LeafByNiggle
Well-known member
Correction: “this thread indicates” → “this thread claims”.
25 unarmed Whites and only 14 unarmed Blacks were fatally shot by police in 2019. Do the data suggest that police deserve an apology from those who vi
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MikeInVA
Guest
It’s missing all of the children lost to abortion.
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pnewton
Guest
That must have been someone else. I just posted some data, not so much for you, but some might see value in it.
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pnewton
Guest
A thread is not a person, nor can it indicate something. Some posters here claim BLM narrative is a big scam, but I have found that has happened from the beginning. Heck, there have been people denying any racism my whole life, so that is nothing new.
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MikeInVA
Guest
It was the chart you posted.
And I’ve tried to explain that the data do not support your conclusions.
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1cthlctrth
Guest
The good thing is that we have people like Josh Hawley who are trying to make it up to police for the misinformation and dishonest attacks made against them.
LeafByNiggle
Well-known member
I wonder if Sen. Hawley’s bill would provide funds to police departments who transition some of their officers into social workers? Same officers, just different directives and training. They can still be called “police” so they are technically not defunding the police or laying anyone off.
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1cthlctrth
Guest
If a woman is being violently raped or attacked, I don’t think calling a social worker is the answer. If your house is invaded by a thief, you’re not calling a social worker to scare away the invader. We need armed, strong police who will STOP the crime.
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LeafByNiggle
Well-known member
There will still be 90% of the police force ready to deal with that. But let’s have 10% of the police budget go to deescalation training and to managing the mentally ill. That takes social work skills, not gunslinger skills.LeafByNiggle:
If a woman is being violently raped or attacked, I don’t think calling a social worker is the answer.
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Nepperhan
Guest
How much have you seen statements by police groups condemning police brutality? On the contrary, what one sees the most is police unions making excuses for even the most egregious conduct.
Sometimes you see black officers admitting that there is racism in the ranks, but what’s the official police line?
Now you see the difference.
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1cthlctrth
Guest
Black Lives Matter wants to defund the police, but most Black Americans like their law-enforcement presence the way it is.
A Gallup poll released Wednesday found that 61% of Black adults surveyed want police to spend the same amount of time in their area, and 20% want them to invest more time. Only 19% said they wanted police to spend less time in their community.
“This is similar to the 67% of all U.S. adults preferring the status quo, including 71% of White Americans,” said the poll’s analysis.
In other words, those who work towards defunding the police are acting AGAINST what most African-Americans desire.
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Nepperhan
Guest
What do black leaders say about defunding the police?
LeafByNiggle
Well-known member
Wrong. The survey shows they want police to spend the same or more time in their neighborhoods. That does not mean they like the way the police are behaving.
Wrong again. Those who work toward defunding the police are working to put more of the public safety presence (as opposed to the current kind of police presence) in their neighborhoods.
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1cthlctrth
Guest
Clearly, defunding the police would result in police spending LESS time in their neighborhoods. That’s why we need INCREASED police funding.
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Rockoh22
Guest
This is Why, so many people argue. This are two different topic in the same venue.
Many people want more police. What drives the narrative? The Media. The media wants to drive a narrative and change the mentality I guess.
If we want more police, why is the media so focus on defunding?
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otjm
Guest
I can’t speak for other jurisdictions, but in Portland, the District Attorney has said that the great majority of arrests are simply being turned out into the street and will not be prosecuted. As the Federal Courthouse was under attack, federal agents were sent to Portland, which raised a hue and cry from the Democratic mayor and city council and the Democratic governor. They were replaced with some State police, who pulled out not long after, in large part to the DA’s refusal to prosecute.
Riots continued, and the Governor announced that she was sending in the sheriffs’ departments of the two neighboring counties - Clackamas and Washington. Both sheriffs immediately responded that a) she had not spoken with them prior to her statement, and b) neither were going to assist Portland police as the DA would not prosecute those whom the deputies might arrest. She has control of none of the sheriff departments - they are overseen by the counties.
Since then, the State police have been sent back, and interestingly, those who have been sent back are deputized federally. So the people they arrest will be charged for federal crimes, and she has no say over that either; she can withdraw them, or have those “hated Feds” doing the work the county DA won’t do.
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otjm
Guest
Perhaps you have not seen the movement to remove partial immunity from the police.
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otjm
Guest
The defunding argument has been proposed (demanded is a closer term) by both BLM and Antifa. While the majority of the news media soft pedals the Marxist background of BLM, it has little to say of the Marxist thread running through the allegedly “highly decentralized movement”.
It should come as no surprise that as far back as the 1920’s Communist literature put race wars as a central means of overturning the US.
And while Antifa allegedly is against fascists, they use fascist tactics in their protest and riot moves. The great majority of the news media has moved significantly from news reporting to editorializing stories which meet their apparent agenda, which is leftist in direction.
I do not know of any peer reviewed studies of policing which show that having fewer police on the streets results in lower crime rates. Every peer reviewed study of policing has shown that more police on the streets results in lower crime.
The major cities which have taken up the cry of “defund the police” appear to all have a majority of Democrats on their council, as well as Democratic mayors; and it is anybody’s guess as to how many of those members are somewhere between far left and outright Marxist (Seattle has at least one council member who is openly Marxist). Others appear to be running on emotion rather than logic. It would be a terrible cost to the citizens of these cities to have the police defunded as crime will increase exponentially; but it may take a defunding of the police to get the citizens of each community to wake up and realize what they have voted for, intentionally or not. And if matters get bad enough, it may be near impossible to return to anything near normalcy.
None of which is to say that all police departments could not use better training and tactics. Where emphasis needs to be is a critical component of any such discussions. Camden N/J went with a major change in policing and the results appear to have had an impact on crime; allegations that the city is mired in corruption is a separate issue; but they put more police on the street, and at least for several years, it appeared to be having a positive impact on reducing crime (drugs being a primary driver in the past). But Camden put more police on the street, and made major changes in their objectives; the other side of the coin was a serious reduction in pay and benefits, which led to a “revolving door” as police entered and stayed for a period of time and then moved to other jurisdictions with higher pay and benefits. (continued)
LeafByNiggle
Well-known member
The defunding efforts are not the invention of the media. The media is just reporting what people say.
LeafByNiggle
Well-known member
No, it would result a different kind of police spending more time in the neighborhoods - the kind that fosters public safety instead of fear.LeafByNiggle:
Clearly, defunding the police would result in police spending LESS time in their neighborhoods. That’s why we need INCREASED police funding.
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