Bible

[Psalm45_9]

Pax Vobis Cvm!

YAQUBOS:

ONLY a prophet of God ( an inspired man of God ) can speak the Word of God! SCRIPTURAL inspiration ceased in Israel ( as Maccabees also testifies )

No it does not, it states that God the Father was not speaking directly to anyone. It does not say that God the Holy Spirit was not working. There is the miracle of the oil that the Jews commemorate at Hanukah, as did our Lord. There is the Divine intervention of the Angels at the Temple and the entire Maccabean revolt would not have been successful if God was not working in Israel.

YAQUBOS:

from the last prophet until Jesus Christ, just like it ceased after the last Apostle! So no one was able to write Scripture since the time of the last prophet until Jesus Christ, just as you can’t write now Scripture even if you are inspired by God!

Didn’t I ask you why we can’t add our hymns to the Scripture? What did you answer? You said:

My answer is correct.

YAQUBOS:

So those who wrote Maccabees couldn’t write the divine truth. They could only write ABOUT the divine truth!!!

That implies that Divine Revelation ceased before Christ came, meaning Jesus is not the Christ!!! HERESY!!!

YAQUBOS:

As we saw, the Holy Spirit writes through the prophets ( inspired men of God ).

Esther is a prophetess? The author of 1 & 2 Chronicles is a prophet?

YAQUBOS:

The Holy Spirit doesn’t write a book in heaven and then throw it to the earth, as Muslims believe about their Qur’an

AMEN! The Holy Spirit in the Bishops determined which writings are scripture!

 

[Psalm45_9]

Pax Vobis Cvm!

YAQUBOS:

Do you mean to deny the third point of the DIVINE CANON with this question??? Can’t Jesus Christ REVEAL a truth? I am not saying that He is indeed revealing a truth; we can talk about the Mosaic Law in another thread, and there we can study this. But for this thread: can’t our Lord reveal a truth that was not revealed in the Old Testament?

The Holy Spirit can’t determine what is the Old Testament?

YAQUBOS:

So what is your point here? Do you mean to deny the 3rd point of the DIVINE CANON by that question?

Not at all, it just shows that the Holy Spirit can reveal truths that are not explicitly mentioned in the Bible.

The deuterocanonicals tell the truth, the resurrection is a reality!

Pax Vobis Cvm!

YAQUBOS:

Ooooh! A great mistake you did, Psalm45:9!!! The author of Maccabees is not saying that he is not polished, but he says that he DOESN’T KNOW if it is well told or not!!!

No, it states that he doesn’t know if his writing style is good or not. Example: The day was hot, the sky was clear, butterflies flew, I was happy.

vs.

The sun’s rays were intense, butterflies fluttered across the smooth silky sky, my heart leaped with joy.

Which one sounds better? Well it’s a matter of the critic who is reading it. Both, however, tell the same story.

YAQUBOS:

This shows that he doesn’t have the power and authority of God.

It said nothing of the sort, it referred to the style of writing. Not the accuracy of the narration. Come on, he got his information from a five volume book written by Jason of Cyrene.

YAQUBOS:

While Paul is always clearly saying that he is talking plain and right things in an unskilled speech!

And the author of 2nd Maccabees was refering to his writing style, while St. Paul is concerned if he is speaking good. You’re objection, is no objection at all.

YAQUBOS:

You misunderstood and you made a big mistake! The problem is not in the mediocrity of the speech, but in the ignorance of the author and his declaration “that was the best I could do”, showing that he is doing all that by his own power. While Paul was clearly saying that he is speaking by divine inspiration and power.

Your ignorance is showing. Anyway, I don’t think the multiple psalmists knew that some of their psalms are prophecies, the Holy Spirit works in mysterious ways.

YAQUBOS:

And as Maccabees is clearly declaring that it is not written by a prophet, so we understand the ignorance and incertitude of the author.

Nor was Esther of 1 & 2 Chronicles. So the author is not declaring ignorance, he is saying if you don’t like how I wrote, that’s the best I could do.

 

[Psalm45_9]

Pax Vobis Cvm!

YAQUBOS:

The Septuagint is not one volume.

That I already knew.

YAQUBOS:

So the Apostles were able to use volumes from the Septuagint without accepting the human writings that they didn’t accept as Scripture.

A possibiltiy, but given that many of the Church Fathers accepted them leads me to believe the Apostles did not reject them. If they did then none of the Church Fathers would have considered them scripture.

