Connecticut school shooting: Lawmakers offer prayers amid calls for gun control

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Zeno11 said:
Why would a Catholic person own a gun? Does the 5th commandment not apply to you? What else is a gun for?
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I’ve never murdered anyone with my gun.
2263 The legitimate defense of persons and societies is not an exception to the prohibition against the murder of the innocent that constitutes intentional killing. "The act of self-defense can have a double effect: the preservation of one’s own life; and the killing of the aggressor. . . . The one is intended, the other is not."65
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2264 Love toward oneself remains a fundamental principle of morality. Therefore it is legitimate to insist on respect for one’s own right to life. Someone who defends his life is not guilty of murder even if he is forced to deal his aggressor a lethal blow:
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If a man in self-defense uses more than necessary violence, it will be unlawful: whereas if he repels force with moderation, his defense will be lawful. . . . Nor is it necessary for salvation that a man omit the act of moderate self-defense to avoid killing the other man, since one is bound to take more care of one’s own life than of another’s.66
2265 Legitimate defense can be not only a right but a grave duty for one who is responsible for the lives of others. The defense of the common good requires that an unjust aggressor be rendered unable to cause harm. For this reason, those who legitimately hold authority also have the right to use arms to repel aggressors against the civil community entrusted to their responsibility.
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vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p3s2c2a5.htm
 
Zeno11 said:
Why would a Catholic person own a gun? Does the 5th commandment not apply to you? What else is a gun for?
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Obviously, Self Defense.

I’ve seen stories before where say and it’s happened in a number of states where a fast food restaurant is robbed, people paraded into the food locker and executed. So at least nowadays, there have been beefed up laws in some states for people to defend themselves.
 
Is it no wonder killing children is no problem,after all it is done everyday in the abortion clinics as legal. The killers final end should tell us, in the end he knew wrong from right.

God Bless
 
Zeno11 said:
So what happened to ‘turn the other cheek’? What did Jesus do when Peter struck the guard with his sword? A gun has no other function but to murder, and I do not see how you can follow Christ and carry a gun.
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These are good issues to discuss, should we remember in the days of the Founding Fathers, the Puritans and Quakers probably shared beliefs to not carry firearms. They were very pacifist and some attended the Constitutional Convention.
 
Zeno11 said:
So what happened to ‘turn the other cheek’? What did Jesus do when Peter struck the guard with his sword? A gun has no other function but to murder, and I do not see how you can follow Christ and carry a gun.
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It doesn’t? Mine must be malfunctioning, along with millions upon millions of others.
 
Last year handguns killed
48 people in Japan
8 in Great Britain
34 in Switzerland
52 in Canada
58 in Israel
21 in Sweden
42 in West Germany
**10, 728 in the United States

God Bless America**
 
ringil said:
15,000,000 or more people live in NYC.
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The 9 states with the lowest violent crime rates are right to carry concealed weapon states. 31 states that have ‘shall issue’ laws that allow concealed weapons to be carried by registered citziens have average 19% lower murder rate, 39% lower robbery rate, 24% violent crime rate than states that do not allow concealed weapons

NYC population is 8.2 million

According to FBI stats from 1991, homicide rates are lowest in states with few gun control laws: Maine, North Dakota, South Dakota, Iowa, Montana and Idaho and higher homocide rates are in states with gun bans and strict gun control laws such as New York, California, Illinois, Maryland, D C

Switzerland and Israel allow carrying of concealed weapons and guns to be be bought with a license. Foremost advocate of gun control, Dr Arthur Kellerman has said Switzerland and Israel

have rates of homicide that are low despite rates of home firearm ownership that are at least as high as those in the United States
 
Bill_Martin said:
It doesn’t? Mine must be malfunctioning, along with millions upon millions of others.
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I don’t hold out much hope for the future of the USA when even the Christians think they should be armed.
Can you really picture Jesus Christ with a handgun?!!
 
