Connecticut school shooting: Lawmakers offer prayers amid calls for gun control

[irishpatrick]

The problem is the two are not connected in the way that you propose it, and I doubt it’s even being discussed outside this forum.

I agree, but there is no reason the Republicans cannot bring it to the table with the Democrats. The GOP can take the lead.

They can easily state they are against further gun control, but are willing to talk about it if the Democrats are willing to discuss a compromise.

 

[Bill_Martin]

I think people should take some responsibility for their own safety.

Has anyone here heard of ACT Cert?

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From flipping through their site, it looks like a decent program. I took a carbine course offered by Blackwater, but that was focused more on shooting. Still valuable training though and I would encourage every gun owner to get some.

 

[irishpatrick]

When it came to forum polls, they were way off compared to the national sentiment. I would guess the same would hold true to this poll on this thread.

Oh, yes I agree.

 

[JohnVictor]

The Church does say one can defend themselves, however the men of the Church call for controls on guns, particularly in America. The self defense teaching is short of supporting all gun rights as is being proposed on these forums.

The AR15 is a duplicate of the military style weapon, only it’s not fully automatic. They will fire the same bullets as the military style weapon. I have seen many hunters, while on trips, and none ever use such a weapon for hunting. Also, many people upon seeing one instantly connects the weapon to an ‘assault style weapon.’ It’s not about semantics brother.

1. There are already controls on guns in America.
2. You are obviously ignorant about guns, The AR type guns to which you refer are the most popular hunting and ranch rifles in use today.

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[Prodigal_Son1]

I agree, but there is no reason the Republicans cannot bring it to the table with the Democrats. The GOP can take the lead.

It would be nice, but I don’t see them making any concessions now when they failed to make any to assure a different outcome in the election. They could have given on the social issues to promote the pro life issue. Since the election some of the GOP has suggested softening on the important issues, to promote their views on the other issues.

 

[austenbosten]

Why do you want to ban the SSRI’s (antidepressants)? Do you think the side-effects of the medication caused his behavior since teenagers on such medications have to be monitored closely?

Yes, I have seen the effects of SSRIs and it’s not pretty. These are dangerous mind-altering drugs that are constantly being over-prescribed by doctors. They shouldn’t be allowed. All of these mass-murdering shooters were on an SSRI.

Okay, yet you have given-up trying to change the culture for the better, as if God is powerless to help us improve the country. We are called by God, and our faith, to be the light of Christ, even when it is most diffficult to do so…to focus only on yourself means you will not share the light of Christ with the world.

It is not too late.

I haven’t given up, I’m just looking at this realistically. Christendom is dead! It’s been dead for a long time in this nation. You’re nuts to think that it’s getting better, it’s not. Not until this evil culture comes crashing down just like Babylon, just like Rome, just like Soviet Russia.

On top of that the Church is going through serious problems. I’d much rather focus on the Church than the culture…cultures come and go…there is only ONE CHURCH!

 

[irishpatrick]

It would be nice, but I don’t see them making any concessions now when they failed to make any to assure a different outcome in the election. They could have given on the social issues to promote the pro life issue. Since the election some of the GOP has suggested softening on the important issues, to promote their views on the other issues.

Perhaps you are right…but maybe we should tell them this is something productive to pursue. Hey, it would give the GOP something positive in a time they need positives, and it would give the Democrats the major feather in their cap of tightening gun control. Win win.

 

[Brendan]

You could ban guns completely and people would manage to get them illegally from Mexico or somewhere else

Or make them.

I’ve made several firearms in my basement, using tools readily availble at Home Depot or Lowes.

In my case, they have been replicas of early period flintlock and wheelocks, but there is no reason that I could not have produced revolvers or even a submachine gun.

The WW-II British Sten gun, for example, was designed specifically to be produced in garage shops. The Jewish Zionists under the British administration of Palestine, produced those in substantial numbers. In one case, in was in the basement of a laudry shop that served British officers. The noise of the washers and dryers was used to cover up the noise of the gunshop below… while at the same time, British officers were dropping off their laundry ")

The skill set required is not all that extensive. I’m not a metal worker at all, (my degree is in COmputer Engineering , but I was able to figure things out well enough to cut out gun parts on a band saw and grind, file and buff them as needed.

Contrast that to the chemical knowledge need to fab up most illegal drugs. And that is not even counting the special tools, chemicals and raw materials. As I mentioned the tools I needed I got a Lowes, as most of the metal too, either there or at the local scrap shop. The only ‘exotic’ material I needed was some really nice cherry and curly maple woodstock

If there was a general gun band, I would expect such gun shops turning up in every major city (minus the curly maple, but I suppose even that could be included for a price). And those shops would not be doing single guns, but mass producing them A gun would be no more difficult to obtain in any city than a bag of pot is right now.

Another interesting thing is 3D printing. For those who are unaware, it is technology that uses either plastic (at the low end) or lasers to melt metal powder (at the high end) and form objects. Just like a printer does, but in layer after layer. Feed in your design, and out comes the object, fully formed.

