Glenn Beck says to run away from churches who preach social justice?

[Convert66]

Well, my pastor is all for it. And, I am seriously thinking about changing parishes. Am getting sick and tired of all the sly immigration pieces he puts in his homilies, the preponderance of Spanish publications in our church lobby and bi-lingual services.

I certainly believe that the Church should be helping out, not the government, and diocesan bishops shouldn’t be going to Washington to promote immigration reform, when that terrible health bill was passed yesterday and not a word about that in the homilies.

In fact, our Pastor bragged that he voted for Obama because of the health bill overlooking the fact that Obama is pro-abortion.

Yes, our Church has changed since Vatican 11 but not for the better, and we can blame part of that on radical priest and nuns who never were silenced or punished by the Magistrate.

We are reaping the results of that harvest, and then we wonder why Catholics are drifting away? Churches were filled before that in the 50’s and we gave to the poor and the Propogation of the Faith as well as many missions.

Catholic Charities were in full swing to help others, and I know the priests at that time helped people get jobs, and probably food if they needed it.

There’s an interesting piece in the new issue of First Things, written by John Lamont, in which he makes a compelling argument that strict orthodoxy, and not “inclusive ecumenical tolerance” or political posturing, is the best recipe for religious devotion and Church growth.

Another recent article made the argument that at it’s root, the real problem in our current culture with regards to religious practice and observance (as well as virtually every other social problem) can be traced to a decline in fatherhood. The most committed Catholics, and Christians (or any other religious tradition, for that matter) all share common elements at home: a mother AND a father that model and practice their faith consistently; strong fathers who strike a principled balance between compassion and discipline; insistent attendance at Mass; and, perhaps surprisingly, suffering. Those who suffer for their faith in their formative and early adult years are far more likely to keep the faith as they age than those who have an easy time of it. This makes perfect sense once we recall the early martyrs or the currently suffering Church, however.

Remove those elements and the likelihood of rejecting one’s inherited faith skyrockets. In short, people intuitively prefer a religion that makes tough demands upon them, and models that walk it out in front of them on a daily basis. More precisely, and this has a tremendous effect on any notions of “social justice”, the Scriptural admonitions to care for the fatherless and the widow take on additional significance, as well as God’s promise to “…turn the hearts of the fathers back to the children, and the hearts of the children back to the fathers.” They are inescapable necessities if a culture is to survive.

All my best…

 

[4elise]

I did not read through this whole thread, but my thoughts were this when I heard him say what he did on this matter.

There is social justice in the way that the magisterium means it; which is incumbent upon individuals to practice. It is a proposition, an invitation, *not *an imposition. Society is not government, and unless I’m misunderstanding the Pope’s encyclical, these proposals are for society to self-impose, not for governments to force on people.

Social justice the way that revolutionary theology folks, marxists, and those nuns who came out in support of the health care bill understand it is something for the few to impose on the many because they know better. It is inherently unjust because it takes free choice out of the individual’s hands. “Social justice”, in their eyes, means confiscating from Peter to pay Paul, and lining their own pockets while they are at it, because, well, they deserve it.

Glenn Beck was referring to the latter definition, not the former, and I for one wholeheartedly agree with him. If my pastor started preaching leftist, government-centered “social justice” propaganda, I would leave and not return.

