How To Get To Heaven When You Die

  • Thread starter Thread starter xfrodobagginsx
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
Baptism is not salvific - BUT - anyone who refuses baptism obviously is not a disciple of Christ!
Then your position is that Jesus was trying to confuse us? Your claim is quite different than what’s written in scripture. It says, “He who has believed and has been baptized shall be saved; but he who has disbelieved shall be condemned.” It doesn’t say, he who believes but doesn’t desire baptism isn’t saved.

And furthermore:

Acts 2:38 (NASB) - Peter said to them, "Repent, and each of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

Acts 22:16 (NASB) - Now why do you delay? **Get up and be baptized, and wash away your sins, **calling on His name.

1 Corinthians 12:13 (NASB) - For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body

Galatians 3:27 (NASB) - For all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ*.*

1 Peter 3:21 (NASB) - Corresponding to that, baptism now saves you– not the removal of dirt from the flesh, but an appeal to God for a good conscience–through the resurrection of Jesus Christ

Matthew 28:19 (NASB) - Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit

But hey, why let the words of Our Lord and His Spirit-led apostles get in the way of your chosen theology? 🤷
 
Please pray for those of us in suburban Detroit… we’re under severe t-storm and even some tornado warnings… thanks and God Bless… signing out.
 
He was sent to preach the gospel.** Only the gospel saves. Therefore baptism does not save**.

Ro 1:16 ¶ For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.
AAAANNNNTTTTT!!! That’s the buzzer sounding an alarm for “logical error alert”. The bolded “conclusion” is erroneous. You have assumed “baptism” is not part of the “gospel”, when in fact, it is. Baptism is an act of faith and is part of the gospel as well.
Peter specifically tells us that “baptism now saves you” - Im sure you know where to find it.
 
ARE YOU 100% SURE THAT IF YOU DIED TODAY THAT YOU WOULD GO TO HEAVEN?
Yes, because I have been to Confession since the last time I was conscious of grave sin, and I have confessed all of my sins to Jesus in the presence of His priest.

THERE ARE SOME THINGS THAT YOU SHOULD KNOW:
  1. IF WE WILL ACCEPT JESUS CHRIST AS OUR LORD WITH OUR MOUTHS AND BELIEVE IN OUR HEARTS THAT HE ROSE FROM THE DEAD, BY DOING THIS WE ARE RECEIVING HIM:
I accept Jesus Christ with my mouth every time I receive Holy Communion at Mass. I make my Profession of Faith (I say the “I Believe”) just beforehand, of course - with my mouth!! 👍
DO YOU BELIEVE THAT JESUS CHRIST DIED ON THE CROSS AND ROSE FROM THE DEAD FOR YOUR SINS? DO YOU ACCEPT WHAT HE DID FOR YOU TO PAY FOR YOUR SINS?
I do - do you? Do you know what else Jesus did for us, in addition to dying for our sins and rising again to give us eternal life? He established a Church for us, which is His Body here on earth, and He wants us to be members of it. In His Church, we will read the Bible, sing praises to Him, worship Him with sacrifices, and learn all about His commandments, because He said that if we love Him, we must do His commandments. 🙂
 
How to get to Heaven: abide in Him, become one with Him through the Holy Communion

Easy

Tak
 
Acts 10:43-47…
That’s odd, this seems to have been the only place that this is recorded to have happened in the New Testament. It certainly appears that it was a single occurrence as a sign to the Jewish believers that Gentiles could come to Christ w/o circumcision.
The Holy Spirit is received prior to Baptism - at the HEARING OF FAITH…
On that occasion…
Galatians 3:2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith
?Since when is baptism, which is commanded by Christ Himself and plainly preached as necessary to salvation (ibid) suddenly classed as “a work of the law”?

That has to be some of the most twisted theology I have ever seen.
Joh 7:39 (But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive
: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)And? We are talking here about the message of salvation, which was preached by the apostles beginning on the day of Pentecost. Since Jesus was already glorified…your citation does not apply.
Eph 1:13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise
,Sealed how? What did they do that sealed them?
Romans 6:4 For we are buried together with him by baptism into death; that as Christ is risen from the dead by the glory of the Father, so we also may walk in newness of life.

