Charismatic Movement:Love it or hate it?

[tru_dvotion]

Dear Psalm45:9,

I have been to a couple of Divine Liturgies! Ah, those are sublime masterpieces, surely pleasing to God! I particularly felt moved with the emphasis on pleading for God’s forgiveness. As I understand, we are allowed to visit, but we are not allowed to change rites, so if I wanted to start attending there, I would have to ask my Bishop’s permission. Plus some of my family members… Also, I would still have to observe the feast days of the rite I was born into. But you are so right about the Divine Liturgy! I had to follow a guide but even with the strange language, (Ukrainian) I felt so at home! Every time I drive by that little Church there is a longing to go in… But of course it is all locked up, as most churches are these days, except for a few hours on Sunday.

 

[Psalm45_9]

Mysty101:

And I doubt your reference to Tongues is anything like a prayer or praise tongue, which are the most common in Charismatic worship.

All are sung with eyes and voices lifted up to God:

“In peace, let us pray to the Lord.”

Response: “Lord have mercy.”

“Help, save, have mercy and protect us, O God, by Your grace.”

Response: “Lord have mercy.”

"Shout joyfully to the Lord, all the earth, sing praise to His name; give to Him glorious praise. Through the prayers of the Mother of God, O Savior, save us.

Say to God: How Awesome are Your deeds! Because of Your power Your enemies cringe before You.

Through the prayers of the Mother of God, O Savior, save us.

Let all the earth worship You, and sing praises to you; let it sing praises to Your name, O Most High!

Through the prayers of the Mother of God O Savior, save us."

(Incredibly Charismatic)

These prayers aren’t going to God? They are often said in Greek or Old Slavonic, sounds like a different language. (Tongues) Just like how the foreigners understood what the Apostles were saying. That is the true gift of tongues. If no one can understand the person who is speaking, then it’s gibberish, not a gift of the spirit.

Why do we have to reinvent the wheel, when something is already there?

 

[tru_dvotion]

Psalm45:9:

If no one can understand the person who is speaking, then it’s gibberish, not a gift of the spirit.

Why do we have to reinvent the wheel, when something is already there?

Precicely. Tongues of Pentecost, for a brief time, undid the judjement of Babel. People using modern day tongues recreate Babel! This is the completely reverse!!! Prayer language? Ha, when did our Lady or our Lord babble to the Father in tongues? And who were more filled with the Holy Spirit than those two?

 

[Mysty101]

tru_dvotion:

Precicely. Tongues of Pentecost, for a brief time, undid the judjement of Babel. People using modern day tongues recreate Babel! This is the completely reverse!!! Prayer language? Ha, when did our Lady or our Lord babble to the Father in tongues? And who were more filled with the Holy Spirit than those two?

I will respond later.

Please do not ridicule–that is not Christian.

Check Romans 8:26

SuZ

 

[SPOKENWORD]

tru_dvotion:

Precicely. Tongues of Pentecost, for a brief time, undid the judjement of Babel. People using modern day tongues recreate Babel! This is the completely reverse!!! Prayer language? Ha, when did our Lady or our Lord babble to the Father in tongues? And who were more filled with the Holy Spirit than those two?

Tru, If you are not in the spiritual realm you will never understand it.This is why I said we walk by faith and not by sight. You can not see it unless you come in to this realm. All it takes is to say Here I am Lord,Im open to your Spirit.Fill me with your Gifts so that I may bring you all the Glory.

 

[Mysty101]

(Incredibly Charismatic)

When I use the word “Charismatic”, I am referring to practices of the CCR, the movement approved by the Vatican.

Certainly there are many other manifestations of the Holy Spirit, and other very Charismatic situations, but these are not part of CCR, which is what I am discussing

SuZ

 

[snuffy]

The Best Kept Secret in the Catholic Church Today IS!!!
THE HOLY SPIRIT

Shame on you people who refuse to want or accept the gifts of the Holy Spirit.