I agree.

YAQUBOS:

By the way: do you know when were the Old Testament books translated in the Saptuagint for the first time? I mean, do you know when they began to translate? And do you know when was the first human writing that you call deuterocanonical written?

Some scholars have placed the LXX translation around 150 BC., but it is debatable. The Deuterocanonicals were written between 200 BC and 150 BC. The books in your Old Testament are called the Protocanonicals, meaning first canon, because the majority of the church readily accepted these books. The books that are being talked about in this thread are called Deuterocanonical, meaning second canon, because they were not officially accepted by the majority of the church as part of the canon, until the canon was formally declared at the Council of Rome. The New Testament also has Protocanonicals and Deuterocanonicals. The Book of Revelation is a New Testament Deuterocanonical, because it was one of the last books to be accepted as part of the New Testament by the church majority.

YAQUBOS:

Jesus Christ didn’t come to Ethiopia… And in the time of the Lord, there were Books IN ISRAEL that were used as Scripture.

With the Baptism of the Ethiopian Eunuch, the Gospel and the Holy Spirit came to Ethiopia. At the time of Christ, there were two political parties. The Saducees only saw the Torah as scripture, whereas the Pharisees saw a canon similar to yours as scripture. So at the time of Christ, the canon was not determined.

YAQUBOS:

The Lord didn’t add any book and He didn’t blame them for adding any book. Jesus Christ has the authority!

He gave that authority to the Church, the true people of God.

YAQUBOS:

Not those Jews who wanted to doubt even after Jesus Christ came!!

Exactly. With regards to adding books, the church never did, the books already existed, and the church determined which ones were scripture at the council of Rome.

YAQUBOS:

So don’t quote me refusing human authority! I am talking here about ONE point of those five points of the DIVINE CANON, and I am talking about the REAL People of God, and not the unbelieving Jews who still doubted what the Canon is even after the Lord came!

I’m talking about the real people of God too, the Church, which determined which existing writings were scripture.

 

[Psalm45_9]

Continuing solely by his grace!

YAQUBOS:

And the bad thing is that you are quoting me saying the same thing that I said here right now: "And many Jews deny that Jesus is the Christ! Must we believe that also? ( I say this SUPPOSING that what you say about the Jews is true )

Why do you insist on human authorities?"

Yes! I am talking about the REAL People of God, the REAL Israel, and not those who denied the Lord! And remember that we are talking here about ONE point of that DIVINE CANON! Talking about ONE point doesn’t mean insisting on human authority!

AMEN! I’m talking about the real people of God too. The Holy Spirit was in the Bishops (making the prophets, according to point 1) and the Holy Spirit within them had them determine which writing are scripture.

YAQUBOS:

And, dear Psalm45:9, don’t answer without understanding what I mean.

I’m sorry, your words weren’t so clear; I went with my gut feeling. I guess I needed an interpreter.

YAQUBOS:

So the Romans must respect the DIVINE CANON that clearly shows that those human writings are not WORD OF GOD.

AMEN! Human writings are not the word of God! The Deuterocanonicals are!

YAQUBOS:

That’s a lie, because I didn’t see you bringing any book other than those of the real Word of God that can meet the DIVINE CANON. Those human writings didn’t meet the STANDARD.

I brought the Holy Spirit. I thought in order for a writing to be scripture, they have to meet the five points. The Deuterocanonicals meet them. You said nothing about quoting the Protocanonicals. Peace be with you.

YAQUBOS:

You said AMEN to the FIVE points of the DIVINE CANON. There are books that the council of Rome declares as Scripture ( as you quote ) although they are not meeting the DIVINE CANON! Do you believe the council of Rome, or God who gave you the DIVINE CANON in His Word?

I believe God, who guides Rome to all truth.

YAQUBOS:

You have answered yourself, and you tried to convince yourself that there are answers, although there are no answers! You didn’t show how those human writings can meet the DIVINE STANDARDS!

They sure did. Please toss out Esther.

YAQUBOS:

In a previous reply, you said AMEN to the statement that you are contradicting now!!!

So now you’re saying that the Holy Spirit contradicts itself?

YAQUBOS:

Don’t you know that God reveals His Word through the prophets?

Esther is a prophetess? Where does the book of Esther say it was written by a prophet?

 

[Psalm45_9]

Continuing solely by his grace!

YAQUBOS:

So it didn’t appear suddenly like the Qur’an! And the Church has to follow the DIVINE CANON, and not create a new canon!

