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rinnie
Guest
God be with you Rascal and give you the grace to have the right words. Take care of yourself and family you are a good guy. I really want you guys to make it.
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RascalJones
Guest
Me too. Thanks all.
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iamrefreshed
Guest
I and several here have recommended very highly Retrouvaille.I am going to say one more thing, then, not join in here as I do not have adequate experience since my husband never cheated on me in our two decades of marriage
Rely on CATHOLIC sources to save your sacramental CATHOLIC marriage.
While I’m sure not intended, your sarcasm icon is rather hurtful. Unfortunately some of us do know the feeling of betrayal. Marginalizing that with sarcasm is unkind at best. I’d trade your two decades for the world.
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iamrefreshed
Guest
Regarding Retrouvaille…The first rule regarding infidelity is that all contact MUST STOP.
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slyboots
Guest
Ok. Bottom line.
Emotional affair? Stil sounds like adultery to me The person CANNOT be friends with that person. They are leaving themselves open to a real possibility of temptation.
the other side of this is that you are encouraging the other person to hope for the emotional relationship that you had previously.
Let’s stop this silliness.
People…be faithful to your spouses. You know what that means. Not just sexually but emotionally faithful.
When you become emotionally intimate with someone other than your spouse that decreases your ability to give fully to your spouse.
This should not even be a question. It sounds as if to me someone thinks they can have their spouse for a bed mate and their “friend” as an emotional partner. Sorry that is just wrong.
One woman/ one man. That’s the deal.
Emotional affair? Stil sounds like adultery to me The person CANNOT be friends with that person. They are leaving themselves open to a real possibility of temptation.
the other side of this is that you are encouraging the other person to hope for the emotional relationship that you had previously.
Let’s stop this silliness.
People…be faithful to your spouses. You know what that means. Not just sexually but emotionally faithful.
When you become emotionally intimate with someone other than your spouse that decreases your ability to give fully to your spouse.
This should not even be a question. It sounds as if to me someone thinks they can have their spouse for a bed mate and their “friend” as an emotional partner. Sorry that is just wrong.
One woman/ one man. That’s the deal.
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scott1228
Guest
Kage:
Just thought I would let you know (and others), Marriage Builders is listed as a resource on the foryourmarriage.org website.
foryourmarriage.org/interior_template.asp?id=20398782
I highly recommend MB for those whose marriages are plagued by infidelity. However, like anything, it is just a tool, and I recommend that one arms him or herself with all the tools available, pray for guidance, and then make a decision that best fits the situation.
The key however, in my opinion, is to ACT. To stand by while a spouse continues a relationship with another person is to accept defeat.
This may be the toughest thing anyone ever has to do. But there are many people that have gone through this and saved their marriages.
Just thought I would let you know (and others), Marriage Builders is listed as a resource on the foryourmarriage.org website.
foryourmarriage.org/interior_template.asp?id=20398782
I highly recommend MB for those whose marriages are plagued by infidelity. However, like anything, it is just a tool, and I recommend that one arms him or herself with all the tools available, pray for guidance, and then make a decision that best fits the situation.
The key however, in my opinion, is to ACT. To stand by while a spouse continues a relationship with another person is to accept defeat.
This may be the toughest thing anyone ever has to do. But there are many people that have gone through this and saved their marriages.
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Billie4245
Guest
That will not work. You have lost the trust. Been there done that.
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Island_Oak
Guest
RJ: Very wise observations, my friend. BUT…it’s more than time for some very firm and decisive action on your part. Your wife has had more than sufficient notice and opportunity to turn this situation around. She has not done so for whatever reason–and continues to refuse counseling and compromise your mental health and family stability. If I found myself in this situation, I imagine my husband would “invite” me to leave our home until such time as I was ready to commit to repairing the damage I had caused or was ready to launch into life on my own. [And I would extend him the same invitation if tables were turned.]
There would be some time line in place~say a month~ for the dust to settle, counseling to start, and efforts/initiative were taken by the guilty party to start mending the damage caused to the relationship. All you are doing right now my friend is enabling her and if she is exisiting in some fantasy land or fog of rebellion or disfunction, it’s time for one of you to pull the plug and get on with dealing with the reality of your situation.
