Charismatic Movement:Love it or hate it?

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I love it and believe that it is an integral part of one’s spiritual journey. There are three phases of spitualness. The first is water baptism as an infant, then you have to be reborn and gain a deeper relationship with God, and then become imersed and Baptized with the Holy Spirit. I don’t know why someone wouldn’t want to go all the way like this. The Church should stress this more!!! I believe the Charismatic Movement needs to gain more strength and rwejuvinate the Church. We need this in the Catholic Church! I don’t think we can really have an opinion on this. It just has to happen and we have to be open to the Fire of the Holy Spirit reigning down on every Church. The Pope supports the Charismatic Renewal also. I love the Praise and Worship at Steubenville University. I live in Canon, Ohio and I hear some of you talk about Charismatic Churches you attend. How would I find one near me or in Ohio? Thanks
 
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PAX777:
Love It… It brings many new and fallen away Catholic back to church especially the youth.
I’m a young Catholic, 26, My parents were Charismatics and I truly believe that it help me be closer to Christ. I also found many other my age have done so because of the movement. Actually, a fellow mom, who is a traditional catholic,emailed about how she met a charismatic and was amazed. Any how, traditional and charismatic, who cares, we are all here because of God. Our journey is between God and ourselves. So please stop the arguements. I’ll pray for everyone 🙂 Peace with all of you.
 
Suellen,

Your post is beautiful. Your post was right on the money. People need to open their minds and not be close minded. You are right when you recieve the gifts of the Holy Spirit you will be changed forever. People need to embrace this and be open to this. Research and read about the Charismatic Movement and read what Pope John Paul has to say about it. Most importantly pray about it!!! I was sceptical about it and questioned it. I was exposed to it through a Protestent and was very weary about it because i though it was very Protestant. But i prayed about it and next thing I know i was in Steubenville being Bapized with the Holy Spirit. I prayed and questioned it and God showed me as clear as day. It was amazing. So, if anyone doesn’t take our word for the Charismatic movement, then ask God he will show you.
 
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Joey1976:
… It just has to happen and we have to be open to the Fire of the Holy Spirit reigning down on every Church. The Pope supports the Charismatic Renewal also.
There you go Joey1976! Nice post…:clapping: if it’s good enough for JPII, then it’s good enough for me and God knows we need “The Fire of The Holy Spirit” to enkindle this sad world we live in today!
Annunciata:)
 
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Joey1976:
Suellen,

Your post is beautiful. Your post was right on the money. People need to open their minds and not be close minded. You are right when you recieve the gifts of the Holy Spirit you will be changed forever. People need to embrace this and be open to this. Research and read about the Charismatic Movement and read what Pope John Paul has to say about it. Most importantly pray about it!!! I was sceptical about it and questioned it. I was exposed to it through a Protestent and was very weary about it because i though it was very Protestant. But i prayed about it and next thing I know i was in Steubenville being Bapized with the Holy Spirit. I prayed and questioned it and God showed me as clear as day. It was amazing. So, if anyone doesn’t take our word for the Charismatic movement, then ask God he will show you.
I feel you Joey I really do…
 
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mommi2four:
I’m a young Catholic, 26, My parents were Charismatics and I truly believe that it help me be closer to Christ. I also found many other my age have done so because of the movement. Actually, a fellow mom, who is a traditional catholic,emailed about how she met a charismatic and was amazed. Any how, traditional and charismatic, who cares, we are all here because of God. Our journey is between God and ourselves. So please stop the arguements. I’ll pray for everyone 🙂 Peace with all of you.
Discussions are good–We all need to be aware of the abuses in the Charismatic movement, so we can appreciate the authentic groups, and know the difference. We also need to make people realize that there are authentic and abusive Charismatics, just as there authentic and abusive in any other group. I just hate it when people judge the whole Charismatic movement on some abuses—which most of the time they haven’t even seen themselves—just some second hand information.http://forums.catholic-questions.org/images/icons/icon8.gif

SuZ
 
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mommi2four:
… Any how, traditional and charismatic, who cares, we are all here because of God. Our journey is between God and ourselves. So please stop the arguements. I’ll pray for everyone 🙂 Peace with all of you.
Hi Mommi2four,
You are totally on the mark! Keep up the prayers!
Blessings,
Annunciata
 
Tru Dvotion, in all of your posts, you have been completely subjective in your attacks. First, you start talking about how bishops support the Charismatic Renewal, but you must have special permission to have the tridentine mass in your diocese. That, right up front, shows envie, envie of Chrarismatics for worshiping the way we would like, and you not being able to celebrate the liturgy you would want. Envie isn’t a good thing. Second, since you don’t like the way you can’t worship the way you want, but Charismatics can, you start attacking charismatic worship. You say a whole bunch of things about it, saying it’s completely based of feelings, that it’s basically all from protestantism, you compare the Charismatic Renewal to the lives of the saints and say that it’s false because none of the saints were Charismatics, and you go on to say that the tongues are false, being slain in the spirit is false, you say a whole lot of things are false without proof. You’re simply giving your jealous opinion, and thinking that what’s right for you, is right for everyone. You think that there is a right way to worship God, and there’s a wrong way, basically, the wrong way is when it leaves “your way” limits.