Colossians 2:12 Buried with him in baptism, in whom also you are risen again by the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him up from the dead.
We are united to Christ by faith!!
But nowhere in the Word of God does it say by a profession of faith alone. (Ibid: Acts 2:38, 22:16)
Romans 5:1 Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ:
So Baptism has no merit and is not required to be born again? Why then did Christ Himself command it?!
Matthew 28:19 Going therefore, teach ye all nations; baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost. 20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and behold I am with you all days, even to the consummation of the world.
1Pe 3:21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us
(not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:The bolded words in red refute you by your own citation.
 
I feel sorry for Frodo. He is wrong on so many things, yet so assured that he is correct. Thus, the error of Sola-Scriptura. One point that we need to clarify, as Catholics, however, that while we believe that Baptism is required for salvation(which could also include Baptism of desire or blood), Baptism, in and of itself does not guarantee salvation. We need to clarify that point, before we get falsely accused of preaching that. Furthermore, we need to debunk Frodo’s apparent belief that those in whom the Holy Spirit dwells are automatically guaranteed salvation. That is not true, either, obviously, since Baptism is regenerative. Frodo, please note Romans 8:13. “If you live according to the flesh, you will die; but if by the Spirit, you put to death the evil deeds of the body, you will live.” Now, in context, we see that St. Paul is NOT making a sales pitch for the Romans to “receive” the Holy Spirit, since they already have “received” Him(See verse 11.) St. Paul is making a conditional statement, that we need to utilize, for lack of a better word, The Holy Spirit that was given us, to put to death the deeds of the flesh. This is not automatic, and failure to do such will cause us to “die,” which meant lose our pending salvation. So, the idea that we are “sealed and protected from potential eternal damnation,” just because the Holy Spirit dwells in us is not true. Now, on John 10:27-28, we need to realize a few things. First, being one of God’s “sheep” is from God’s perspective, not ours. We can not declare ourselves saved. (See 1 Corinthians 4:3-5.) So, we can’t claim the promise of John 10:27-28 for ourselves, just because we made a “sinner’s prayer.” Also, while it is true that God will never choose to let us go, we can still choose to walk away from Him, which would be the wrong choice, obviously. Just some points I wanted to clarify.
 
And what makes you a sheep, according to Jesus’ words in Matthew 25:31-46?

What is it that JESUS says will get you into heaven in this passage?
I know Him and hear His voice and understand when He is speaking to me. I have a genuine relationship with Him. Do you?

Joh 10:27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father’s hand.
 
I know Him and hear His voice and understand when He is speaking to me. I have a genuine relationship with Him. Do you?

Joh 10:27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father’s hand.
They recognize his voice through his Church, which He (Jesus) founded.
 
Go read Matthew 28:19
Go, therefore, and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the holy Spirit,

Either, Christ is wrong, or Paul contradicted Christ, OR, JUST MAYBE, YOUR INTERPRETATION IS WRONG.
That is a commandment to baptize them, it doesn’t say that it’s for salvation. I didn’t say that we aren’t supposed to get baptized, I said that it’s not part of your salvation. Neither is communion.
 
Now that you are on your way to heaven, you should attend a bible believing church and follow in baptism.
Whoever voted for “The church” are you for real? **You think the church will get you to heaven and not Jesus Christ Himself? ** I don’t get it. Could you please explain why? The bible says otherwise.
You beat yourself there buddy. 😃
I don’t get it either. Why would I go to your church to be saved and not my church?Do you think your church will save me and not Jesus. 😉
 
Sure it is. “And when he said this, he breathed on them and said to them, ‘Receive the Holy Spirit. If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven; if you retain the sins of any, they are retained.’” John 20:22-23. That’s precisely what Catholic priests do. Do your clergy members do that? If not, why not?
Ok, that verse actually is in the bible, but there still is no John 22 in the bible. I won’t ague that the Lord may have given them permission, but they also performed miracles. I will have to look into it more. Does your church perform miracles?
 
If you think that baptism doesn’t save, then you have a quarrel with Jesus. Read Mark 16:16 again, and tell us why you think you know better than Jesus.