AMEN! The church didn’t create a new canon, it determined the existing real one!

YAQUBOS:

ONLY a prophet of God ( an inspired man of God ) can speak the Word of God!

Esther was a prophetess? God is not even mentioned in that book, well he is in my version.

YAQUBOS:

SCRIPTURAL inspiration ceased in Israel ( as Maccabees also testifies )

I see that it said that God the Father is not speaking directly to people, but I’m not seeing where it said that God the Holy Spirit was not working in people and that Divine Inspiration ceased.

YAQUBOS:

from the last prophet until Jesus Christ, just like it ceased after the last Apostle!

Where does the Bible say that?

YAQUBOS:

So no one was able to write Scripture since the time of the last prophet until Jesus Christ,

Where does the Old Testament say that?

YAQUBOS:

just as you can’t write now Scripture even if you are inspired by God! Didn’t I ask you why we can’t add our hymns to the Scripture?

Yup!

YAQUBOS:

So those who wrote Maccabees couldn’t write the divine truth. They could only write ABOUT the divine truth!!!

OK, well Jews still pray for the dead and ask for their intercession today. (2nd Maccabees writes about this revealed truth)

And where else in the Old Testament is the word, “resurrection” used?

 

[Psalm45_9]

Pax Vobis Cvm!

YAQUBOS:

Who said that Esther was written by Esther??? It was written by an inspired man of God, in the prophetic era!

Where does the book of Esther say that a prophet wrote it? Or could the author be writing about revealed truth?

YAQUBOS:

While those human writings were written long AFTER the prophets ceased in ISRAEL.

But not Divine Inspiration.

YAQUBOS:

It is not enough that someone like you find something like a prophecy in a certain book. The Muslims find a prophecy in their Qur’an, but the Qur’an is not WORD OF GOD. It must meet the WHOLE DIVINE CANON.

Is it the Holy Spirit working in one person that determined that the Qur’an is not the word of God? Or was it the Holy Spirit working in many people, aka the Church. The Church condemned the Qu’ran because only the church can determine the Word of God.

YAQUBOS:

You don’t see contradiction??? Maccabees says that you can pray for pagans who died without believing in God, and who were worshiping idols! Do you believe you can pray for a dead pagan like that so that he may have eternal life??? Don’t you see that the Word of God clearly says that TODAY is the day of Salvation???

I answered this previously. They were Jews, not pagans.

YAQUBOS:

The REAL Israel ( the faithful children of God ) ACCEPTED the New Testament.

AMEN! They also accepted the Deutorcanonicals as the word of God.

YAQUBOS:

Jesus Christ didn’t come to Ethiopia… And in the time of the Lord, there were Books IN ISRAEL that were used as Scripture. The Lord didn’t add any book and He didn’t blame them for adding any book. Jesus Christ has the authority! Not those Jews who wanted to doubt even after Jesus Christ came!!

I already answered this previously.

YAQUBOS:

So don’t quote me refusing human authority! I am talking here about ONE point of those five points of the DIVINE CANON, and I am talking about the REAL People of God, and not the unbelieving Jews who still doubted what the Canon is even after the Lord came! And the bad thing is that you are quoting me saying the same thing that I said here right now: "And many Jews deny that Jesus is the Christ! Must we believe that also? ( I say this SUPPOSING that what you say about the Jews is true )

Why do you insist on human authorities?"

I’m talking about the real people of God too, the ones that accepted the Deuterocanonicals!
YAQUOBS:

Yes! I am talking about the REAL People of God, the REAL Israel, and not those who denied the Lord! And remember that we are talking here about ONE point of that DIVINE CANON! Talking about ONE point doesn’t mean insisting on human authority!

AMEN! I’m talking about the real people of God too!

 

[Psalm45_9]

Pax Vobis Cvm!

YAQUBOS:

Do you know what is a prophet of God?

Prophet:

1. 
   *]A person who speaks by divine inspiration or as the interpreter through whom the will of a god is expressed.
   *]A person gifted with profound moral insight and exceptional powers of expression.
   *]A predictor; a soothsayer.
   *]The chief spokesperson of a movement or cause.
   
   
   PROPHET Definition & Meaning | Dictionary.com
   
   YAQUBOS:
   

   He is a man of God inspired to write SCRIPTURE. Well, in the days of Esther there were inspired man of God ( prophets ).

   Just like in the days of Tobit!
   