This is not about ultimatums per se~but she must make a choice. A woman will never respect a man she can walk all over and who does not hold her accountable for her behaviour. You may ultimately have to accept that her choice might not be to stay with you. But wallowing in uncertainty and inertia is not “keeping” her or saving your marriage. Time apart will give her time to think and function without you. Could it make it easier to make contact with the OM? Sure. But it could also “bring her to her senses” and lead her to decide she wants to work on repairing the marriage.
Sorry…I couldn’t disagree more or have less respect for a man who was so weak or desperate as to resort to this pandering approach. She should be approaching you seeking forgiveness and doing everthing she can to fix this mess. You should be gracious and generous in forgiveness and unconditional in your love, but not a slacker in upholding high standards and expectations.
Don’t do it…you have enough to worry about with your own spouse. Let the dirtbag deal with his own wife.
I truly am so sorry and am praying for your strength to get through this. If and when your wife comes to her senses it WILL break her heart to realize what her selfish desires put you through.
." In saner times, these rules would be understood by all. In these times, we have to define them, and in some instances, fight for them. One woman I know once told her husband that if he ever hit her, even once, she would leave. That is a good boundary. Now it is time for you to set boundaries with your wife.
With prayers and love, she may come to her senses. But if you just let her walk all over you, that is not love either, and sooner or later, will not come to a good ending.
Best wishes-- i know that this is a tough time.
Scott
Agreed. Good post.
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cecilia97
Guest
It’s true that the wayward spouse should ask for forgiveness and be willing to fix things. But in many cases, that doesn’t happen. What options does that leave the betrayed spouse? You can’t force someone to be penitent. If she’s not begging forgiveness, there are two possible reasons: (1) she has some emotional confusion that’s causing her to think an EA is OK, or (2) she doesn’t want forgiveness. My money is on (1) in this particular case…it’s the most hopeful option.
Marriages should be more important than either spouse’s pride. Sometimes the betrayed spouse has to do some stuff and put up with some stuff that’s just not fair if they want to try to make things work.
On a side note…I must say that it strikes me that, when I came onto CA for help in this same situation a couple years ago, the response was mostly that I was being too hard on my wayward husband and that I should basically suck it up and quit whining. Infidelity is infidelity, and this doesn’t excuse affairs, but is there maybe a teensy bit of male ego involved on these sorts of threads? Just interesting that men get more empathy in these situations, and women are sometimes painted as controlling, possessive shrews who expect too much from their hubbies.
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RascalJones
Guest
I forgot to add that after going to confession yesterday, I went to Mass at 8:30 AM today on my way to work, and was happy to be able to receive our Lord in the blessed sacrament.
WHEW!
Yeah, I got a ton of stuff to figure out. Just trying to figure out WHEN and HOW. Generally, she’s pretty nice to me, actually sweet.
I’ve realized that I have not said “I love you” to her today. I’m the type that says it after every phone call. Of course, she hasn’t said it either…
WHEW!
Yeah, I got a ton of stuff to figure out. Just trying to figure out WHEN and HOW. Generally, she’s pretty nice to me, actually sweet.
I’ve realized that I have not said “I love you” to her today. I’m the type that says it after every phone call. Of course, she hasn’t said it either…
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Liberanosamalo
Guest
Rascal! Good for you! You will find that the decisions you make while in the state of grace are better than the ones you made outside it.
Have you tried asking her one simple question?
Darling: How would you react if the shoe was on the other foot? What would you do if I had some young woman at work whom I was calling and emailing and was “close friends” with, who was giving me gifts? What would you do if I refused to end the relationship if you begged me to for your own emotional well-being?
Ask her to advise you how she would handle that situation if the shoe were on the other foot. What is the prudent thing to do? She will do a lot of projecting when she answers that, and you will get a very good idea of her thought processes here.
I had a counselor tell me that every first divorce is about someone divorcing a parent. She asked me which parent I was divorcing. Well, I wasn’t the one who filed for divorce! But her point does go with what other posters here say about rebellious teenagers and people who never dealt with childhood issues.
Have you tried asking her one simple question?