I think that the Holy Father calls on Governments to take responsibility (not only individuals) and to act justly on behalf of all people:
ENCYCLICAL LETTER/CARITAS IN VERITATE
OF THE SUPREME PONTIFF BENEDICT XVI TO THE BISHOPS PRIESTS AND DEACONS MEN AND WOMEN RELIGIOUS THE LAY FAITHFUL AND ALL PEOPLE OF GOOD WILL ON INTEGRAL HUMAN DEVELOPMENT IN CHARITY AND TRUTH
**Re Workers: **
Through the combination of social and economic change, trade union organizations experience greater difficulty in carrying out their task of representing the interests of workers, partly because Governments, for reasons of economic utility, often limit the freedom or the negotiating capacity of labour unions. Hence traditional networks of solidarity have more and more obstacles to overcome. The repeated calls issued within the Church’s social doctrine, beginning with Rerum Novarum[60], for the promotion of workers’ associations that can defend their rights must therefore be honoured today even more than in the past, as a prompt and far-sighted response to the urgent need for new forms of cooperation at the international level, as well as the local level.
**Re the Environment: **
Let us hope that the international community and individual governments will succeed in countering harmful ways of treating the environment. It is likewise incumbent upon the competent authorities to make every effort to ensure that the economic and social costs of using up shared environmental resources are recognized with transparency and fully borne by those who incur them, not by other peoples or future generations: the protection of the environment, of resources and of the climate obliges all international leaders to act jointly and to show a readiness to work in good faith, respecting the law and promoting solidarity with the weakest regions of the planet[121]. One of the greatest challenges facing the economy is to achieve the most efficient use — not abuse — of natural resources, based on a realization that the notion of “efficiency” is not value-free.
Re Employment:
Being out of work or dependent on public or private assistance for a prolonged period undermines the freedom and creativity of the person and his family and social relationships, causing great psychological and spiritual suffering. I would like to remind everyone, especially governments engaged in boosting the world’s economic and social assets, that the primary capital to be safeguarded and valued is man, the human person in his or her integrity: “Man is the source, the focus and the aim of all economic and social life”
**Re: Migration **
The phenomenon, as everyone knows, is difficult to manage; but there is no doubt that foreign workers, despite any difficulties concerning integration, make a significant contribution to the economic development of the host country through their labour, besides that which they make to their country of origin through the money they send home. Obviously, these labourers cannot be considered as a commodity or a mere workforce. They must not, therefore, be treated like any other factor of production. Every migrant is a human person who, as such, possesses fundamental, inalienable rights that must be respected by everyone and in every circumstance

The Social Teaching of the Catholic Church are something I am very proud of, and glad to espouse - I am so very pleased that the Holy Father has again clarified it as a personal and governmental priority.

Blessings!

 

[catharina]

I think that the Holy Father calls on Governments to take responsibility (not only individuals) and to act justly on behalf of all people:
ENCYCLICAL LETTER/CARITAS IN VERITATE
OF THE SUPREME PONTIFF BENEDICT XVI TO THE BISHOPS PRIESTS AND DEACONS MEN AND WOMEN RELIGIOUS THE LAY FAITHFUL AND ALL PEOPLE OF GOOD WILL ON INTEGRAL HUMAN DEVELOPMENT IN CHARITY AND TRUTH
**Re Workers: **
Through the combination of social and economic change, trade union organizations experience greater difficulty in carrying out their task of representing the interests of workers, partly because Governments, for reasons of economic utility, often limit the freedom or the negotiating capacity of labour unions. Hence traditional networks of solidarity have more and more obstacles to overcome. The repeated calls issued within the Church’s social doctrine, beginning with Rerum Novarum[60], for the promotion of workers’ associations that can defend their rights must therefore be honoured today even more than in the past, as a prompt and far-sighted response to the urgent need for new forms of cooperation at the international level, as well as the local level.
**Re the Environment: **
Let us hope that the international community and individual governments will succeed in countering harmful ways of treating the environment. It is likewise incumbent upon the competent authorities to make every effort to ensure that the economic and social costs of using up shared environmental resources are recognized with transparency and fully borne by those who incur them, not by other peoples or future generations: the protection of the environment, of resources and of the climate obliges all international leaders to act jointly and to show a readiness to work in good faith, respecting the law and promoting solidarity with the weakest regions of the planet[121]. One of the greatest challenges facing the economy is to achieve the most efficient use — not abuse — of natural resources, based on a realization that the notion of “efficiency” is not value-free.
Re Employment:
Being out of work or dependent on public or private assistance for a prolonged period undermines the freedom and creativity of the person and his family and social relationships, causing great psychological and spiritual suffering. I would like to remind everyone, especially governments engaged in boosting the world’s economic and social assets, that the primary capital to be safeguarded and valued is man, the human person in his or her integrity: “Man is the source, the focus and the aim of all economic and social life”
**Re: Migration **
The phenomenon, as everyone knows, is difficult to manage; but there is no doubt that foreign workers, despite any difficulties concerning integration, make a significant contribution to the economic development of the host country through their labour, besides that which they make to their country of origin through the money they send home. Obviously, these labourers cannot be considered as a commodity or a mere workforce. They must not, therefore, be treated like any other factor of production. Every migrant is a human person who, as such, possesses fundamental, inalienable rights that must be respected by everyone and in every circumstance

The Social Teaching of the Catholic Church are something I am very proud of, and glad to espouse - I am so very pleased that the Holy Father has again clarified it as a personal and governmental priority.

