How To Get To Heaven When You Die

[xfrodobagginsx]

Well, we put together the bible, so why do you have any confidence in the bible then?

Because the bible is the very word of God. Jesus trusted it and used it to contend with the devil and prove who He was and prove His points He made.

Jesus said"

Lu 4:4 And Jesus answered him, saying, It is written, That man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word of God.

Ps 119:105 ¶ NUN. Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path.

2Ti 2:15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

 

[Lorrie]

Sure, I’m 35 and been a Christian since I was 4, raised in church and have been studying the bible for a long time. How about you?

I’m 32. Was born Catholic. My mom and dad got divorced when I was 5. She left the Church and we went to an Assembly of God church. I entered RCIA and had first communion and was confirmed just a few years ago. My mom has since came back to the Church and even my step-father (who was a Protestant since birth and is now 64 years old) has come into the Church, he became a member this past Easter.

 

[Lorrie]

What if you murder someone after that? Do you still automatically go to heaven?

 

[Church_Militant]

That’s not in the bible. The pour three times stuff. Show me through the bible. I don’t trust the catholic churches “History”

I sure am glad you asked that! I just answered that for someone a little while ago in a PM.

Your assertion that sprinkling is not found in the Bible is also in error.

Consider these verses:
Leviticus Chapter 14:51: and shall take the cedarwood and the hyssop and the scarlet stuff, along with the living bird, and dip them in the blood of the bird that was killed and in the running water, and sprinkle the house seven times.

Numbers Chapter 8:7: And thus you shall do to them, to cleanse them: sprinkle the water of expiation upon them, and let them go with a razor over all their body, and wash their clothes and cleanse themselves.

Numbers Chapter 19:18: then a clean person shall take hyssop, and dip it in the water, and sprinkle it upon the tent, and upon all the furnishings, and upon the persons who were there, and upon him who touched the bone, or the slain, or the dead, or the grave; 19: and the clean person shall sprinkle upon the unclean on the third day and on the seventh day; thus on the seventh day he shall cleanse him, and he shall wash his clothes and bathe himself in water, and at evening he shall be clean.

Ezekiel Chapter 36:25: I will sprinkle clean water upon you, and you shall be clean from all your uncleannesses, and from all your idols I will cleanse you.

Hebrews 10:22 Let us draw near with a true heart in fullness of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with clean water.

Oh no! It’s even worse! The Bible speaks of sprinkling!

Why would it matter what way you went about baptism if it’s not (as you assert) even necessary for salvation? :newidea: You sure do make a big fuss about something that according to your own preaching isn’t all that important. According to you, a person can “get saved” never be baptized, and still go to heaven. That just doesn’t make any sense in the context of the New Testament.

 

[xfrodobagginsx]

Apparently you DO care what Catholics teach…or we wouldn’t be having this discussion now would we?

Unfortunately for you…Catholics base their beliefs on the word of God as much as you do and then some.

And why is that a valid response? It’s not. What does the Word of God say?
2nd Timothy 2:15 Carefully study to present thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly handling the word of truth.

Notice something? St. Paul does not tell Timothy to just study the Bible, does he?

and then also: 1st Thessalonians 5:21 But prove all things; hold fast that which is good.
The problem here is that that is not what the passage says…
Hey, no one’s trying to bluff you… if you don’t believe me then google all this for yourself and then make an informed decision.

Have the courage of your convictions to look into all this for yourself and then go ask your pastor or preacher or whatever, and see if his answers line up as truth. If not then you have a problem, but by no means take my word for it. I sure as vitam aeternam didn’t!

Have at it…and knock yourself right out.
CM

I guess you didn’t read the verses and explanations of the verses that you use to try and say that baptism saves. Look back a few pages. Secondly, I only care what catholics think in the sense that I feel bad for them, since they are mislead. I didn’t come to this site to change people from being catholics, I came here to make sure that the true gospel is preached here…faith in Christ alone without the result of works, baptism, or anything else for salvation.

 

[xfrodobagginsx]

I sure am glad you asked that! I just answered that for someone a little while ago in a PM.

Your assertion that sprinkling is not found in the Bible is also in error.