Darling: How would you react if the shoe was on the other foot? What would you do if I had some young woman at work whom I was calling and emailing and was “close friends” with, who was giving me gifts? What would you do if I refused to end the relationship if you begged me to for your own emotional well-being?
Ask her to advise you how she would handle that situation if the shoe were on the other foot. What is the prudent thing to do? She will do a lot of projecting when she answers that, and you will get a very good idea of her thought processes here.
I had a counselor tell me that every first divorce is about someone divorcing a parent. She asked me which parent I was divorcing. Well, I wasn’t the one who filed for divorce! But her point does go with what other posters here say about rebellious teenagers and people who never dealt with childhood issues.
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cecilia97
Guest
A counselor told me something very similar…that each marriage is like a marriage between the spouses’ “dominant” parent personalities (or the parent they identify with the most). How frightening to imagine my father married to my ex’s father!
In my experience, the question about “what would you do if the shoe were on the other foot” gets answered with a lot of denial. They say “oh, well, I wouldn’t worry about it because you’d just be friends!”.
People in EAs are lying to themselves as much as they’re lying to the spouse. They really need help from someone who truly loves them.
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RascalJones
Guest
Yes, of course I asked that question. The answer was “You wouldn’t be here”. To which I replied “Then don’t you think you should be working harder to be here?” No answer there…just a lot of “I’m sorry”.
Everytime I find something, it’s “I’m sorry”. And then, it happens again.
She is trying SO HARD to not be her mother. I think she’s scared that by staying home, she’ll turn into her mother. Her mom is very dominant.
I want my wife, my family, and my life back. But, I’m getting to the point where I’m prepared to lose it all. Life can NOT go on like it is.
Everytime I find something, it’s “I’m sorry”. And then, it happens again.
She is trying SO HARD to not be her mother. I think she’s scared that by staying home, she’ll turn into her mother. Her mom is very dominant.
I want my wife, my family, and my life back. But, I’m getting to the point where I’m prepared to lose it all. Life can NOT go on like it is.
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graceandglory
Guest
I think TRUST is the crux of the matter. They say the want to stay married. One person has been betrayed once. The other person has done the betraying. Trust has to be rebuilt. Why hang onto the temptation? Sounds like a recipe for a long and painful disaster.
IMHO.
All things are* possible* with God.
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BlazingBolt
Guest
So you have no respect for me? You think it is weak to do what is necessary to save a marriage? Isn’t it weak to do what is easier, to be angry and wait for her to seek forgiveness (good luck with that)?
You are absolutely right that she should be the one doing everything she can to seek forgiveness and to fix the mess, but the reality is she is not and she won’t. Does that mean the marriage is over? Well mine would have been and our two kids at the time would have have suffered because of it if not for my “weakness”.
Let me tell you, and listen carefully, the course of action I suggested is the FARTHEST thing possible from being weak. It is damn hard. It involves growing up a bit and swallowing your pride. Yes, she did wrong and she should be begging for forgiveness, but which is more childish: sitting their and waiting for her to do so, or giving even more even though you are deeply hurt because of your commitment to the marriage? The reality is the spouse having the affair is acting irrational and is addicted to the affair, you can’t expect her to magically come to her senses and end all contact with the other man simply because that is what she should do.
I don’t see where you see me suggesting pandering or being a slacker in upholding high standards and expectations. All I am saying is that you have to try to solve the issues that led to the affair now, not wait till later or till the affair is over. You also need to avoid angry outbursts, disrespectful judgments, and selfish demands. As an example, maybe she is attracted to this man because of the way he listens to her and perhaps in the marriage the husband got in a bad habit of not listening to her the way he used to. The husband should make sure and listen to her, with out judging her and that will help draw her back to her senses. You do not accept the affair or enable it and you make clear that it needs to end so that you can work on saving the marriage, you don’t let her walk all over you, but you also can’t go around getting angry about it and constantly making demands saying what she has to do and that it end immediately because all that will do is drive her away. No body like someone who judges them and thinks they can tell them what to do and get angry with them. The more pleasant time they can spend together, the more behavior the husband has that fulfills her emotional needs in the time they do have together, the less that he does things that will hurt her feelings and drive her away, then the more he restores her love and as that love grows for him the more likely it is she will come to her senses, feel guilty, end the affair, and beg for forgiveness as she should have been doing all along. We love, like, or dislike people based on how they treat us, this is undeniable.
