Easy Life of an Atheist

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Haha! Yes, some of my best friends are atheists, and they all have graduate degrees. I wonder if they can read… 😉
 
Also, as with any type of believer, atheists come in many stripes. Some have reached a genuine belief that God doesn’t exist after consudered reading, yet lead lives that are totally morally upright. Others are ill informed and immoral. There’s a huge spectrum in between in terms of being informed or moral.
 
but having been exposed to thousands of hours of anti-religious bigotry off all sorts.
Who are these people?
And, again, best reflection of such is utter poverty in the supposed “atheists” discourse reflecting only the most common places in the most uncritical manner.
I suspect many atheists are quite or even closeted. For instance, I’m unlikely to discuss my lack of faith irl
 
Who are these people?
@0Scarlett_nidiyilii did the best of jobs in this thread at establishing the ubiquitous of anti-religious sophistry in media, again without specific formation in contrary you’d hardly expect the average person to acquire analytical refutations needed to contradict such overwhelming influences. And yes, there is a long history of political interests that being outright opposed to religion went to great lengths at attacking the common man’s faith.
 
You do realize a significant number of CAF’ers despite being laity (without any formal academics in religious sciences) have done an amazing job at educating themselves and are considerably above the cut knowledgeable.
There are some who are quite knowledgeable and some that are not. The same goes for atheists.
As for “atheists” there is a formal methodology regarding the matter that isn’t exclusive to Catholics but actually transverse to philosophy, sociology, anthropology, even history. I would say, you don’t seem to follow that well established method and thus stand to gain yourself and improve the discussions you get involved in researching and reflecting on the exact definitions of faith and belief in the divine.
What is this methodology you speak of that you believe a vast majority of following? Also, why the scare quotes around atheists?
You do realize that over 90% of the world population claim some belief in the divine and that makes the study quite worthy in itself.
Personally, I find the study of belief fascinating whether it is a majority or minority opinion.

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Moreover, “atheists” “come on strong” but experience shows that on the 2nd and 3rd interview some form of belief actually emerges, the outright negation of religion seeming trendy is just an illusion of first glance.
First thing, there are quite a few atheists who have had to endure hardships for being an atheist, especially so in predominantly Muslim countries. The tale of Raif Badawi, if you feel like looking it up, is a perfect example.

Secondly, it’s somewhat distasteful to try and undercut fair and reasoned belief or disbelief because it differs from yours. It’s easy when we start out as people to think “This person disagrees me, so he is wrong.” As we mature we realize that reasonable people can look at the same argument (especially one grounded more in feelings than facts like the one of religion) and have them come to different conclusions.
By trying to claim that the only way one can not be impressed by the evidence for the various gods (such as it is) is through shallowness is the equivalent of putting one’s fingers in his ears and shout “LALALA!”
Reflecting foremost an almost total absence of prior study of the subject which does not mean the absence of inner unconfessed reflections. You will also notice the self-described “atheists” lack any formal reading on the matter, never actually having read a single book but having been exposed to thousands of hours of anti-religious bigotry off all sorts.
I’ve been around CAF for a few years and more than once I’ve presented hard evidence (historical, Church, or Biblical documents) and been met with assorted vagaries. Eventually as the counter-arguments wither on the vine I’m told that I’m fixated too much on the faith. In other words, I’ve done too much research and presented too many facts. For the non-believer it’s damned if you read, damned if you don’t. A few believers (and I stress a few) can’t wrap their heads around the idea that many non-believers have done the research and found the faith wanting. (Cue the meme of Principal Skinner deciding it is the children who are out of touch )
And, again, best reflection of such is utter poverty in the supposed “atheists” discourse reflecting only the most common places in the most uncritical manner.
Can any of what you said be backed up?
 
As an atheist convert to Catholicism. The morals and will to do good and love each other comes from these areas:

My mother and father

My experience of what feels good and bad in my heart… I know not to punch someone because I don’t like being punched.

