Are couples so selfish these days that they won't have kids

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My grandmother never had children, she’s my mother’s aunt, whom raised her…My grandmother met my grandfather-God rest him- and a month later were married. They had a great marriage, she was a party animal he was her pleaser!!! He adored everything about her because she complimented him on the shy man he was, so everything crazy my grandmother is, was back then as well, well he loved about her…He couldn’t get enough of her party animal life and her love for life, her dancing, her screaming, her drunkness, her wildness, her outgoingness, lol, everything…Obviously he would have never pleased her so much if it weren’t true!! He was the kindnest man ever…My mother remembers him so much!! AND loves him so much. He passed when she was only 15…very sad…

But they wanted children so badly!! But my gradnmother wouldn’t listen to her doctors…She had 6-8 miscarriages…Something like that…All because she was supposed to be in bedrest and never listened! She couldn’t stand not having a life, not being out with her friends, etc…But through it all my grandfather-God rest him- Loved her and never stopped loving her…and to him my mother was more than enough for a child! She was beloved and enjoyed very much by him, he pleased her like any father would please his daughter…to tell you she was terribly spoiled, and then she wonders where my daughter gets it from?! 🤷

I don’t think GOD intended my grandmother to have children, but for almost 8 or so children to be taken like that? Hurts me to think and GOD forgive me for this, that my grandmother was a bit selfish…But that was GOD’s will and I guess those tiny tots are in heaven with their father…

And I think it was the best because my mother was an orphan, grew up with her grandmother, and then lived from house to house with all of her aunts and then the one I call grandmother…My real grandmother, or my mom’s mother, was always too ill to take care of her, after my mom was born, since she’s the eldest, my grandmother got pg with the next one, as soon as she was out of post-partum, my grandfather-GOD rest him as well- got busy making sure GOD’s gift of children didn’t go to waste!! But in the midst of it all they denied the rights to their first born to enjoy family time, mother/daughter father/daughter time…Causing her a bit of pain and resentment that everyone else could call their parents mom and dad and she would call them aunt and uncle…Towards her late teen years and until she got married with my dad then she started calling my grandmother mom, but she always called my grandmother’s husband-God rest him- dad always, because to her that was her father and he loved her more than life itself!!

I don’t know if my grandmother’s situation would qualify as too greedy or selfish even but I just wanted to add that in there…I love my grandmother soooo much she means the world to me, but I just wanted to share this unfortunate thing and even though I am not her real granddaughter, I love her and she loves me as one and has always treated me like so!! 😃
 
CradleCath said:
Perhaps the opportunity to marry never came your way, perhaps you are a chaste person with SSA…If eiher of these scenarios describe you…I understand your need for a happy life without
a spouse & children. However, writing such a bitter post belies your claim of a full & happy existence. Happy people don’t post in such a hateful way.
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SeekerJen said:
There’s also the fact that many of us who cannot have children tell ourselves that we’re okay without them, that our lives are good, look at all the things we wouldn’t be able to do if we had the kids- mainly to keep ourselves calm and sane because if we dwelt on our grief and the unfairness of it all, we might not be able to function.
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Seeker, I SO agree with you. I have “landed” in a marriage with a man who is suffering from severe “anxiety” (read: selfishness) that he hid from me before the wedding. I DESPERATELY want to have children, and know now that this dream - along with being part of a loving, accepting family - is thoroughly shattered. I am 36. He doesn’t want kids, anyway. He doesn’t even want to spend time with me. He has his own room. He “portions out” 30 min a day to be with me and won’t sleep near me.

With the holidays approaching (and my sibiling expecting their second child) - I am struggling to continue breathing. Have I mentioned that my dear sibling has left the Catholic church and refuses to have the children baptized? I HURT SO BAD. Oh, please help me. When I compare this situation to my own, I am so SAD that I held out for “a good Catholic man”.

And a thorough and severe reprimand to the OP, who, perhaps unintentionally, has come off as the judgemental and self-righteous type of person who has probably been loved and cared for their whole life. They probably throw away more happiness in a single day than I have ever known my entire life. If they for a second EVER felt used, duped, unloved, forgotten and abandonded like I have for the last 20 years, they would sing a different tune. Especially when all the people in my life are “rubbing my nose” in their cascading overflow of life and love at this time of year…

Sorry, I’m bitter and in need of ALOT of comforting and repair. Please send prayers and love.
 
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TigerKitty:
I have “landed” in a marriage with a man who is suffering from severe “anxiety” (read: selfishness) that he hid from me before the wedding. I DESPERATELY want to have children, and know now that this dream - along with being part of a loving, accepting family - is thoroughly shattered. I am 36. He doesn’t want kids, anyway. He doesn’t even want to spend time with me. He has his own room. He “portions out” 30 min a day to be with me and won’t sleep near me.
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TigerKitty my heart goes out to you - how someone could be so cruel as to mislead a future spouse about such basic features of marrage is beyond me. Did he unrealistically think all would change on marriage. Wonder what he thought he’d get out of marraige - the advantages of being single plus those of being married.