Praise Him in the Morning.
Praise Him in the Noon Time.
Praise Him at Supper Time…
Praise Him all the Time…

Praise God, Praise God, Praise God, Praise God.
Praise God, Praise God, Praise God, Praise God.

O Lord I give You all Praise and Honor and Glory.
You alone are the King of Kings, the Lord of Lords.
All creation Praise you…( except the poor Catholic folks who don’t know how, because they are afraid to ask You for this very special gift)

There are some folks here, who really need the guidance of the Holy Spirit…but be careful what you ask for…because if You ask Him… He might just give you a little more than what you ask for… Scary thought hey…

well I hope you can guess that I LOVE the Charismatic Renewal, and I just keep…Falling in Love with Him, over and over…and over and over again. I just keep on falling in Love with Him over and over and over and over again.
Well if this sounds evil or destructive to anyone…Hey take it up with the Holy Spirit…because I asked for this beautiful gift…and I received it.

Thank You Jesus.
Jeanette

 

[SPOKENWORD]

snuffy:

The Best Kept Secret in the Catholic Church Today IS!!!
THE HOLY SPIRIT

Shame on you people who refuse to want or accept the gifts of the Holy Spirit.

Praise Him in the Morning.
Praise Him in the Noon Time.
Praise Him at Supper Time…
Praise Him all the Time…

Praise God, Praise God, Praise God, Praise God.
Praise God, Praise God, Praise God, Praise God.

O Lord I give You all Praise and Honor and Glory.
You alone are the King of Kings, the Lord of Lords.
All creation Praise you…( except the poor Catholic folks who don’t know how, because they are afraid to ask You for this very special gift)

There are some folks here, who really need the guidance of the Holy Spirit…but be careful what you ask for…because if You ask Him… He might just give you a little more than what you ask for… Scary thought hey…

well I hope you can guess that I LOVE the Charismatic Renewal, and I just keep…Falling in Love with Him, over and over…and over and over again. I just keep on falling in Love with Him over and over and over and over again.
Well if this sounds evil or destructive to anyone…Hey take it up with the Holy Spirit…because I asked for this beautiful gift…and I received it.

Thank You Jesus.
Jeanette

Hay Jeanette, Mind if I join in with some tamborines. Wow, What an AWESOME God we have.

 

[tru_dvotion]

Tru, If you are not in the spiritual realm you will never understand it.This is why I said we walk by faith and not by sight. You can not see it unless you come in to this realm. All it takes is to say Here I am Lord,Im open to your Spirit.Fill me with your Gifts so that I may bring you all the Glory.

Dear Word,

Why is it so difficult to discuss the topic without making assumptions about other people’s spirituality? Why does it have to become a personal attack? Could we not discuss the topic? I realize it takes some intelligence and maturity to discuss the topic without making it personal. But you have proven you have the intelligence and the maturity. I don’t get it.

 

[tru_dvotion]

Mysty101:

I will respond later.

Please do not ridicule–that is not Christian.

Check Romans 8:26

SuZ

Mysty,

I am looking forward to your response. I made an observation about a movement and I have not ridiculed anybody personally. I welcome your counter explanation but I would also ask you not to judge me either, simply because I might disagree with your point of view. That would not be Christian.

 

[SPOKENWORD]

tru_dvotion:

Dear Word,

Why is it so difficult to discuss the topic without making assumptions about other people’s spirituality? Why does it have to become a personal attack? Could we not discuss the topic? I realize it takes some intelligence and maturity to discuss the topic without making it personal. But you have proven you have the intelligence and the maturity. I don’t get it.