At a the very complex level of grey area, outside the obvious laws I would make my own mind up and seek to understand what others think about these things too. to be part of a community.
 
Can any of what you said be backed up?
Let’s count:
why the scare quotes
One, didn’t see any “scare”.
The tale of Raif Badawi
Two, OP (and thread) in scope of western secularized (your example is derailing as broadening.)
somewhat distasteful to try and undercut
Three, that’s your subjective reading, both a judgement and accusation btw (neither of which objectively fit what I said.)
(especially one grounded more in feelings than facts like the one of religion)
Four, religion isn’t grounded on feelings.
putting one’s fingers in his ears and shout “LALALA!”
Five, you’re the only saying that so it must suit you best.
Can any of what you said be backed up?
CCC 27-49 [The catechism starts so, for a reason]. Also, starting with Durkheim, if you deem sociology as “science” and “sociology of religion” as part of it, you have 100 years of that scientific field on the “religious phenomenon” with both pearls and nonsense mixed in. Yes, there is a methodology and the CCC follows it.

As for the rest, it’s common knowledge that western societies haven fallen away from religion over the 20th century -“secularized”- that much is common knowledge (concept of “new evangelization” dispensing references within the CAF context ) and if you can’t grasp that much I won’t be called into question with challenges for “backing up” with references everything I say.

That much for “vagaries”…
 
But atheists are still made in the image of God, so they have the capacities He has, including the capacity for love even if they turn away from God.
So in a sense when atheists reject the existence of God, they are rejecting a part of themselves? Makes sense. At least with the ONE atheist I know and am speaking about now, he has a disdain for himself as well as the non-existent God.
Moreover, “atheists” “come on strong” but experience shows that on the 2nd and 3rd interview some form of belief actually emerges, the outright negation of religion seeming trendy is just an illusion of first glance.
I agree. God is in all of us. The Holy Spirit is what guides ALL our morals, whether you are a believer or not. So humans really can’t get away from what is inside of them, no matter how much they rationally say otherwise. I lived this. While I was never an atheist, I was an agnostic for many, many years and when I tried to live my life on my terms only thinking “God, has nothing to do with my life because he probably doesn’t exist anyways.” there was this continual unhappiness that I couldn’t shake. It was like God was telling me “you fool, you can’t do it all on your own, and you know I exist.”

I specifically remember the day when God’s existence was solidified in my life, he said to me “I was here all along.” Maybe MOST atheists don’t have the nudging of God in their lives, but I think they do - it’s called morals and the will to do and be good people. Admitting God is the root of that nudging is the only difference between believers and nonbelievers. A fine line.
 
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Mike_from_NJ:
assorted vagaries
😄
@FiveLinden you asked for a peer reviewed article in the other thread so here it is:


“Burden-of-proof” is now inverted as “the tables turn”, can you find a “peer reviewed” article that objectively refutes the panel juries of medical doctors who attest to cures that were miraculous. Please, do find a single such valid instance with medical examinations enclosed. [Again, it’s a risky mistake to discuss science with authors who haven’t published or having done so haven’t a critical overview of the internal logic governing the field and criteria.]
 
my conversion cam about by the realisation that the world I lived in was full of wickedness, deciet and the blatent acceptance of cruelty to ones neighbour, especially in the world of work and money. In this modern world, the dignity of work should be offered to all and we are called to do so in a peaceful and respecful way. not as a society that runs on profit “how can I get more for me and my family”. I worked in a city centre and I can say without a shadow of a doubt that God’s saving presence stops at the entrance to many a workplace… beyond the basic human rights.

this drew me toward the fact that I had been living under a slavery and my thinking was forever being subdued and offered materialistic gifts to maintain it. of course the happiness and peace that comes from these things do not last and constantly require renewing.

is there another way? yes, through the salvation and peace that comes from Jesus Christ and the love of God 🙂
 