People over and over again have made points about how you are completely wrong, and how you need to stop beating up on this, because you don’t even know what you’re talking about for the most part, but you keep on bringing things up rapid fire. For everything that someone says, no matter how legitimate, no matter how intelligent, no matter how true, no matter how it completely tears everything you say, apart, you still keep coming back with retorts that completely consist of YOUR OPINION. You are no theologian, you are no ordained personel, you have no authority, you have no right to denounce, you have no focus, but to conform everyone here to your frame of mind and your way of thinking, that you aren’t even realizing that while you’re trying to basically, convert everyone to your side, you don’t even have “a side”, as in, a side that actually stands. Your side is what is in your own head. Yes, there are many ignoramuses out there, who think the way you do, but you don’t even have anything to back you up. All you have is jealousy, opinion, high-mindedness, and the wool over your eyes. You have no legitimate reason to do what you’re doing, and you should stop. I asked, in my first post, for people’s opinions. EVERY SINGLE TIME SOMEONE POSTS A THREAD ASKING FOR
STRICTLY OPINIONS, someone has to take it to a completely different level. They start trying to get people to think the way they do, instead of either:
posting facts
or
posting opinions.

A nice little thread all of the sudden turns into a mud-slinging contest. You destroy the point of the whole thread, and it was TO GET PEOPLE’S OPINIONS ON AN ISSUE OR A TOPIC, NOT TO GET PEOPLE’S **** COMING OUT OF THE WRONG WAY, BECAUSE THE ISSUES THEY HAVE WITH SOMETHING, IS MAKING A HUGE PLUG IN THEIR FIGURATIVE DIGESTIVE TRACK, AND NOW, ALL THE **** THEY HAVE BECAUSE OF IT, CAN’T LEAVE THE RIGHT WAY, SO IT’S COMING UP THEIR ESOPHAGUSES!

Every single one of you, this thread was not meant for bickering. People who want the bickering to stop, RIGHT ON, I DO TOO! 👍 But when people post their opnions at risk of being bashed, it becomes something that it wasn’t intended to be, so please, bashers, TRU DVOTION, FATHER OF BASHERS IN THIS THREAD, please stop. 😃
 
Whether you don’t like the Charismatic music, worship, handslapping and raising, etc. Or you do not like the Traditional Mass or music at those Masses, etc. Doesn’t mean either are wrong! Because we are all Catholic and share the same Truth and same Doctrines and Beliefs. Think about it. We don’t change Religions because we have bad homilies or music or bad cantors at our Church. It is not about that. It is about the Truth that the Catholic Church is. This is Truth! Just because people don’t like to put their hands in the air or clap because that is not their personality or demeanor doesn’t mean the people that are Charismatic are wrong. We still believe the same things because we are Catholic. There are people at Charismatic Masses or Worship services that do not clap or jump up and down. You don’t have to do it. You can still be there and participate in it even if you don’t like to do that. Just like at a Traditional Mass people may not like the particular music that day or the Priest giving the Homily but we sit through it. We don’t become Protestant because we don’t like these things. Because we know this is Truth. Whether Charismatic or not. This is Truth. It is about Faith. I challenge those who do not agree with the Charismatic Renewal to pray about it sincerly and try to be open to what God tells you about it. He will show you clearly. He is not trying to trick us. Ask him. Have Faith. He will answer. Remember, ask and you shall recieve. Thanks for listening to me. God Bless you all.
 
You know, I am getting a little tired of this whole thread. What happened to honest and open discussion? Instead we have to resort to mud slinging as another has already said. I AM A CHARASMATIC AND DAMN PROUD OF IT!!! I will never change and I know in my heart that what I am doing is okay with my Jesus. Apperantly the five thousand plus parishoners at my church agree. Anyway, you have yours and I have mine, although we all worship the same God. I guess in answer to the original question, which is what we all should have stuck to, I love it…:tiphat: Good day…
 