Blessings!

Here is a link to Pope Leo XIII’s Rerum Novarum.

osjspm.org/majordoc_rerum_novarum_official.aspx

It’s so hard to imagine the “shock” of some Catholics as they recognize that the Church speaks strongly to the need for justice for the poor. This encyclical was written in 1891.

So 4elise, thank you and blessings on you too!

 

[Via_Dolorosa]

I was hungry and you formed a humanities club
and discussed my hunger…Thank you
I was imprisoned and you crept off
quietly to your chapel, and prayed for my release.
I was naked and in your mind you debated
the morality of my appearance.
I was sick and you knelt
and thanked God for your health.
I was homeless and you preached to me
on shelter of the love of God.
I was lonely and you left me alone
to pray for me.
You seem so holy; so close to God;
but I’m still very hungry, and lonely, and cold.

(author unknown, as quoted in Fresh Elastic for Stretched Out Moms by Barbara Johnson)

I found this in a Catholic Prayer Service Manual.

 

[magdelaine]

I think that the Holy Father calls on Governments to take responsibility (not only individuals) and to act justly on behalf of all people

I agree, but the bones are made in how this is accomplished.

Re Employment:
**Being out of work or dependent on public or private assistance for a prolonged period undermines the *freedom ***and creativity of the person and his family and social relationships, causing great psychological and spiritual suffering. I would like to remind everyone, especially governments engaged in boosting the world’s economic and social assets, that the primary capital to be safeguarded and valued is man, the human person in his or her integrity.

I would argue that the health care legislation passed by our new masters will actually harm our economy, keep us entrenched in a depressed job market, and seriously limit “freedom and creativity”. It is a serious *violation *of the freedom of person and a threat to one’s integrity to confiscate one’s property simply because that person happens to be a breathing citizen, or because he or she manages to make more money than other citizens. This is especially true when that property is used to fund things morally abhorrent to said citizen, i.e., abortion.

Our former constitutionally-based government was much more capable of supporting the Pope’s directives than our new government will ever be, given their admiration for thuggery and communist dictators.

Every migrant is a human person who, as such, possesses fundamental, inalienable rights that must be respected by everyone and in every circumstance

This is true in so far that a migrant deserves fair wages and just treatment; however inalienable human rights does not include trampling the laws of a sovereign nation.

 

[magdelaine]

I was hungry and you formed a humanities club
and discussed my hunger…Thank you
I was imprisoned and you crept off
quietly to your chapel, and prayed for my release.
I was naked and in your mind you debated
the morality of my appearance.
I was sick and you knelt
and thanked God for your health.
I was homeless and you preached to me
on shelter of the love of God.
I was lonely and you left me alone
to pray for me.
You seem so holy; so close to God;
but I’m still very hungry, and lonely, and cold.

(author unknown, as quoted in Fresh Elastic for Stretched Out Moms by Barbara Johnson)

I found this in a Catholic Prayer Service Manual.

This is really good; very motivating (and humbling).

 

[pnewton]

Social justice the way that revolutionary theology folks, marxists, and those nuns who came out in support of the health care bill understand it is something for the few to impose on the many because they know better. It is inherently unjust because it takes free choice out of the individual’s hands. “Social justice”, in their eyes, means confiscating from Peter to pay Paul, and lining their own pockets while they are at it, because, well, they deserve it.

That was a good explaination. I mentioned earlier “Liberation theology” but did not define it well. For sure that has used the term “social gospel” although I have never heard that ilk use “social justice.” Perhaps Beck was just confused or having a bad day. If so, he really should be more careful when encouraging people to abandon a Church over phrase he is unclear on. In any case, he did not mention two definition, but made a blanket 100% rule to follow.

Maybe in a year or so if he is around still I will listen to him again.

 

[Via_Dolorosa]

This is really good; very motivating (and humbling).

Your modified quotation is sick. You should be ashamed of yourself

 

[4elise]

Your modified quotation is sick. You should be ashamed of yourself

 

[Via_Dolorosa]

Your modified quotation is sick. You should be ashamed of yourself

I was referring to post #366 and the bottom quotation did not make the quote.

 

[4elise]

Here is a link to Pope Leo XIII’s Rerum Novarum.

osjspm.org/majordoc_rerum_novarum_official.aspx

It’s so hard to imagine the “shock” of some Catholics as they recognize that the Church speaks strongly to the need for justice for the poor. This encyclical was written in 1891.