Consider these verses:
Leviticus Chapter 14:51: and shall take the cedarwood and the hyssop and the scarlet stuff, along with the living bird, and dip them in the blood of the bird that was killed and in the running water, and sprinkle the house seven times.

Numbers Chapter 8:7: And thus you shall do to them, to cleanse them: sprinkle the water of expiation upon them, and let them go with a razor over all their body, and wash their clothes and cleanse themselves.

Numbers Chapter 19:18: then a clean person shall take hyssop, and dip it in the water, and sprinkle it upon the tent, and upon all the furnishings, and upon the persons who were there, and upon him who touched the bone, or the slain, or the dead, or the grave; 19: and the clean person shall sprinkle upon the unclean on the third day and on the seventh day; thus on the seventh day he shall cleanse him, and he shall wash his clothes and bathe himself in water, and at evening he shall be clean.

Ezekiel Chapter 36:25: I will sprinkle clean water upon you, and you shall be clean from all your uncleannesses, and from all your idols I will cleanse you.

Hebrews 10:22 Let us draw near with a true heart in fullness of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with clean water.

Oh no! It’s even worse! The Bible speaks of sprinkling!

Why would it matter what way you went about baptism if it’s not (as you assert) even necessary for salvation? :newidea: You sure do make a big fuss about something that according to your own preaching isn’t all that important. According to you, a person can “get saved” never be baptized, and still go to heaven. That just doesn’t make any sense in the context of the New Testament.

Most of those verses are under the law, second that Hebrews verse is not saying to sprinkle water on people. It says to have your heart sprinkled (probably with the blood of Christ) and being baptized in water for a full assurance of faith, not for salvation.

Here look again:
Baptism does NOT save.

Joh 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

This verse doesn’t say that baptism saves. Look at the explanation of the verse. That which is born of flesh is flesh (water represents fleshly birth, the mother’s womb contains water), that which is born of Spirit is spirit (Spiritual birth)

Mr 1:4 John did baptize in the wilderness, and preach the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins. {for: or, unto}

Lu 3:3 And he came into all the country about Jordan, preaching the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins;

As far as baptism saving you, it is the baptism of repentence that saves, not water baptism. The baptism is an outward showing of what happens when you accept Jesus Christ as your Savior. It is NOT salvation, nor is it part of it. It is a believer’s act of obedience.

Mr 16:16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
(KJV)

Look at this verse. At first glance it appears as though baptism saves. But it says “He that believeth not shall be damned.” He is not damned for not being baptized.

1Pe 3:21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:
(KJV)

The baptism being talked about is a good concience toward God not water baptism. It says “not the putting away of the filth of the flesh” but what? “a good conscience toward God”

 

[HailMary]

Because the bible is the very word of God.

Really, that isn’t what St. John thinks:

John 1:1
In the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God and the Word WAS God

Are you suggesting that the bible is God?

Jesus trusted it and used it to contend with the devil and prove who He was and prove His points He made.

Jesus said"

Lu 4:4 And Jesus answered him, saying, It is written, That man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word of God.

Ps 119:105 ¶ NUN. Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path.

Amen.

2Ti 2:15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

“word of Truth” is NOT the “word of God”. You are inflating the text.

 

[xfrodobagginsx]

Here are verses regarding Salvation:

Ac 16:30 And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved?
31 And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.

Where is baptism mentioned here for Salvation?

1Co 1:17 For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect. {words: or, speech}
(KJV)

What did it just say?

Ro 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

Where is baptism mentioned here?

Ro 10:13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

Where is baptism mentioned here?

Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast.

It says it is by grace through faith, not baptism.

Joh 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
(KJV)

It says whosoever believeth in Him. Where is baptism meantioned here?

If baptism were necessary for salvation surely it would have been mentioned in these important passages.

You cannot possess the Holy Ghost unless you are saved right?

Ac 10:47 Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?

They were already saved and possessed the Holy Ghost and they had not been baptized yet.

Ga 3:26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.

Where is baptism mentioned here?

Mr 1:8 I indeed have baptized you with water: but he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost.

I believe that some of those verses that you believe are talking about water baptism are actually talking about being baptized with the Holy Ghost.

Ro 3:28 Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.