   
   YAQUBOS:
   

   Mentioning God in a Book is a secondary condition to those five points of the DIVINE CANON. If a prophet is writing Scripture according to the DIVINE CANON without mentioning God, this doesn’t mean he is not writing Scripture. God can tell you something without talking about Himself directly. The essential is that the DIVINE CANON must be respected!

   And just because God the Father is not speaking to anyone does not mean that Divine Inspiration has ceased.
   
   
   YAQUBOS:
   

   In a previous reply, you said that those bishops are inspired by the Spirit to write ABOUT the revealed truth of God. While here you are saying that they are the inspired men of God mentioned in Peter!!!

   They are, I guess Acts 20:28 is lying when it said the Holy Spirit chose them. Men moved by the Holy Spirit to interpret the scriptures.
   
   
   YAQUBOS:
   

   Esther meets them, as we have shown.

   So do the Deuterocanonicals, as we have shown.
   
   
   YAQUBOS:
   

   But why are you answering negatively?? I asked you to bring any words or books that can MEET all those DIVINE standards, not to bring me books that cannot meet them!

   I have, you’re the one who is having a fit over 7 books, why?

 

[Psalm45_9]

Continuing solely by his grace!

YAQUBOS:

Oh, I see! You don’t understand what is a prophet of God! And what is a book written by a prophet! A book written by a prophet is not supposed to ALWAYS say something about the future!

The words of the Holy Spirit:

“Let us lie in wait for the righteous man, because he is inconvenient to us and opposes our actions; he reproaches us for sins against the law, and accuses us of sins against our training. He professes to have knowledge of God, and calls himself a child of the Lord. He became to us a reproof of our thoughts; the very sight of him is a burden to us, because his manner of life is unlike that of others, and his ways are strange. We are considered by him as something base, and he avoids our ways as unclean; he calls the last end of the righteous happy, and boasts that God is his father. Let us see if his words are true, and let us test what will happen at the end of his life; for if the righteous man is God’s son, he will help him, and will deliver him from the hand of his adversaries. Let us test him with insult and torture, that we may find out how gentle he is, and make trial of his forbearance. Let us condemn him to a shameful death, for, according to what he says, he will be protected.” (Wisdom of Solomon 2:12-20)

“You accursed wretch, you dismiss us from this present life, but the King of the universe will raise us up to an everlasting renewal of life, because we have died for his laws.” (2 Maccabees 7:9)

YAQUBOS:

A prophet is someone who speaks the Word of God, even if that Word is not about an event that will happen in the future! A prophet is an inspired man of God, as said in Peter. All the Books of the Word of God are written by inspired authors.

The Deuterocanonicals were written by inspired men.

YAQUBOS:

Ecclesiastes begins with: “The words of the Preacher, the son of David, king in Jerusalem.” ( Ecclesiastes 1:1 ). So it is written by the Preacher, a prophet of God!

As was the Wisdom of Solomon.

YAQUBOS:

All other DIVINE Books that you are mentioning are written in the prophetic era, by an inspired man of God.

The deuterocanonicals were written by divine inspired men, when people needed inspiration.

YAQUBOS:

And it says clearly that it was not written by a prophet of God.

SCRIPTURAL inspiration ceased since the last prophet of the Old Testament until Jesus Christ. And then it ceased after the last Apostle.

Saying that Esther was written by a prophet is a stretch. Just because a book was not written while there were not prophets roaming the Earth does not mean that Divine Inspiration ceased.

 

[Psalm45_9]

Pax Vobis Cvm!

YAQUBOS:

I am not talking about Books being confirmed by an act of God, but THE PROPHET being confirmed as prophet by an act of God!

You mean like an angel?

YAQUBOS:

All Scriptural authors were confirmed like that.

Not Esther.

YAQUBOS:

Tobit is not a prophet, as Maccabees says clearly, because prophets ceased in Israel!

The prophet Jonah was preaching the destruction of Nineveh in this book.

YAQUBOS:

Muhammad said that he saw the angel Gabriel! But this doesn’t mean that he really saw an angel!

Only the Church determines if visions are authentic.

YAQUBOS:

A confirming act of God is demanded for a prophet.

Can you elaborate?

YAQUBOS:

A Book is divine when it meets the DIVINE CANON, and not just SEEMS to meet ONE point of that CANON.

Good bye Esther.

YAQUBOS:

And they say also other things that contradict the truth, like praying for dead pagans!