Again Tru ,my appoligys again, I am not speaking to you personally but to all who are in the Body of Christ. It is scripture not me that says that there those who do not understand things of the Spirit.I could just be quiet here on the side lines but I felt led by the Spirit to bring Gods Truth to those who are open. Change is so difficult and I understand that.Again my appoligys

 

[sherilo]

I was baptized Catholic, but raised Protestant. And even though I have spent the last few months studying my way back home, and don’t claim to know a quarter of what I hope to learn about the faith, I feel that I must respond to this issue. Since the question was asked, a charismatic church, be it Catholic or Protestant, is not for me. I have seen what Protestant charistmatics do with the gift of tongues, the clapping, swaying, etc. It is as if the entire worship service is centered around speaking in tongues. I have seen people who respond to the “alter call” almost forced to speak in tongues to prove their receipt of the Holy Spirit. I also question the emotion of it all. While it is true that love is an emotion, it is also true that emotions and feelings are powerful, and can take on a life of their own. I am wary of any worship service where the emotional aspects are an integral part of the service. Where is the reverence? It just seems possible that a charismatic Mass could lead to a focus on self rather than God.
Lastly, I see a trend toward church hopping in the Catholic church that I though was only a Protestant thing. That is unsettling. However, I will continue my journey home with God’s guidance.

A soon to be flesh and blood Catholic,
Sherilo

 

[Annunciata]

sherilo:

I was baptized Catholic, but raised Protestant. And even though I have spent the last few months studying my way back home, and don’t claim to know a quarter of what I hope to learn about the faith, I feel that I must respond to this issue. Since the question was asked, a charismatic church, be it Catholic or Protestant, is not for me.

Hi Sherilo, Welcome home!
I don’t think that anybody is suggesting that you have to choose.
I’m a convert and have been involved in the Charismatic Renewal in the past…in fact I was a leader in it. I was led elsewhere for one reason or another but still enjoy the prayer and praise and do have the ‘gift of tongues’. I’m also involved in Opus Dei… another beautiful movement in the Church…I have been reading up on Focalare, yet another, BTW…all approved by the Holy Father.
As mother Teresa said, “It isn’t necessary to suceed only that we be faithful” (or words similar to this) So come on in and just let the Holy Spirit be your Guide !
Blessings, Annunciata

 

[Psalm45_9]

snuffy:

The Best Kept Secret in the Catholic Church Today IS!!!
THE HOLY SPIRIT

Shame on you people who refuse to want or accept the gifts of the Holy Spirit.

Praise Him in the Morning.
Praise Him in the Noon Time.
Praise Him at Supper Time…
Praise Him all the Time…

Praise God, Praise God, Praise God, Praise God.
Praise God, Praise God, Praise God, Praise God.

O Lord I give You all Praise and Honor and Glory.
You alone are the King of Kings, the Lord of Lords.
All creation Praise you…( except the poor Catholic folks who don’t know how, because they are afraid to ask You for this very special gift)

There are some folks here, who really need the guidance of the Holy Spirit…but be careful what you ask for…because if You ask Him… He might just give you a little more than what you ask for… Scary thought hey…

well I hope you can guess that I LOVE the Charismatic Renewal, and I just keep…Falling in Love with Him, over and over…and over and over again. I just keep on falling in Love with Him over and over and over and over again.
Well if this sounds evil or destructive to anyone…Hey take it up with the Holy Spirit…because I asked for this beautiful gift…and I received it.

Thank You Jesus.
Jeanette

No, I’m just trying to protect the Charismatic movement in the church, the one begun by the apostles. The one that is and already was in the mass/divine liturgy.

 

[tru_dvotion]

Again Tru ,my appoligys again, I am not speaking to you personally but to all who are in the Body of Christ. It is scripture not me that says that there those who do not understand things of the Spirit.I could just be quiet here on the side lines but I felt led by the Spirit to bring Gods Truth to those who are open. Change is so difficult and I understand that.Again my appoligys

Word, you may have meant it for to the entire Body, but you had my name at the beginning of the sentence.