In my 20’s and 30’s when I said I didn’t want to have children I was told it would all change when you hold your own. In my 40’s I was told the same thing when I said I wouldn’t be marrying. I was arrogant to them in knowing myself well enough not to take the risk of things NOT changing and self-centered enough to know I didn’t want to.

Thank goodness I was always honest about my intentions re children and marriage - in some people’s view this has been as selfish but marrying without intending to be a good spouse is really selfish.
With the holidays approaching (and my sibiling expecting their second child) - I am struggling to continue breathing. Have I mentioned that my dear sibling has left the Catholic church and refuses to have the children baptized? I HURT SO BAD. Oh, please help me. When I compare this situation to my own, I am so SAD that I held out for “a good Catholic man”.
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While Christmas and other celebrations can be great for some people for others than can be hell. I think that how we feel about them is influenced by our experiences - I find it hard to go to Christmas parties where there has been tension throughout the year and pretend all is well.

Maybe you need to think about spending some of the holidays not with your husband or relatives but with people who affirm you or people you could help. They won’t be able to give you what you hope your husband relatives will but if they are supportive they may make you feel better about yourself. This would be more important if you are feeling “I should have known what he would be like.” Like women who have been battered in other ways eg physically sometimes there were no clues before it hapened. You are not expected to have second sight.
Sorry, I’m bitter and in need of ALOT of comforting and repair. Please send prayers and love.
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Of course after your experiences you need conforting and repair. I’d be more concerned if you were a box of birds. For some reason going on a retreat comes to mind - maybe because I would be thinking of doing that in a situation where I am stretched to breaking.

Lots of love

Salonika
 
selfishness has nothing to do with it

i know I do not want children but I commend those who do

dont demonize childless couples I am kinda tired of hearing this same old
 
David_Balmer said:
I have been thinking lately of how blessed me and my wife are wih our 2 sons and some times it makes me ponder the question of people who we know who won’t have childern at all and this makes me sad for them because I don’t think they undertand what they are missing out on.
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Pray for them. You never know, maybe they can’t concieve.
Maybe they are not following church teaching on contraception.
Maybe they are and are very sad they don’t have any children.
Infertility clinics are making big money on people who are trying to concieve.
 
tilly1 said:
selfishness has nothing to do with it

i know I do not want children but I commend those who do

dont demonize childless couples I am kinda tired of hearing this same old
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I don’t know how anyone is being demonized here. You are not a catholic, so therefore you don’t have to worry about being open to children if you are sacramentally married in the catholic church.
Stop judging others for what they believe. Do your own thing, of course. But, don’t claim anyone is being demonized.
When you become a catholic, you are aware this is something you must agree to. Don’t like it? Don’t become a catholic.
No one has a gun to your head.
 
Originally posted by David Balmer - I have been thinking lately of how blessed me and my wife are with our 2 sons and some times it makes me ponder the question of people who we know who won’t have childern at all and this makes me sad for them because I don’t think they understand what they are missing out on.

I understand and appreciate the the thought and feeling behind this point of view. And yes, there will be people who decided not to have children who will regret this decision and there will be some who will regret making the opposite decision.

There are some of us (male and female) who made the decision not to (marry and) have children who have not regretted this as we knew having children was not for us. What some of us would have had was a profound sadness that our children would have had a parent who would not have been able to give them the best start in life.
 
People have their own reasons for marrying or not, and becoming parents or not.

Judgmentalism and name calling are quite inappropriate in private matters such as this.

Because I did not feel called to parenthood, marriage was something I did not seek. Because the challenges of marriage and children were too daunting to me, I remained a bachelor.

Is it selfish to not do something that could not be done well?

With my own eyes, I have seen many unfit parents. Pressure to have children, results in people who ought best be childless, instead having kids.

What benefit to society, from people who do not want children, becoming parents?
 
Magickman said:
People have their own reasons for marrying or not, and becoming parents or not.

Judgmentalism and name calling are quite inappropriate in private matters such as this.

Because I did not feel called to parenthood, marriage was something I did not seek. Because the challenges of marriage and children were too daunting to me, I remained a bachelor.

Is it selfish to not do something that could not be done well?

With my own eyes, I have seen many unfit parents. Pressure to have children, results in people who ought best be childless, instead having kids.

What benefit to society, from people who do not want children, becoming parents?
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I don’t think that anyone here is criticizing those who don’t have the desire for children, who, thus refrain from marriage. Marriage, just like the religious life and chaste and celebate single life, is a calling. It’s okay to be neither married nor be a religious. There are plenty who are called to the single life and remain chaste and faithful in that call.

It’s those who ARE married who INTENTIONALLY (without health reasons) refrain from having children who this thread is in regards to. The OP didn’t distinctly outline that fact, but many of us understood that he was talking about those who CHOSE marriage and then REFUSE to even attempt to have children and are OUTSPOKEN about that decision. I applaud you for being honest and thus following God and not your possible “desires of the flesh”. 👍
 
TigerKitty said:
Seeker, I SO agree with you. I have “landed” in a marriage with a man who is suffering from severe “anxiety” (read: selfishness) that he hid from me before the wedding. I DESPERATELY want to have children, and know now that this dream - along with being part of a loving, accepting family - is thoroughly shattered. I am 36. He doesn’t want kids, anyway. He doesn’t even want to spend time with me. He has his own room. He “portions out” 30 min a day to be with me and won’t sleep near me.