Baptism is not mentioned here.

Joh 10:9 I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture.

The Door is Jesus Christ. We enter in by accepting Him.

Re 3:20 Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.

We open the door by receiving Him, what He did on the cross for us to pay for our sins. Baptism is an act of obedience. It is a public profession of faith.

Lu 23:42 And he said unto Jesus, Lord, remember me when thou comest into thy kingdom. And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise.

This theif couldn’t be baptized and Jesus Christ told him what? Today thou shalt be with me in paradise. Because He asked Jesus to save him. He received what Jesus did for Him.

Ac 8:36 And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized? And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.

What was the requirement for Him to be baptized? He has to believe. Baptism is for believer’s only. Believer’s are already Saved.

1Jo 5:13 These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.

If believing means that you know that you have eternal life, where is baptism mentioned here?

It is very clear that baptism is NOT for salvation but an act of obedience. It is an ordinaince just as communion is.

 

[xfrodobagginsx]

Really, that isn’t what St. John thinks:

John 1:1
In the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God and the Word WAS God

Are you suggesting that the bible is God?

Amen.

“word of Truth” is NOT the “word of God”. You are inflating the text.

So, let me get this straight…You don’t believe that the bible is God’s word?

 

[xfrodobagginsx]

I have to go to bed. Be on tommorrow. Gnite I pray you find the truth.

 

[HailMary]

So, let me get this straight…You don’t believe that the bible is God’s word?

Not in the sense St. John is referring to. We can call it, the “written Word of God”, but it is clearly not the “Word of God” St. John is referring to in John 1:1

The Word of God is not a book, it’s a person: Jesus Christ.

 

[juliamajor]

Everybody’s beating a dead horse here playing scripture tennis - it availeth nothingeth Really- please let frodo pack up his little chick magazines and his unimaginative Fundie playbook and quietly depart.

 

[Lorrie]

Originally
Posted by xfrodobagginsx forums.catholic-questions.org/images/buttons_cad/viewpost.gif
Because the guy in the analogy never let it into his HEART. In my post I make it CLEAR by saying “If you prayed that prayer to God and meant it with all of your heart, you are now a child of God and will go to heaven when you die”

What if you murder someone after that? Do you still automatically go to heaven?

I’ve asked this twice and he still won’t answer me!!! Sigh, getting so frustrated here.

Maybe since it’s not written literally in the Bible, word for word, he doesn’t know the answer?

 

[juliamajor]

Ask “son Of Sam”- he’s been saved even though he has never give the full details of his crimes.No sorrow necessary! Just grab the brass ring and bingo- instant heaven Just call it what it is “cheap grace”

 

[Church_Militant]

Because the bible is the very word of God. Jesus trusted it and used it to contend with the devil and prove who He was and prove His points He made.

Jesus said"

Lu 4:4 And Jesus answered him, saying, It is written, That man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word of God.

Ps 119:105 ¶ NUN. Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path.

2Ti 2:15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

Well, you’re in for a problem here fella,

Look at these verses from the letter of St. Jude, the next to last book in the New Testament. (You do accept Jude as inspired canon of scripture, right?)

Jude Chapter 1:9: But when the archangel Michael, contending with the devil, disputed about the body of Moses, he did not presume to pronounce a reviling judgment upon him, but said, “The Lord rebuke you.”

Where is that found in the Old Testament? Please show me chapter and verse.

Jude Chapter 1:14: It was of these also that Enoch in the seventh generation from Adam prophesied, saying, “Behold, the Lord came with his holy myriads, 15: to execute judgment on all, and to convict all the ungodly of all their deeds of ungodliness which they have committed in such an ungodly way, and of all the harsh things which ungodly sinners have spoken against him.”

Where is that in the Old Testament please? Again, I need chapter and verse?

You say,

Jesus trusted it and used it to contend with the devil and prove who He was and prove His points He made.

Now, I want you to show me that this is true of the verses I just gave you.

Also look at this verse.
2nd Timothy Chapter 3:8: As Jannes and Jambres opposed Moses, so these men also oppose the truth, men of corrupt mind and counterfeit faith;

Please show me where these two men are named in the Old Testament. Again…I need chapter and verse?