But I would like to make a comment on this “felt led by the Spirit to bring Gods Truth” Those folks in the renewal are not led or prompted by Holy Spirit in their daily lives better than any other sacramentalized Catholic . As I have said before, the human heart is corrupt and one instant can hold the Holy Spirit and in the next the evil spirit. Now please do not take offence at this, I am not implying that you were led by the evil one when you wrote those words. Actually, that was a very human response to someone who holds an opposing view to our personal beliefs. We tend to assume, the other guy is in the wrong or that he is lacking in some way, because after all we are always right and the other guy is always wrong. Is it not so Word? Do you not think that is how we human beings operate? But the truth is, there is only one truth. There are different impressions of truth, but truth is a constant and never varies. Unless our mental and physical faculties fail us, we have to walk with choosing between right and wrong every minute of the day. When our faculties fail and we have to rely 100% on God taking charge of a situation, he most assuredly takes charge and will either lead us out or accompanies us to our personal Calvary. But to assume that he directs every choice we make in our daily lives is an illusion, and when people do that they tend to make more mistakes than if they scrutinized their motives and actions. Indeed, if we could just rely on the Holy Spirit for everything, we would have no need of the Church or the Sacraments. We could just plug into the Divine and become little kingdoms running about and doing God’s will. That is not how God created mankind, he gave us free will and he ordered us to choose right or wrong, every minute, every day, except for a few blessed moments here and there when we are indeed plugged into the Divine by his grace and for his good pleasure.

 

[gnome]

When I think of the saints and their prayers/devotions, this quote really make sense to me:

“We need to find God, and He cannot be found in noise and restlessness. God is the friend of silence. See how nature - trees, flowers, grass- grows in silence; see the stars, the moon and the sun, how they move in silence… We need silence to be able to touch souls.” - Mother Teresa

 

[SPOKENWORD]

Tru- Dvotions, * I guess you believe that all christians are at the same level in their walk with Jesus.I,m going to have to disagree with you. Yes we are all on the same road that leads into the kingdom of heaven,but there are many alttitudes that we achieve to get there. Are some closer to Him than others? Did Jesus get closer to some of His appostles than others? Did others get closer to Jesus? How deep is our Fathers love? How close will we come? God knows we Love Him so much and try to stay in His Grace. But the Truth is that we do sin. I pray that I can stay close in my daily walk with Him.I cannot do it without the help of the Holy Spirit.I pray that He equips me with the Gifts He has in store for me. I am open and I will recieve them in Faith, so that I might do what He has called me to do. .*

 

[tru_dvotion]

gnome:

When I think of the saints and their prayers/devotions, this quote really make sense to me:

“We need to find God, and He cannot be found in noise and restlessness. God is the friend of silence. See how nature - trees, flowers, grass- grows in silence; see the stars, the moon and the sun, how they move in silence… We need silence to be able to touch souls.” - Mother Teresa

You are correct gnome! And I would like to add that silence is also a wellspring of joy and happiness!

 

[Mysty101]

tru_dvotion:

Mysty,

I am looking forward to your response. I made an observation about a movement and I have not ridiculed anybody personally. I welcome your counter explanation but I would also ask you not to judge me either, simply because I might disagree with your point of view. That would not be Christian.

Prayer language? Ha, when did our Lady or our Lord babble to the Father in tongues

I do not consider this a respectful remark. This, to me, is ridicule of the way I sometimes pray. I do not think you would like this attitude toward the way you pray. I am not judging you—but your remark is offensive to me.

SuZ

 

[SPOKENWORD]

gnome:

When I think of the saints and their prayers/devotions, this quote really make sense to me:

“We need to find God, and He cannot be found in noise and restlessness. God is the friend of silence. See how nature - trees, flowers, grass- grows in silence; see the stars, the moon and the sun, how they move in silence… We need silence to be able to touch souls.” - Mother Teresa

What makes us think God is lost? Jesus lives and dwells in us as christians. Yes we need silence or else we cannot hear what God is speaking to us.God will equip us with what we need for the Harvest is near. Here I am Lord use me.