There is an ‘Open Source’ project that offers download object files that produce guns. If you have access to one of these machines, just feed in the file and in a few hours, you have a functional, if limited, firearm.

youtube.com/watch?v=AQ6Q3BfbVBU&feature=player_embedded

How would THAT fit into a gun ban.

 

[irishpatrick]

Yes, I have seen the effects of SSRIs and it’s not pretty. These are dangerous mind-altering drugs that are constantly being over-prescribed by doctors. They shouldn’t be allowed. All of these mass-murdering shooters were on an SSRI.

I haven’t given up, I’m just looking at this realistically. Christendom is dead! It’s been dead for a long time in this nation. You’re nuts to think that it’s getting better, it’s not. Not until this evil culture comes crashing down just like Babylon, just like Rome, just like Soviet Russia.

On top of that the Church is going through serious problems. I’d much rather focus on the Church than the culture…cultures come and go…there is only ONE CHURCH!

I never said the nation or culture is getting better, it is certainly not getting better. I am saying that we are called to try to make it better.

This thread saddens me greatly. I see only a couple people who actually feel like God is still in control and can still help us turn this mess around. The rest are still clamoring for guns, guns, guns, without much thought to helping the culture.

Oh well…I am out, at least for now.

 

[JohnVictor]

From flipping through their site, it looks like a decent program. I took a carbine course offered by Blackwater, but that was focused more on shooting. Still valuable training though and I would encourage every gun owner to get some.

Check this out Bill.
Of course the libs here will say teens can’t actually do this and defend themselves…
That they should just cower and pray… like helpless sheep.

youtube.com/watch?v=r2tIeRUbRHw

edited for spelling

 

[chadair]

It’s a right I would gladly give up if it saved lives. Wouldn’t you?

what gaurentee do u have that it would???

Stringent gun control laws do nothing but cut off access to guns for law abiding people. Criminals do not care about the law.

Somehow this fact seems to overlooked again and again by gun control advocates.

So when a gunman shoots down people, the average law-abiding gun owner is punished.

because it’s a point they have NO answer for!! the only agenda is to take guns away from law abiding folks!!

Good grief! How can rely on any news source as they all said that Ryan’s Mother was a teacher although in every interview with a citizen of Newtown nobody has ever heard of the Mother.

If his Mother didn’t teach there then it raises new questions about how he got passed security in entering the building.

what someone else said. he broke the glass

So what’s the solution to mass murders such as this? Continue the status quo and hope you or your kids aren’t next?

2 words, God and Discipline!! there wasn’t gothic children when we was growin up. If yer parents didn’t like what u was doin, and they told u, u had 2 choices, Change or carry a good ol fashion spanking!!

Instead, how about having strict gun control regulations in every state?

and here again, all that does is prevent LAW ABIDING citizens from gettin guns. NOT criminals!!

I can under stand the age old sport of hunting,but I would never choose it in this day…
Tell me why you must buy a hand gun? Is it simply to own one because you love the idea? As in the early days of America and the settling of the west?. The Cowboys and the Indians and that memory:shrug:
Soldiers and Law enforcement ,common sense, it’s understood.
For other reasons, in my opinion guns are obscene.

Peace, Carlan

if u wish NOT to own a gun, than by all means it’s yer right NOT too, but PLEASE do NOT try and remove my right cause u find it unnecessary in yer life

 

[austenbosten]

I never said the nation or culture is getting better, it is certainly not getting better. I am saying that we are called to try to make it better. Sitting by and letting things fall apart, and souls be lost by the millions, is NOT what Christians are called to do.

It is possible that if everything fell apart, Christian culture might rise. It is also possible that if everything fell apart the world would suffer centuries of darkness. We are called to try to prevent that while we can.

How can we do that when:

20% of Catholics pray once a month or less
28% of Catholic don’t believe or are uncertain there is a god
10% of Catholics don’t believe religion isn’t important
80% of Catholics believe there are multiple ways to interpret the Teachings of the Church

You can go try and save this evil culture by spreading the News…I’m going to try and focus on the Church, because I find that more important than the culture…as for the last thing. No Christian was called to prevent Israel or Rome from collapsing…they are called to follow Christ, not the culture.

 

[EmperorNapoleon]

1. There are already controls on guns in America.

Hardly. 40% of gun sales are done without so much as a background check. It is extraordinarily easy for the criminally minded to build their own arsenals through legal channels.

 

[JohnVictor]

Hardly. 40% of gun sales are done without so much as a background check. It is extraordinarily easy for the criminally minded to build their own arsenals through legal channels.

no link?

Gotta call bull on that one. Unless that’s private sales… then how would they get that info? Give us a link… then we’ll talk more.

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[Brendan]

The Church does say one can defend themselves, however the men of the Church call for controls on guns, particularly in America. The self defense teaching is short of supporting all gun rights as is being proposed on these forums.