I guess you didn’t read the verses and explanations of the verses that you use to try and say that baptism saves.Look back a few pages.

Oh but I did…and you now seem to contradict yourself. Is Baptism necessary for salvation or not? What do you believe? Make sure that I understand it.

Secondly, I only care what catholics think in the sense that I feel bad for them, since they are mislead.

In your opinion…which so far has not proved very accurate according to the Word of God.

Here, read my testimony, and think again.

I didn’t come to this site to change people from being catholics, I came here to make sure that the true gospel is preached here…faith in Christ alone without the result of works, baptism, or anything else for salvation.

yet, I have shown that you are not preaching the Gospel of the New Testament, and until about 500 years ago what you are preaching was never taught or believed by Christians in all their history.

Search it out for yourself, man…you cannot find the things that you believe in any of the verifiable Christian writings before the 16th century. It just plain does not exist, and the propaganda you have believe about the Anabaptists tracing their roots to the early church is horrible misinformation to attempt to give credibility to something that is simply not historically there. Go ahead…get out your copy of “Trail of Blood” and then start searching the internet for actual historical sources that verify what they have told you.

You’ll be mad when you do…I can assure you.
Look here…

 

[Lorrie]

I’m a huge fan of ChurchMilitant.

 

[Church_Militant]

Most of those verses are under the law, second that Hebrews verse is not saying to sprinkle water on people. It says to have your heart sprinkled (probably with the blood of Christ) and being baptized in water for a full assurance of faith, not for salvation.

Here look again:
Baptism does NOT save.

Joh 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit

, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. You messed this one all up…as all who try to use this to deny what the New Testamemnt plainly says about baptism. The passages have already been laid out for you a couple of time and the most telling thing about your post is that even though the passages I gave you speak of washing away sins and the forgiveness of sins, and that baptsim “now saves you”, all directly related to salvation, you conspicuously leave them out of your list of salvation scriptures. That is not balanced and accurate Gospel preaching, that’s denominational rhetoric and a different gospel.

2nd Corinthians Chapter 11:4: For if some one comes and preaches another Jesus than the one we preached, or if you receive a different spirit from the one you received, or if you accept a different gospel from the one you accepted, you submit to it readily enough.

Galatians Chapter 1:6: I am astonished that you are so quickly deserting him who called you in the grace of Christ and turning to a different gospel –

1Pe 3:21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:
(KJV)

You quote it and still deny it…

The baptism being talked about is a good concience toward God not water baptism. It says “not the putting away of the filth of the flesh” but what? “a good conscience toward God”

Which comes about how? Oh yeah…by salvation in Christ.

Here are verses regarding Salvation:

All that… and you (intentionally) left out very plain and simple verses like
Acts 2:38 And Peter said to them, "Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
and
Acts 22:16 And now why do you wait? Rise and be baptized, and wash away your sins, calling on his name.’

Be on tommorrow. Gnite I pray you find the truth.

Yeah, me too…and back atcha!

 

[Church_Militant]

Everybody’s beating a dead horse here playing scripture tennis - it availeth nothingeth Really- please let frodo pack up his little chick magazines and his unimaginative Fundie playbook and quietly depart.

C’mon Julia, you can do better than that!. I mean, I disagree with the guy from a to z almost but I won’t talk that way about him.

The fact is that he won’t just “quietly depart” because this is not the real world, it’s the stupid internet and that’s not at all how it works.

I don’t care what he says, I’ll tell him the truth and do it with kindness and Christian charity, or I won’t post at all. It’s not just for he and I, but for those people out there who are reading this thread who probably aren’t even members here at CAF, and yet they are facing this same kind of rhetoric and propaganda, and if they are like I was, they are ill prepared to understand it, much less refute it.

Also…so often we are hit with this same attitude of “I don’t care what the Catholic Church teaches, I’m just here to make sure that the true Gospel is preached” bit. This is confusing to regular Catholics because we look at him and go, “Uh…what’s the difference?” Which is when they get unloaded on with all this other stuff.

How many times has he and others begun to wander from salvation as a topic? It’s hard…but the fact is that we have to resolve this issue, because everyone wants to go to heaven and this “gospel-lite” is pervasive in our society and is daily targeted at Catholics. But then, you know all this don’tcha sister of mine?