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adgloriam:
Moreover, “atheists” “come on strong” but experience shows that on the 2nd and 3rd interview some form of belief actually emerges, the outright negation of religion seeming trendy is just an illusion of first glance.
I agree. God is in all of us. The Holy Spirit is what guides ALL our morals, whether you are a believer or not. So humans really can’t get away from what is inside of them, no matter how much they rationally say otherwise. I lived this. While I was never an atheist, I was an agnostic for many, many years and when I tried to live my life on my terms only thinking “God, has nothing to do with my life because he probably doesn’t exist anyways.” there was this continual unhappiness that I couldn’t shake. It was like God was telling me “you fool, you can’t do it all on your own, and you know I exist.”

I specifically remember the day when God’s existence was solidified in my life, he said to me “I was here all along.” Maybe MOST atheists don’t have the nudging of God in their lives, but I think they do - it’s called morals and the will to do and be good people. Admitting God is the root of that nudging is the only difference between believers and nonbelievers. A fine line.
I think this is a lovely post @Nap66, I so enjoyed reading it thank you for sharing. I fell away from religion for a time and the voice of the Holy Spirit accompanied me in my conscience and heart the same way you now described. A fine line indeed. This story is shared by so many, the story of the prodigal son, of the Lord’s calling, of divine Providence in our lives, of pilgrimage and conversion, of faith, of falling, of sin and repentance, of freedom, of being lost and seeking, and finding.

The subject in your OP was vast and addressed a multitude of aspects, the question being always:“Why?” And a fair question at that, when we are faced with life’s difficulties and our own hearts suffering. Why does God call some to believe and others don’t. Why is the reward for our good works not always evident in this life.

Some of these aspects are very hard and answering them requires time, afterthought, and God’s grace. I will say only I’m happy to see you addressing all these difficulties and admire your courage in doing so. I sense some growing Joy, Peace, and Fortitude in your writing and thus I am very happy for you 🙂

God bless.
 
So in a sense when atheists reject the existence of God, they are rejecting a part of themselves? Makes sense. At least with the ONE atheist I know and am speaking about now, he has a disdain for himself as well as the non-existent God.
Exactly. My thinking is that even the most hardened atheist (of the immoral, uninformed variety) still has a tie to God by dint of being human. There’s always that divine spark within, even if it isn’t understood or believed to exist.

I will say this—I think informed, moral atheists are some of the best allies for Catholics. They shake up our comfortable beliefs and challenge us to answer why we believe outside an emotional faith lens. Sometimes, in those conversations, our faith is strengthened or they convert. (I’m a convert from agnosticism in adulthood.)
 
Also, thank you folks for a warm and honest discussion.

The is one thing that irritates me more than anything else about some Catholics is an elitist view (which I’m not seeing here), as if we have a monopoly on morality or truth. God is one smart cookie. Do we really think he’d make access to Him so difficult that only the select have any hope of faith? I think not—there are paths to God in almost every belief or way of life.

The challenge for us is to respect God’s presence in everyone, and to share that love through our lives, with mutual respect in interacting with those of different beliefs.
 
“Burden-of-proof” is now inverted as “the tables turn”, can you find a “peer reviewed” article that objectively refutes the panel juries of medical doctors who attest to cures that were miraculous. Please, do find a single such valid instance with medical examinations enclosed. [Again, it’s a risky mistake to discuss science with authors who haven’t published or having done so haven’t a critical overview of the internal logic governing the field and criteria.]
OK - would be better t start another thread but this paper entirely agrees with my position: people think miracles occur. It doesn’t mean they do.

“Once skeptical, she says she now believes the stories — as a historian. That is, she believes in the honesty and accuracy of the players and people involved in experiencing and verifying the healing events. “These events were miracles for the people involved,” she writes in Medical Miracles: Doctors, Saints and Healing in the Modern World”.
 
Logically, it’s impossible to prove a universal negative. (ETA)
 
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