No it does not, which I explained.

YAQUBOS:

The Qur’an also says some true things, but it seriously contradicts the truth in other places!

AMEN! But not the Deuterocanonicals.

YAQUBOS:

Blessed be the Lord!

Benedictus Deus Israhel!

 

[Church_Militant]

YAQUBOS:

Peace be with you!

No, God’s.

In Love,
Yaqubos†

Sure can’t tell from the mixed up signals and confused interpretations you send out. Maybe you should move on to hassling with the Mormon forums or JWs since you can’t get us to listen to you… You can argue your heart out but you’re like a man arguing with a wall that it really isn’t there. His denial of the truth doesn’t change the fact that it’s there.

 

[Church_Militant]

Yaqubos tried to tell us this…

SCRIPTURAL inspiration ceased since the last prophet of the Old Testament until Jesus Christ. And then it ceased after the last Apostle.

Hmmm so that would disqualify John the Baptist? In SPITE of Jesus’ plain statement to the contrary? You seem confused…

 

[Church_Militant]

Yaqubos tried to tell us that:

He is a man of God inspired to write SCRIPTURE. Well, in the days of Esther there were inspired man of God ( prophets ).

The problem is that very few of the prophets were told by God to write anything…they were all told (To the best of my recollection) to SPEAK. (possible case for oral tradition there as well, I would think, but that’s another thing altogether).

You also make the mistake of assuming that a prophet is the only one that writes in the Bible, yet this is fallacious logic because there is nothing prophetic in Numbers…it’s mostly just census figures. That’s not prophecy…it’s history. So then there is absolutely nothing wrong with the books of Maccabees not being “written by a prophet”.
You seem to have a hang up about prophets…yet the apostles were not all prophets and St. Luke was a historian. In fact the NT clearly says that some are prophets and some are apostles, but not all have the same charism. (gift) We KNOW that the apostles were apostles, and that some of them prophesied, but not all. In fact…now that I think of it; of all four of the writers of the Gospel, only St. John seems to have left us any prophetic writings in Revelation. So it seems pretty clear that your so called test for canonicity falls flat due to the evidence of the New Testament itself.

It’s clear that not all scripture is prophetic, right? So obviuosly one would not have to BE a “prophet” in order to pen something that qualifies as scriptural canon. Hence the case for the simple histories and parables in the OT is made…And the Deuterocanonicals as well.

 

[YAQUBOS]

Peace be with you!

The Lord says about humility:

“GOD IS OPPOSED TO THE PROUD, BUT GIVES GRACE TO THE HUMBLE.” ( James 4:6 )

So if you want to get any grace, you have first to be humble and to accept the Word of God as It is, and not as you or your religious background want it to be…

Although I wrote by His Grace so many things, but there are still opposition about things that were already explained. As I told Psalm45:9, after he has made opposition to the DIVINE CANON, he will also make opposition to the explanation. And this is what he did, him and Church Militant…

We see more in the next reply, if the Lord permits.

In Love,

Yaqubos†

 

[YAQUBOS]

Peace be with you!

We continue by His Grace.
Psalm45:9:

And the Pharisees condemned our Lord, why do you insist on them to determine the Canon? You told me that we should not rely on the Jews, I agree.

I never said that we should rely on the Pharisees to determine the Canon. Are you reading what I am writing with a so great Love for you?

I wrote to you by His Grace about this, but it seems that you didn’t read carefully. Read it again here:

YAQUBOS:

Didn’t you say AMEN to the following:

YAQUBOS:

1. Was it accepted by the People of God?
   Why this question? Because:

“For this reason we also constantly thank God that when you received the word of God which you heard from us, you accepted it not as the word of men, but for what it really is, the word of God, which also performs its work in you who believe.” ( 1 Thessalonians 2:13 )

The People of God means the REAL People of God, and not simply a faction of those who call themselves People of God!!!

Jesus Christ didn’t come to Ethiopia… And in the time of the Lord, there were Books IN ISRAEL that were used as Scripture. The Lord didn’t add any book and He didn’t blame them for adding any book. Jesus Christ has the authority! Not those Jews who wanted to doubt even after Jesus Christ came!!

So don’t quote me refusing human authority! I am talking here about ONE point of those five points of the DIVINE CANON, and I am talking about the REAL People of God, and not the unbelieving Jews who still doubted what the Canon is even after the Lord came! And the bad thing is that you are quoting me saying the same thing that I said here right now: "And many Jews deny that Jesus is the Christ! Must we believe that also? ( I say this SUPPOSING that what you say about the Jews is true )

Why do you insist on human authorities?"