Don’t get frustrated or distressed…whenever that comes on, it’s definitely time to be praying for him.

My weapon of choice is the Divine Mercy Chaplet.

 

[Pixie_Dust]

I guess you didn’t read the verses and explanations of the verses that you use to try and say that baptism saves. Look back a few pages. Secondly, I only care what catholics think in the sense that I feel bad for them, since they are mislead. I didn’t come to this site to change people from being catholics, I came here to make sure that the true gospel is preached here…faith in Christ alone without the result of works, baptism, or anything else for salvation.

If we are saved by faith alone, then we don’t need to love anyone - even God! - in order to be saved, right?

If you have faith, but have not works, can your faith save you?

Is whether or not we have faith, God’s sole criteria for judging us worthy of salvation?

Do we have to forgive others in order to have our sins forgiven by God and be saved?

 

[Scott_Lafrance]

ARE YOU 100% SURE THAT IF YOU DIED TODAY THAT YOU WOULD GO TO HEAVEN?

THERE ARE SOME THINGS THAT YOU SHOULD KNOW:

1. REALIZE THAT YOU ARE A SINNER AND IN NEED OF A SAVIOR:

Ro 3:23 “For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;”

Ro 3:10 “As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:”

This all began with the story of Adam and Eve in the garden of Eden. God created them perfect, there was no death or sorrow. God told them not to eat of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. They disobeyed God and as a result, sin entered into the world. The pain which this world sees is the result of sin.

1. BECAUSE OF OUR SINS, WE DIE BOTH SPIRITUALLY AND PHYSICALLY, BUT GOD SENT HIS SON TO TAKE OUR PUNISHMENT AND GIVE US A CHANCE NOT TO HAVE TO GO TO HELL.

Ro 6:23 “For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.”

Ro 5:8 “But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.”

Every person who has ever lived is a sinner and is not righteous because we do bad things. A sin is a crime against God, just as if you steal something at the store, it is punishable by going to jail. It’s the same thing with sin. Even if we lie one time, the punishment is hell, which is a prison for those who commit crimes against God. No matter how well you live your life from then on, you have already committed a sin which will be punished if you are not pardoned. If you commit a crime, and then live as a good citizen you still will go to jail for the crime you committed. Right? Just as the president can pardon a crime so you won’t go to jail, Jesus can pardon your sins so that you do not go to hell, and can go to heaven when you die.

1. IF WE WILL ACCEPT JESUS CHRIST AS OUR LORD WITH OUR MOUTHS AND BELIEVE IN OUR HEARTS THAT HE ROSE FROM THE DEAD, BY DOING THIS WE ARE RECEIVING HIM:

Ro 10:9,10 “That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.”

Joh 1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: {power: or, the right, or, privilege}
(KJV)

You cannot get to heaven by being a good person, going to church, baptism or any other way other than by turning to Jesus and asking Him to forgive you for your sins and save you. While these are good things to do, some people believe that they will get to heaven if they do these things, but the bible says that there is only one way to heaven and that is through receiving what Jesus Christ did on the cross for you.

Will you do that today? If you will, you can be 100% sure that you will go to heaven when you die.

DO YOU BELIEVE THAT JESUS CHRIST DIED ON THE CROSS AND ROSE FROM THE DEAD FOR YOUR SINS? DO YOU ACCEPT WHAT HE DID FOR YOU TO PAY FOR YOUR SINS?

1. If you are willing to receive Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior please pray this right now, from your heart to God,

“Dear LORD JESUS, I believe that YOU died on the Cross and Rose from the dead for my sins. I ask you to come into my heart and forgive me for my sins, take me to heaven when I die. I now receive You as my Lord and Savior. Thank You for saving me. In Jesus holy name, Amen.”

If you prayed that prayer from your heart to God, and meant it with all of your heart, you are now a child of God and will go to heaven when you die.

Now that you are on your way to heaven, you should attend a bible believing church and follow in baptism.

1. Baptised…check
2. Go to a bible believing church…Not only does the Church I go to believe in the bible, it wrote the thing!!!