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tru_dvotion:
Sorry if I cannot share the others enthusiasm with Annie’s attempt to make sense of the Renewal as she lumps some unorthodox stuff in the same pot with validly Catholic spiritualities. It makes as much sense to lump new age in with Catholicism as it is to categorize all ingestible material under food. Although some may even get digested by the human body, but other things, like bark will only harm it when ingested. A way back Corpus Cristi misunderstood how I used the term convert, and became quite defensive about it. But now the thought occurred to me, I am debating with converts, whose faith formation has included some rather unpalatable nourishment at one time or another, and as old habits die hard, how could they always distinguish between what is actually Catholic and what never can be. There are, after all, far fewer converts who come into Catholic orthodoxy than into Catholic Liberalism. This may indicate the type of converts we are attracting or this may cast a shadow on our RCIA program? At any rate, all of our faith formation goes until the day we breathe our last. It would be lunacy to presuppose, that a convert could, without fail, objectively determine what Catholic is and what foreign is; when in fact it may only be masquerading as something Catholic. I do not know Corpus Cristi, but Roberta, you never really got it, because almost as soon as you became a Catholic, you were also* converted* into the Renewal. You may go through some of the motions of being a Catholic, but you remain yet to be converted into Catholicism. Because Catholics converting into Protestantism will not survive the test of time, hard as you and others may try, as many bishops or even members of the Pope’s own household may try, it will never sail into the sunset indefinitely. Now you all have a blessed Sunday and I shall leave you to continue on your light play with your faith. Yours truly will remain deadly serious about it. It IS after all, a matter of life and death. God bless!
Tru–

I am appalled that as a Catholic, you seem to reserve the job of judgement for yourself. “Charisma” simply means “gifts”. Certainly you cannot disagree that to be Catholic is to be gifted.

You state, wrongly so, that most converts convert to a Liberal Catholicism. The majority of the converts I am aware of are highly Orthodox in their faith. How do you think they got there? Most made a long study of the Church, her doctrines, Early Church Fathers, etc.

We have no charismatic Masses in our area, or I would attend them. I LOVE the quiet reverence of the Catholic Mass…but I hate that much of our music sounds either like a funeral, or like a tutty fruity 60’s love fest.

The very word “Eucharist” means “thanksgiving”. So, why shouldn’t our music reflect this Thanksgiving?

Br. Mike Maturen, M.Div., B.S.R.
Brothers and Sisters of Reconciliation

mikematuren.com
 
i once heard someone say this once “it is better to keep your palms open when God gives you something, so he’d be able to give you more. If you have your palms closed you’ll prevent God from giving you other graces”

Please keep that in mind people. 🙂 May God Bless us all.
 
Greetings Church

I can’t tell you how my heart swells at some of the posts I’ve been reading. I can just only imagine how God must be touched to see how much you love worshipping and loving Him and feeling all the emotions that involves. It is so inspiring for folks to read how much the Holy Spirit has done in your lives.

It reminds me of the scripture that says, “…you cannot say Jesus is Lord except through the Holy Spirit”. Scripture also talks about how Spirutual people can understand things of the Spirit but *Worldly *people understand things of the world. I am paraphrasing, of course. The point is, unless you are fully involved with the Holy Spirit and Spiritual things, they truly do look like folly. Worldly folks do not understand Spiritual things.

When people say that NO doctors of the Church, Mystics, Contemplatives, Orthodox, or any scripture or cathechism …
you understand what I mean, anybody that makes sweeping statements as if they had read everything that has ever been written on any subject and knows that everyone agrees with them, this person has a major problem. And if anyone of these disagrees with them, even if it the Holy Father, himself (the very successor of St Peter!!!) has to be being misled by some Vatican Ghost Writer! And this to steal from the Holy Spirit, the Glory of all the Worship and Praise given Him. For what reason? Because this person dislikes the manifestation of certain gifts. They have decided that they have greater discernement and authority than the Holy Father, himself.

I do not like making strong statements like this. Sometimes, it is called for. Those times are when other people who are asking really valid questions in a very sincere way are searching for the Truth. In cases like this, I think they are entitled to hear all sides. However, I think they should hear the real truth. It is not the real truth when someone says things like "no contemplative has ever… ", as if this person knows what every contemplative has experienced … this is indeed what they are implying.

It is good that so many of you stand firm and tell your own experiences. I am proud of you. You are witnessing God’s own Truth.
 
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tru_dvotion:
As misericordie quoted Saint Thomas Aquinas; passions should be subjected to the SUPERIOR power of the Will and the Intellect. I disagree with your earlier statement. (At least I think it was your comment.) Charismatics do NOT subject their passions to the will and intellect. They subject their passions to their OWN will and intellect and resent and refuse any other. They simply will not have testing and/or discernment. They cannot do anything wrong at all, because supposedly they are being led by the Spirit. What spirit I ask? They all lack in objectivity, not only on this forum, but just about everywhere else. They get angry and will charge you to be instrument of the Devil, but they will not under any circumstance subject themselves to testing nor will they consider for a minute that what they do at their meetings might all be in error. Yet Paul left for them ample warnings. Paul warned about the evil spirits too. Paul instructed to test everything and hold onto only what is good and discard everything else. Though charismatics quote St Paul, they ignore all his rules. Instead of two praying, they have sometimes hundreds praying in tongues at a time. The slaying in the spirit is a pure Protestant invention, and is neither Scriptural, nor Catholic. My posts on examining falling has been ridiculed, but I tell you, reasoning IS part of discernment! We simply cannot find one single Bible passage for the slaying in the spirit! Also, they lay hands on one another wily-nily. There is your surest way for transference of evil spirits, how dense can people be?
YES!! I AGREEE BINGO!!!👍
 