The AR15 is a duplicate of the military style weapon, only it’s not fully automatic. They will fire the same bullets as the military style weapon. I have seen many hunters, while on trips, and none ever use such a weapon for hunting. Also, many people upon seeing one instantly connects the weapon to an ‘assault style weapon.’ It’s not about semantics brother.

FYI, the round that the AR15 fires DID come from a hunting weapon. The .223 Remington was developed as a ‘varmit’ grade round. It was designed to be effective against fox, coyote and other small game.

You are correct that no one hunts larger game with that round, it’s too underpowered to reliably take down a deer or anything larger.

But that fits in well with the assault weapon armament. An assault weapon, by defintion, uses an ‘intermediate’ round, one about half way between a pistol cartridge and a full rifle calibre. It allows the solider to carry more ammo with a given weight. Where a solider from WW-II typically carried 60 rounds of .30-06, a current solider will carry 200+ rounds of 5.56.223, same weight.

Here in MI. it is actually illegal to use .223 to hunt deer, (a .30 or higher round is required) but it is the still the most common round for use against fox and coyote.

If your hunting friends are ever helping a farmer get rid of fox, an AR-15 is what they would probably use. But for deer or larger, you are correct, they will almost certainly use something substantially more powerful than an ‘assault rifle’.

 

[chadair]

Hardly. 40% of gun sales are done without so much as a background check. It is extraordinarily easy for the criminally minded to build their own arsenals through legal channels.

wow!! do u have anything to back such a statement, or just yer point of view?

Im not arguinin the fact that a criminal could possibly buy a gun from another criminal, but to say that registered gun dealers do NOT do a background check 40% of the time is uneducated at best!!

I can assure u, EVERY new gun I have ever bought, I have gone threw a background check!

 

[BroomWagon]

I agree that this is a valid concern. However, I don’t think we know whether the medication caused the behavior or the disorder it was, unsuccessfully, treating caused it.

We may not get the straight news as far as medications go but we seem to know all or a lot of these people have had some psychological problems, think they said this guy in Oregon had been committed.

 

[Prodigal_Son1]

FYI, the round that the AR15 fires DID come from a hunting weapon. The .223 Remington was developed as a ‘varmit’ grade round. It was designed to be effective against fox, coyote and other small game.

You are correct that no one hunts larger game with that round, it’s too underpowered to reliably take down a deer or anything larger.

But that fits in well with the assault weapon armament. An assault weapon, by defintion, uses an ‘intermediate’ round, one about half way between a pistol cartridge and a full rifle calibre. It allows the solider to carry more ammo with a given weight. Where a solider from WW-II typically carried 60 rounds of .30-06, a current solider will carry 200+ rounds of 5.56.223, same weight.

Here in MI. it is actually illegal to use .223 to hunt deer, (a .30 or higher round is required) but it is the still the most common round for use against fox and coyote.

If your hunting friends are ever helping a farmer get rid of fox, an AR-15 is what they ould probably use. But for deer or larger, you are correct, they will almost certainly use something substantially more powerful than an ‘assault rifle’.

While the AR15 may have come from a hunting rifle, it has striking resemblances to the M16 I used in the military. They both use the same caliber bullet.

I’ve never hunted fox, but have hunted, hogs, deer, turkey, quail, dove, and squirrels. I’ve used shotguns, 30 06, .and 22 rifles. The larger shotguns and 30 06 for deer.

Besides pistols, what type weapons are mass killers using, in general; what does the public identify those weapons as?

 

[JohnVictor]

FYI, the round that the AR15 fires DID come from a hunting weapon. The .223 Remington was developed as a ‘varmit’ grade round. It was designed to be effective against fox, coyote and other small game.

You are correct that no one hunts larger game with that round, it’s too underpowered to reliably take down a deer or anything larger.

But that fits in well with the assault weapon armament. An assault weapon, by defintion, uses an ‘intermediate’ round, one about half way between a pistol cartridge and a full rifle calibre. It allows the solider to carry more ammo with a given weight. Where a solider from WW-II typically carried 60 rounds of .30-06, a current solider will carry 200+ rounds of 5.56.223, same weight.

Here in MI. it is actually illegal to use .223 to hunt deer, (a .30 or higher round is required) but it is the still the most common round for use against fox and coyote.

If your hunting friends are ever helping a farmer get rid of fox, an AR-15 is what they ould probably use. But for deer or larger, you are correct, they will almost certainly use something substantially more powerful than an ‘assault rifle’.

They might use an AR in .308, which many hunters here use, and btw…
none are assault rifles.

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[chadair]

While the AR15 may have come from a hunting rifle, it has striking resemblances to the M16 I used in the military. They both use the same caliber bullet.

I’ve never hunted fox, but have hunted, hogs, deer, turkey, quail, dove, and squirrels. I’ve used shotguns, 30 06, .and 22 rifles. The larger shotguns and 30 06 for deer.

Besides pistols, what type weapons are mass killers using, in general; what does the public identify those weapons as?

Im sorry if I’ve missed something. but yer sayin we should ban AR’s cause the overall perception of the uninformed sees it as a mass killer?