So 4elise, thank you and blessings on you too!

Pope Leo called the people of his time - Pope Benedict reminds us today that it really is up to us as individuals and a society to make a difference! (not only for us - our families - our communities - but ALL of our sisters and brothers EVERYWHERE in the world)

It surprises me too at the ‘shock’ of some Catholics when faced with this information - of course it is tempting to try to fit Church teachings to our lives, not the other way around.

God Bless!

 

[4elise]

I agree, but the bones are made in how this is accomplished.

I would argue that the health care legislation passed by our new masters will actually harm our economy, keep us entrenched in a depressed job market, and seriously limit “freedom and creativity”. It is a serious *violation *of the freedom of person and a threat to one’s integrity to confiscate one’s property simply because that person happens to be a breathing citizen, or because he or she manages to make more money than other citizens. This is especially true when that property is used to fund things morally abhorrent to said citizen, i.e., abortion.

Our former constitutionally-based government was much more capable of supporting the Pope’s directives than our new government will ever be, given their admiration for thuggery and communist dictators.
This is true in so far that a migrant deserves fair wages and just treatment; however inalienable human rights does not include trampling the laws of a sovereign nation.

I guess you would have to take your interpretation up with the Holy Father - I do not see any limitation on this teaching -
God Bless

 

[magdelaine]

Your modified quotation is sick. You should be ashamed of yourself

I’m curious…why is it sick??

 

[magdelaine]

That was a good explaination. I mentioned earlier “Liberation theology” but did not define it well. For sure that has used the term “social gospel” although I have never heard that ilk use “social justice.” Perhaps Beck was just confused or having a bad day. If so, he really should be more careful when encouraging people to abandon a Church over phrase he is unclear on. In any case, he did not mention two definition, but made a blanket 100% rule to follow.

Maybe in a year or so if he is around still I will listen to him again.

Beck is definitely lacking in the theological/magisterium/teaching area. I mean, he’s a former Catholic to Mormon convert, which shows a lack of deliberation in this area. I mean, the whole Joseph Smith and the Book of Mormon story speaks truth to him? Really?? However, his heart is in the right place.

 

[magdelaine]

I guess you would have to take your interpretation up with the Holy Father - I do not see any limitation on this teaching -
God Bless

I’m not sure what you mean by this?

 

[RWMorris]

You cannot bring about prosperity by discouraging thrift.
You cannot help small men by tearing down big men.
You cannot strengthen the weak by weakening the strong.
You cannot lift the wage-earner by pulling down the wage-payer.
You cannot help the poor man by destroying the rich.
You cannot keep out of trouble by spending more than your income.
You cannot further the brotherhood of man by inciting class hatred.
You cannot establish security on borrowed money.
You cannot build character and courage by taking away men’s initiative
and independence.
You cannot help men permanently by doing for them what they could
and should do for themselves.

• William Boetcker (1873-1962)

 

[Via_Dolorosa]

You cannot bring about prosperity by discouraging thrift.
You cannot help small men by tearing down big men.
You cannot strengthen the weak by weakening the strong.
You cannot lift the wage-earner by pulling down the wage-payer.
You cannot help the poor man by destroying the rich.
You cannot keep out of trouble by spending more than your income.
You cannot further the brotherhood of man by inciting class hatred.
You cannot establish security on borrowed money.
You cannot build character and courage by taking away men’s initiative
and independence.
You cannot help men permanently by doing for them what they could
and should do for themselves.

• William Boetcker (1873-1962)

So? Who here is saying this? Let’s keep it Glenn Beck and not the government or political ideology. He said to run away from churches who teach social justice.

 

[RWMorris]

So? Who here is saying this? Let’s keep it Glenn Beck and not the government or political ideology. He said to run away from churches who teach social justice.

I would call the quote I posted a definition of social justice. Just as much so as the quote you posted (#364).

 

[Via_Dolorosa]

I would call the quote I posted a definition of social justice. Just as much so as the quote you posted (#364).

I would say we see things differently.

 

[Via_Dolorosa]

So? Who here is saying this? Let’s keep it Glenn Beck and not the government or political ideology. He said to run away from churches who teach social justice.

Upon rereading your quote, I still do not understand how your quote has anything to do with social justice. I don’t see how social justice has this effect. Can you further explain.