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suellen:
Since it has taken me two hours of reading all the above comments and responses regarding the Charismatic Movement, I feel compelled to comment. My first reaction to all this is to say, Children, Children, please stop your bickering! One of the fruits of the Holy Spirit is Peace. And so, I say to you, Peace be with you!

Jesus baptized me in the Holy Spirit Sept 20, 1976, with the evidence of speaking in tongues, and although I had been a practicing, cradle Catholic for 45 years, it wasn’t until then that He opened my eyes (for I was blind), and my ears to hear Him (and gave me an insatiable hunger for His Word); He loosed the binds around me (for I was a captive to my own inhibitions) and freed me to lift my arms in praise of him, and set my feet to dancing for the joy I felt. Jesus has been the focus and love of my life ever since. If my responses to His love offend you or you feel they are not theologically or biblically sound, I suggest you begin today to pray to Jesus and ask Him to fill you, immerse you, baptize you in the Holy Spirit. Be open to receive only the Holy Spirit, and by faith receive and believe. Then you will understand what it is like, and the Scriptures will come alive, and your heart will overflow. Be not afraid!

In the love of Jesus, I will be praying for you.
We must be very careful with the protestant/pentecostal so called: “baptism in the Spirit.” There is no such thing in the CATHOLIC CHURCH. In the Catholic Church the ONLY Baptism is the SACRAMENTAL BAPTISM. It is statements like “I was baptized in the spirit” which leads many to precisely reject the charismatic renewal movement as in essence, pentecostal/protestant.
 
I have felt the presence of the Holy Spirit more at a Divine Liturgy then at a Charismatic Mass. The Divine Liturgy is nearly entirely sung, it is often celebrated in Greek or Old Slavonic (Tounges). The Liturgy is so joyful and uplifting. I always go to one when I have faith issues, or when I’m down in the dumps. But, then again, most Charismatics don’t even know about the Divine Liturgy.
 
Psalm45:9:
I have felt the presence of the Holy Spirit more at a Divine Liturgy then at a Charismatic Mass. The Divine Liturgy is nearly entirely sung, it is often celebrated in Greek or Old Slavonic (Tounges). The Liturgy is so joyful and uplifting. I always go to one when I have faith issues, or when I’m down in the dumps. But, then again, most Charismatics don’t even know about the Divine Liturgy.
And how would you know what most Charismatics know? Have you spoken to most Charismatics?

This is the problem—people thinking they know something when they really don’t. It doesn’t matter if Charismatics know about Divine Liturgy. And I doubt your reference to Tongues is anything like a prayer or praise tongue, which are the most common in Charismatic worship.

You like your form of worshhip. That is wonderful.

Charismatics like their form of worship, and their emphesis on the gifts of the Spirit. Whatever legitimate form of worship you choose (of course Catholic, if you are a Catholic) is wonderful. These are all options, and everyone should try to find the worship style best suited to them—we are fortunate that we do have choices.

SuZ
 
Since this thread is about opinion of the movement:

Why does it need to be love or hate. I, personally, am total uninterested in every taking part of Charismatic movement in the Catholic Church. I already went down that road before I joined the Church. I would never argue against the movement, lest I find myself fighting the Holy Spirit. I will accept it, even if it elements of the movement are made part of the liturgy I attend (by the Church, not as an abuse).

You are a vital part of the Church and may God bless all of you and keep you (far away from my parish).🙂
 
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Mysty101:
These are all options, and everyone should try to find the worship style best suited to them—we are fortunate that we do have choices.
That’s an excellent point. So then why are we frowned on if we like the mIssal of 1962? Why are we so often denied to recive Christ in that Liturgical setting, especially when the Pope said we have that right?
 
Psalm45:9:
That’s an excellent point. So then why are we frowned on if we like the mIssal of 1962? Why are we so often denied to recive Christ in that Liturgical setting, especially when the Pope said we have that right?
Ok—I’ll try.

The Charismatic movement is an approved movement of the Church . Allowances are made for certain differences in styly, mostly of music (The GIRM does specify the parts when there is an option–I believe it is entrance, offertory and Communion songs–I don’t have time to check it right now)

The 1962 missal has been revised, and while it is not to be considered disobedient to follow certain procedures, it is preferred to use the current norms.

I believe Charismatic style would also be discouraged in a NO Mass.

SuZ
 
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