Yes! I am talking about the REAL People of God, the REAL Israel, and not those who denied the Lord! And remember that we are talking here about ONE point of that DIVINE CANON! Talking about ONE point doesn’t mean insisting on human authority!

Hope you read it carefully this time…

More in the next reply, if the Lord wills.

In Love,
Yaqubos†

 

[YAQUBOS]

Peace be with you!

Continuing by the Lord’s Grace.

* You first asked for the “list” of the Spirit. You insisted on that and you wanted an answer. When I gave you the Lord’s answer, you began to doubt about what God says.*

Psalm45:9:

No, because I know the list that God made.

Is this list that you know something else than what the DIVINE CANON says in Scripture. You said AMENs to the five points of that CANON, right?
Psalm45:9:

Those who remained faithful to God an accepted his son are the children of God, aka the Church. Jewish and secular sources show that the canon was not determined at the time of Christ. Jewish and secular sources that Jews today accept the Deuterocanonicals.

Again, you prove to me that you are not reading carefully, or maybe you don’t want to believe God. Didn’t we say AMEN to the fact that GOD has determined the CANON with those five points that I mentioned by His Grace? Didn’t we say that it is not the unbelievers who determined the Canon?

Those Jews who didn’t want to accept the DIVINE CANON even after the coming of our Lord are called UNBELIEVERS, and they can doubt about the CANON as much as they want!

* If you want the glory of men, you can’t believe, as *our Lord said.

Psalm45:9:

So you do believe I’m a Christian. I see God’s grace at work!

Don’t you know that the Christians do not judge anyone?

Whatever… The Lord was saying that to the unbelieving Jews… It’s strange to think that those unbelieving Jews were Christians…

And by the way: Jesus is the Lord of all, even if they do not accept it!
Psalm45:9:

Yes! And the Deuterocanonicals meet the Divine Canon!

As we saw, those human writings that you call “Deuterocanonical” are NOT written by an inspired man of God, they are telling us things that CONTRADICT the Truth of the Word of God, they do NOT have the power of God, and they are not accepted by the REAL people of God according to the Old Testament!

By the way, do you think we can pray for dead pagans so that they may have eternal life, as Maccabees teaches?

To be continued in the next reply, if the Lord wills.

In Love,
Yaqubos†

 

[YAQUBOS]

Peace be with you!

Continuing by His Grace.

* Why not the Jewish Tradition also? Did Moses and the prophets write everything??? So is there not a Jewish Tradition?*

Psalm45:9:

Yes, the chair of Moses that our Lord commanded his disciples to follow. Prayers to the Saints and prayers to the dead, have Jewish roots.

You are contradicting yourself without knowing…

So tell me: do you accept all what the Jewish Tradition says? For instance, do you believe all what the Talmuds say?

* Psalm45:9, you have to explain to me what is the difference between determining and deciding what is the Word of God.*

Psalm45:9:

Scripture already existed at the time of the council of Rome. The Holy Spirit led the council to determine which writings are scripture. The decision is a personal choice, whether or not to accept this council is a decision.

According to what did that council determine the Books? According to something other than the DIVINE CANON?

Were those Books that the council determined ALREADY accepted by the People of God ( as ONE of those five points of the DIVINE CANON says )?

* Aha! So by “determined” you mean “declared”, right? So God told the Church what is His Word, and the Church just declared it, right?*

Psalm45:9:

BINGO! It existed, they just had to find which writings belonged in the canon.

Aha! So you think the People of God didn’t know which books were part of the Word of God, thus contradicting one of the essential points of the DIVINE CANON to which you said AMEN. Didn’t you say AMEN to the following:

* And when the Church declared which Books are Word of God, they had not a choice between thousands of books among which they had to pick out those that are the Word of God. They ALREADY knew what God had revealed as Word of God*, and they studied those inspired Books to find the rules ( Canon ) by which they could clearly show that all heretical and wrong books didn’t meet those rules or standards.

The things that you have to notice are in BOLD!

To be continued in the next reply, if the Lord wills.

In Love,
Yaqubos†

 

[YAQUBOS]

Peace be with you!

Continuing by His Grace.