With the holidays approaching (and my sibiling expecting their second child) - I am struggling to continue breathing. Have I mentioned that my dear sibling has left the Catholic church and refuses to have the children baptized? I HURT SO BAD. Oh, please help me. When I compare this situation to my own, I am so SAD that I held out for “a good Catholic man”.

And a thorough and severe reprimand to the OP, who, perhaps unintentionally, has come off as the judgemental and self-righteous type of person who has probably been loved and cared for their whole life. They probably throw away more happiness in a single day than I have ever known my entire life. If they for a second EVER felt used, duped, unloved, forgotten and abandonded like I have for the last 20 years, they would sing a different tune. Especially when all the people in my life are “rubbing my nose” in their cascading overflow of life and love at this time of year…

Sorry, I’m bitter and in need of ALOT of comforting and repair. Please send prayers and love.
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I don’t know if you’ve spoken with a priest, but his not entering the marriage with the intent to procreate could be a grave reason to consider your marriage invalid. That’s a BIGGIE in what is required for a sacramental and/or valid marriage that occurs within the Church.
 
Obviously, you and your husband should have worked out this issue BEFORE you got married. But how exactly is not having kids considered “selfish”? What are your reasons for wanting children, and don’t you think you’re being the selfish one for trying to impose them on him? Catholic priests can’t get married or have children, does that make them selfish? The act of having children can itself be selfish especially when poor parenting creates many long term problems for both the children themselves and society at large. The decision to become a parent is often based on characteristically “selfish” and egotistical motives. The fact is that not everybody is meant to be a parent and not everybody would be happy with having to look after kids. Also, there are already 6.5 billion people on the planet consuming natural resources at an alarming rate, is that not enough for you?

CHILDFREE 4 LIFE !!
 
Except for the fact that most of the countries doing the consuming (with the exception of China) have very low populations and birth rates. The countries doing the least consuming are the ones where people have 10 kids, hoping that three of them will survive and everyone is starving and living under an unjust government that prevents them from improving their situation. You also have the problem of girls in those countries being married as soon as they start their menses and having child after child until they die or hit menopause. Seriously, educate the women, they won’t marry so young and they won’t have as many kids or be subject to a marriage not of their choice.

And not having kids if married is selfish because it means “having your cake and eating it too” with regards to the sex act.
 
sanctamaria17 said:
And not having kids if married is selfish because it means “having your cake and eating it too” with regards to the sex act.
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And how exactly are you supposed to eat your cake if you can’t have it? I’m sure you believe everything the church tells you just because it claims to interpret the will of Gawd, but the belief that sex and marriage only exist for the sake of producing kids has no rational basis in either biology or social ethics. It’s just a belief that may have served a useful purpose in pre-modern times back when infant mortality rates were high and everybody needed to produce as many kids as possible to do the chores, work the farms, protect their villages, work the local factories, and help look after their elders when they got old. But nowadays with our huge populations, children are actually a burden on both environmental and social resources, and are not always an asset.
 
Logic316 said:
And how exactly are you supposed to eat your cake if you can’t have it? I’m sure you believe everything the church tells you just because it claims to interpret the will of Gawd, but the belief that sex and marriage only exist for the sake of producing kids has no rational basis in either biology or social ethics. It’s just a belief that may have served a useful purpose in pre-modern times back when infant mortality rates were high and everybody needed to produce as many kids as possible to do the chores, work the farms, protect their villages, work the local factories, and help look after their elders when they got old. But nowadays with our huge populations, children are actually a burden on both environmental and social resources, and are not always an asset.
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Wow, how little you understand about the economic conditions around the world as a result of decreased populations. And the falacy regarding the “environment”. But, if you’re all for decreasing the “environmental” problems, then I’m sure you’ll be happy to pay for the heating of my “green” home (I bought it not because it’s “green” but because the price was right). My heating bill is still high even though I have top notch insulation and windows and doors.
 
sanctamaria17 said:
And not having kids if married is selfish because it means “having your cake and eating it too” with regards to the sex act.
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Careful. Those of us who cannot biologically have children are not required by the Church to adopt children, nor are we automatically selfish if we choose, after deliberation and prayer, not to adopt. I will assume the best and assume that you were referring to couples of normal fertility.
 
SeekerJen said:
Careful. Those of us who cannot biologically have children are not required by the Church to adopt children, nor are we automatically selfish if we choose, after deliberation and prayer, not to adopt. I will assume the best and assume that you were referring to couples of normal fertility.
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Yes, I believe that is who they were referring to. People who choose not to have children because it would be too much trouble for them, don’t want to have to bother with anyone other then themselves.
 
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