Sitting there and saying the husband shouldn’t do that because it’s her fault and that she should be doing that not him, when the course of action I suggest has the much better chance of saving the marriage is just wrong. I have much more respect for the person who can take the high road, the more difficult one, and achieve the goal of saving the marriage then the one who takes the easier path and allows their bitterness and anger to drive the wayward spouse farther away.
Don’t forget, I actually did this succesfully, and my marriage has thrived since (not instantly mind you, it took years). We have had another child together and have been very happy. Your disrespectful comments are aimed directly at me, and I am offended and think you need to grow up and let go of your immature concepts of saying you have no respect for some one unless they stubbornly hold to concepts of fairness dictating how others should act and that you have no respect for someone who puts their pain aside and tries to save their marriage by loving someone who they don’t feel at all like loving. It’s not about being desperate, it’s about being committed to your marriage till death and loving(by your actions, even when you do not feel it) even when your love is not returned and that is dang hard to do.
If you have been through this in your marriage and survived it and thrived after words then fine, if not I feel you owe me an apology. Only other way you have room to talk is to argue that you strongly believe in divorce.
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BlazingBolt
Guest
One thing that can help a lot is to talk to your doctor about getting some anti-depressants to help you through this time. It will not only help you to cope, but it will help you to deal with her better and make it easier to attempt to fill any emotional needs of hers to help restore her love for you.
You are right that it can’t go on like this. That is why you set the time limit, do your best during that time to restore the relationship, and if it doesn’t work then you cut off all contact with her (with out negativity or fighting) until the affair is completely over. Even if you have to cut contact with her I fully believe this is the best chance to get your wife, family, and life back.
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rinnie
Guest
Time Rascal. Time its not going to happen over night. things didnt get broke overnight they wont get fixed overnight. Rascal are you close with a brother, sister or your Mom or Dad.
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scott1228
Guest
BB:
Please don’t take those comments personally. I wrote a few posts back that RJ should focus on taking advice from those that have been through this. For those that have not been through it, I am sorry, but your advice, and even though tone of your thoughts, can be off the mark, and hurtful. Honestly, I can’t think of another situation that is as damaging and painful as infidelity.
RJ:
I think BB’s advice is on the mark, and if you go to the MB website, they will call this “Plan A” and “Plan B.” Of course, you are the final judge, but your circumstances may be those in which these plans would be successful.
I also agree with the temporary use of anti-depressants, though I will add, most doctors will suggest seeing a counselor in conjunction with their use for maximum effectiveness.
Congrats on your successful confession!
Perhaps the time of lent will bringing healing to all of your family… I certainly hope so.
Scott
Please don’t take those comments personally. I wrote a few posts back that RJ should focus on taking advice from those that have been through this. For those that have not been through it, I am sorry, but your advice, and even though tone of your thoughts, can be off the mark, and hurtful. Honestly, I can’t think of another situation that is as damaging and painful as infidelity.
RJ:
I think BB’s advice is on the mark, and if you go to the MB website, they will call this “Plan A” and “Plan B.” Of course, you are the final judge, but your circumstances may be those in which these plans would be successful.
I also agree with the temporary use of anti-depressants, though I will add, most doctors will suggest seeing a counselor in conjunction with their use for maximum effectiveness.
Congrats on your successful confession!
Perhaps the time of lent will bringing healing to all of your family… I certainly hope so.
Scott
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cecilia97
Guest
It may not feel like it now, but “I’m sorry” is a very positive place to work from! Take care of yourself as you have been, see that counselor, and give your brain time to sort things out. It sure sounds like you can handle this.
Continuing to pray…
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RascalJones
Guest
“I’m Sorry” loses it’s power after about 20 times for 20 different events of the same thing.
As far as someone’s suggestion with the anti-dep’s, I’m not interested. I can handle this. It takes a little more WORK than I’m used to. I remember when love was easy, I miss that. But I guess if it was always easy, it wouldn’t necessarily make it worth it.
- Status