* So this makes: the whole Church accepted those Books, and some just doubted.*

I said this about the New Testament Books. But you answered:
Psalm45:9:

Yup, some people disagreed about the Deuterocanonicals, but not the whole church.

Those human writings that you call “Deuterocanonical” are part of the OLD TESTAMENT. The REAL People of God according to the Old Testament are the BELIEVER Jews. Those BELIEVER Jews ( like the Virgin Mary and Joseph etc ) didn’t accept those human writings as Scripture! And our Lord didn’t blame them for doing that!

* Jesus Christ didn’t come to Ethiopia… And in the time of the Lord, there were Books IN ISRAEL that were used as Scripture. The Lord didn’t add any book and He didn’t blame them for adding any book. Jesus Christ has the authority! Not those Jews who wanted to doubt even after Jesus Christ came!!*

Psalm45:9:

St. Philip baptized the Ethiopian Eunuch in the Acts of the Apostles, so the Gospel and the Holy Spirit came to Ethiopia. Jesus said the Law, the Prophets, and the Psalms spoke of him. Daniel is classified as a writing, so did he mean Daniel too? Which Psalms are he talking about, not all of them speak of him, are those scripture?

I was talking about the fact that the Lord didn’t blame the Jews OF ISRAEL that they didn’t accept those human writings. What does this have to do with the baptism of the Eunuch?

When the Lord talked about the Books, He was talking about the Books accepted ACCORDING TO THE DIVINE CANON.

To be continued in the next reply, if the Lord wills.

In Love,
Yaqubos†

 

[YAQUBOS]

Peace be with you!

Continuing by His Grace.
Psalm45:9:

Encyclopedic Dictionary of the Bible 1963 ) “Even in the second century of the Christian era the Jewish rabbis were not fully agreed on the Canonicity of certain books (e.g. Cant, Eccl; cfr. Also 4, Esd 14,44ff).”

(The Encyclopedia of Judaism, vol 15 page 117)" says that the limit of the third part (Writings) was not finalized until mid of second century. In addition, the Hebrew Canon was also not accepted by Ethiopian Jews who accept Septuagint to this day "

(Dictionary of Biblical Literacy 1986. p.321)“Precisely when Jewish leadership officially adopted the traditional 39 books of the so-called “Hebrew Canon” is not known; nor is there agreement as to exactly what criteria were used in determining the Canon.”

There was no official canon at the time of Christ, even Jewish sources attest to that.

The OFFICIAL CANON is the DIVINE CANON, can’t you get this?

Didn’t you say AMEN to the following:

YAQUBOS:

1. Was it accepted by the People of God?
   Why this question? Because:

“For this reason we also constantly thank God that when you received the word of God which you heard from us, you accepted it not as the word of men, but for what it really is, the word of God, which also performs its work in you who believe.” ( 1 Thessalonians 2:13 )

The People of God means the REAL People of God, and not simply a faction of those who call themselves People of God!!!

In the time of the Lord, there were Books IN ISRAEL that were used as Scripture. The Lord didn’t add any book and He didn’t blame them for adding any book. Jesus Christ has the authority! Not those Jews who wanted to doubt even after Jesus Christ came!!

So don’t quote me refusing human authority! I am talking here about ONE point of those five points of the DIVINE CANON, and I am talking about the REAL People of God, and not the unbelieving Jews who still doubted what the Canon is even after the Lord came! And the bad thing is that you are quoting me saying the same thing that I said here right now: "And many Jews deny that Jesus is the Christ! Must we believe that also? ( I say this SUPPOSING that what you say about the Jews is true )

Why do you insist on human authorities?"

Yes! I am talking about the REAL People of God, the REAL Israel, and not those who denied the Lord! And remember that we are talking here about ONE point of that DIVINE CANON! Talking about ONE point doesn’t mean insisting on human authority!

To be continued in the next reply, if the Lord wills.

In Love,

Yaqubos†

 

[YAQUBOS]

Peace be with you!

Continuing by His Grace.
Psalm45:9:

Well if there was no official canon at the time of Christ as many sources show, then we can not rely on them to determine the canon. We have to rely on the true people of God, aka the Church.

Again, the OFFICIAL CANON is not what humans determine, but it is the DIVINE CANON! And this DIVINE CANON was determined by God.

As for the true people of God, you say it is the Church. Well, do you think the King David was part of that true People of God? Can’t the true people of God in the Old Testament accept what God reveals to them even BEFORE the Christ came ( i.e. even before the Christian Church )???