Was Jesus speaking Gospel truth in Mark 16:16, or just trying to confuse us? And, Catholics regard the command to be baptized as part of the gospel, so it’s impossible to say that the gospel saves without including all the elements of the gospel that Our Lord instructed as necessary for salvation. It’s the height of arrogance to read Jesus’ words, and then state the complete opposite as truth.
Who is the tricker here. The bible specifically states that baptism is NOT part of the gospel.

1Co 1:17 ¶ For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect. {words: or, speech}
 
You think there’s an inherent opposition between the Church and Jesus Christ Himself? I don’t get it. Could you please explain why? The bible says otherwise.
No there isn’t an oppostition between the church and Jesus Christ Himself. Does a pew get you to heaven? NO. But it’s in the church. The church is NOT the Savior, Jesus Christ is. Only He can save us. When we accept Him into our hearts we become part of the true church, we become born again.
 
Does your church perform miracles?
I believe that the Church performs a Miracle at each Mass. I believe that Transubstantiation is a miracle. It is a miracle that Christ Himself performed at the Last Supper. He also commanded His Church to perform this miracle.

Furthermore, if you have to ask this question, then you do not have even a basic understanding of the history of His Church. I pray that you will do more studying of Church history. There are many books and many articles that talk about the miracles throughout the Church’s history.
 
Why didn’t they say you must be baptized to be saved? No, they said “believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and thou shalt be saved, and thy house”

**Ac 16:30 And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved? And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house. And they spake unto him the word of the Lord, and to all that were in his house. **

The baptism always comes AFTER salvation. It is not part of salvation.

And he took them the same hour of the night, and washed their stripes; and was baptized, he and all his, straightway.
 
Who is the tricker here. The bible specifically states that baptism is NOT part of the gospel.

1Co 1:17 ¶ For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect. {words: or, speech}
Really how do you justify these Biblical passages? Clearly, the BIble itself is at odds with your belief that baptism isn’t part of the Gospel.

21 Whereunto baptism being of the like form, now saveth you also: not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the examination of a good conscience towards God by the resurrection of Jesus Christ. 22 Who is on the right hand of God, swallowing down death, that we might be made heirs of life everlasting: being gone into heaven, the angels and powers and virtues being made subject to him. 1 Peter 3:21-22

And Jesus coming, spoke to them, saying: All power is given to me in heaven and in earth. 19 Going therefore, teach ye all nations; baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost. 20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and behold I am with you all days, even to the consummation of the world. Matthew 28:18-20

36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know most certainly, that God hath made both Lord and Christ, this same Jesus, whom you have crucified. 37 Now when they had heard these things, they had compunction in their heart, and said to Peter, and to the rest of the apostles: What shall we do, men and brethren? 38 But Peter said to them: **Do penance, and be baptized **every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ, for the remission of your sins: and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. 39 For the promise is to you, and to your children, and to all that are far off, whomsoever the Lord our God shall call. 40 And with very many other words did he testify and exhort them, saying: Save yourselves from this perverse generation. Acts 2:36-40

Second you left out the previous passages in the 1 Cor 1:16-20

16 And I baptized also the household of Stephanus; besides, I know not whether I baptized any other. 17 For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not in wisdom of speech, lest the cross of Christ should be made void. 18 For the word of the cross, to them indeed that perish, is foolishness; but to them that are saved, that is, to us, it is the power of God. 19 For it is written: I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and the prudence of the prudent I will reject. 20 Where is the wise? Where is the scribe? Where is the disputer of this world? Hath not God made foolish the wisdom of this world?

Though Paul wrote did not send to baptized but to preach the Gospel. What does the Gospel say. Jesus say that we must be baptized in order to be save.

He clearly said that we must born of water.

"Truly, truly, I say to you, **unless one is born of water *and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. 6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. * 7 Do not marvel that I said to you, ‘You must be born anew.’ John 3:5-8.

How does one get become born of water. We must be baptized.

You can’t take one verse and claim baptism isn’t part of the Gospel. You can’t make the Truth partial but using one verse in the Bible to justify your false doctrine. You have to take into account all Biblical verses. Not just one.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top