not one word of the Scriptures had yet been written down. Genesis began to be written more than a thousand years after they began to sing the Psalms.)

Hbr 4:12 For the word of God [is] quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and [is] a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

And again, this is the Person of Jesus; not the ink and paper of our modern day Bible.