* Even if the bishops have that authority, they will exercise it ACCORDING TO THE DIVINE CANON, as we said, and you said AMEN!!!*

Psalm45:9:

Which one? There was no official DIVINE CANON at the time of Christ, which is why the Church had to determine which writings are really scripture.

Hey! You are contradicting yourself again. Are you saying here that the Church didn’t ALREADY know what Books are in Scripture? Didn’t you say a big AMEN to the following:

* And when the Church declared which Books are Word of God, they had not a choice between thousands of books among which they had to pick out those that are the Word of God. They ALREADY knew what God had revealed as Word of God*, and they studied those inspired Books to find the rules ( Canon ) by which they could clearly show that all heretical and wrong books didn’t meet those rules or standards.

Pay attention to what you are saying AMEN!

* The DIVINE CANON says that it must be accepted by the people of God who heard that when REVEALED*

* There was no official divine canon at the time of Christ. The Sadducees saw only the Torah as the Divine Canon, The Pharisees saw a canon similar to the one they use today as the Divine canon. The Alexandrian and Ethiopian Jews had a still larger canon. Right in Israel at the time Christ walked the Earth there was a disgreement between the Saducees and the Pharisees over which writings are the Divine Canon. The church determined which existing writings are scripture.*

I am talking about the REAL Israel, can’t you get this? I am talking about the Virgin Mary, John the Baptist, Peter, John, James, Joseph… All these lived in ISRAEL in the time of the Lord. They were among those Jews who didn’t accept those human writings as Scripture. And they accepted what the DIVINE CANON says. And Jesus didn’t blame anyone of them for not accepting those human writings.

To be continued in the next reply, if the Lord wills.

In Love,
Yaqubos†

 

[YAQUBOS]

Peace be with you!

Continuing by His Grace.
Psalm45:9:

And thanks to the Ethiopian Eunuch, the Dueterocanonicals meet the fifth point.

And thanks to your philosophy, we will begin to think that the Apostles didn’t tell the Eunuch what they believed is Scripture according to the DIVINE CANON… Would the Apostles teach anything other than the Word of God? Would they teach anything other than what Jesus taught them??? Well, those Apostles lived in ISRAEL. The Jews of Israel didn’t accept those human writings as Scripture. So the Apostles didn’t use to believe those human writings are Scripture! Jesus Christ didn’t tell His Disciples: “Why don’t you accept those human writings?”

* How many times do we have to say that, in the case of the real Word of God, people doubt it AFTER it is accepted by the People of God, as it is the case with Martin Luther who doubted books that were already accepted by the real People of God who first read it!!! This is a point of the DIVINE CANON to which you said AMEN!!!*

Psalm45:9:

People doubted that Cornelius was a Christian after he was baptized.

And thus you confirm what I said. AFTER!

* But you didn’t answer my question: "Oh, but if you know how those books talk about them!!! About prayer for the dead, 2 Maccabees 12:45-46 !!! This is an example of humans praying for PAGANS who used to worship idols, so that they may have good resurrection!!!*

Psalm45:9:

They weren’t pagans they were Jews first of all. Second, they were supposed to have all of those charms melted, but they kept them for their own selfish reasons, to make money by selling them. For this they were slain, just as Ananias was slain for not giving all his proceeds to the Church in the Acts of the Apostles. However, since Judas did not know where there hearts were at the moment of their death, he prayed for the ones that repented at the last moment.

Thus you prove that you don’t know what is a real Jew. The real Jew is a Jew IN HEART, as the Scripture says.

Judas didn’t know where their hearts were at the moment of their death? Where is supposed to be the heart of someone who is stealing idols to sell them or to worship them???

By the way: do you think stealing is a “mortal” sin? Do you think worshiping money ( and idols ) is a “mortal” sin?

Do you pray for people who died in “MORTAL” SIN?

I mean, do you pray for people who died without being in state of GRACE?

* Don’t you believe what the Bible says that TODAY is the Day of Salvation???*

Psalm45:9:

Your ignorance is showing. People who are in Purgatory are not going to Hell, they’re going straight to Heaven. They are just being purged of their sins so the can enter, for nothing unclean can enter Heaven. Since God is beyond time, no one know how long a person is there. An eternity to us, could be a second to God. So indeed it is still possible for today to be the day of salvation.

Do you believe that someone can be saved WITHOUT Faith?

To be continued in the next reply, if the Lord wills.

In Love,

Yaqubos†