Mass school killings are a new thing. If you take a look at this list, there were none until after WWI (Bath, Michigan massacre). Then, after WWII and the 1960’s, they became more common. As a nation we lost something along the way. With all the people carrying guns in the “Wild West”, nobody indiscriminately murdered dozens of children. I think it is no coincidence that it became common after the 60’s.
 
Zeno11 said:
Last year handguns killed
48 people in Japan
8 in Great Britain
34 in Switzerland
52 in Canada
58 in Israel
21 in Sweden
42 in West Germany
**10, 728 in the United States

God Bless America**
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Source for the statistic? Apparently it is from 1979, not from last year. There is not even an official West Germany anymore. American population is much higher than any of the other countries above and the gun rate is probably not taken into consideration with the statistic. How many people were killed by guns in the countries above if the population of the countries equals America?
 
Everyone agrees crazy people shouldn’t have guns. 🤷

Their is “no” new gun control which would have stopped a delusional individual from stealing another individuals firearm, be it his friends or parents. Nor does it look at the deeper rooted issue. Those residents planned a Christmas tree lighting event, and wound up at the local Vigil in Church.

The idea of not allowing 40% of individuals who shouldn’t legally own a firearm anyway, or monitoring trade shows where guns can be bought illegal, no one has an issue with that.

The Guns is the clanging cymbal that distracts from the bigger issue. Why all these psychotic breaks from reality, we have a situation where suicide becomes part of the grand plan. And a developed pattern of this behavior just confirms a prevailing issue.
 
Zeno11 said:
I don’t hold out much hope for the future of the USA when even the Christians think they should be armed.
Can you really picture Jesus Christ with a handgun?!!
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Why not? There are tons of things to do with a handgun that are not evil.
 
_Abyssinia said:
Source for the statistic? Apparently it is from 1979, not from last year. There is not even an official West Germany anymore. American population is much higher than any of the other countries above and the gun rate is probably not taken into consideration with the statistic. How many people were killed by guns in the countries above if the population of the countries equals America?
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Excuse me, those figures are so out of date, they were sent to me by a friend.

In 2011, 31,224 died from handgun shootings in the USA, and over 66,000 people were injured.
Are you in the middle of a civil war or something over there?

With less than 5% of the world’s population, the United States is home to roughly 35–50 per cent of the world’s civilian-owned guns, heavily skewing the global geography of firearms and any relative comparison.

(Source: UNODC)
 
Zeno11 said:
So what happened to ‘turn the other cheek’? What did Jesus do when Peter struck the guard with his sword? A gun has no other function but to murder, and I do not see how you can follow Christ and carry a gun.
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Per the Catechism:

The legitimate defense of persons and societies is not an exception to the prohibition against the murder of the innocent that constitutes intentional killing.

“Self defense” is not “murder”. That’s NOT a position the Church holds, and it’s highly uncharitable to suggest such.

Christ told Peter to put away the sword so that the scriptures would be fulfilled. He told Peter to sheath his sword, not get rid of it.
Do you think that I cannot call upon my Father and he will not provide me at this moment with more than twelve legions of angels?
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But then how would the scriptures be fulfilled which say that it must come to pass in this way?"
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But all this has come to pass that the writings of the prophets may be fulfilled." Then all the disciples left him and fled.
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It used to be that guns were easy to get, and bloodbaths like yesterday were unheard of. Today, it’s harder than ever to get a gun, and these things happen all too frequently.

Guns have been around for a LONG TIME… so riddle me this, Batman: years ago when guns were more widely owned, why did mass murders like Newtown and Columbine not happen then?

I think it’s PEOPLE who need to change. Not the Law. It makes me very angry that people DEVOLVED to the point where things like the Newtown shooting take place. The gunman took his weapons from his mother, didn’t he? She legally purchased them. He was NOT authorized to own them. They weren’t his. If we prohibit gun ownership, prohibition will only take them away from law-abiding citizens.
 
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