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Far too many big words. Have a drink, smith.
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c659smith
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You see the Catholic Church does not refute the science but force science not to use conjecture and state it as fact.
The big bang theory
Evolution --why do we still have apes?
why has evolution put the brakes on for the last
several thousand years.
If you look at history most of your great astronomer came from the Catholic Church.
The Vatican Observatory is one of the oldest astronomical institutes in the world and the only research group directly supported by the Holy See. The church funds the observatory to the tune of about $1 million a year, leaving its operation to the Jesuits, a religious order whose “charism,” or special gift to the church, is scholarship.
Ten Jesuit astronomers split their time between Italy and Tucson, Arizona, where the Vatican Observatory Research Group has offices at the University of Arizonas Steward Observatory. In collaboration with Steward, the Jesuits built the 70-inch (1.8-meter) Vatican Advanced Technology Telescope (VATT) on Mount Graham, 75 miles (120 kilometers) northeast of Tucson.
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c659smith
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Catholic schools and evolution
Catholic schools teach evolution, not theistic evolution, as part of their science curriculum. They teach the fact of evolution and the theory of its mechanisms. This is the same evolution curriculum that secular schools teach. Catholic schools do teach theistic evolution in their religion classes though. Bishop DiLorenzo of Richmond, chair of the Committee on Science and Human Values in a December 2004 letter sent to all U.S. bishops: “…Catholic schools should continue teaching evolution as a scientific theory backed by convincing evidence. At the same time, Catholic parents whose children are in public schools should ensure that their children are also receiving appropriate catechesis at home and in the parish on God as Creator. Students should be able to leave their biology classes, and their courses in religious instruction, with an integrated understanding of the means God chose to make us who we are.” [10]
You see Catholics teach both theories for a well rounded education and belive science and Religon are compatible and have confidence that as man grows wiser the bible and science will gel into one.
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Sceince does this for itself. I wish the church had a similar system of checks and balances.
We don’t. There are no apes left.
It has not.
Like Galileo? Just because the church had him under house arrest doesn’t mean they get credit for his discoveries.
I think a church that can pay over 600 million in damages to American victims of a church cover-up is being chintzy by only offering a million for the astronomers.
If they could only get the pope out to look at Saturn through the telescope, I think they would get a lot more money.
I have a small telescope, and enjoy it immensely. If it was colder tonight, I would dust it off and have a look…perhaps another night.
EDIT - quote problem
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c659smith
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The main challenge the church may have is when science does not respect the dignity of human life from conception to death,
We are turning into a culture of death for science and not a culture for life.
The Catholic Church is a moral leader on this front and when it is not followed is consideed extrinsically evil.
Which I am sure in many aspects you also agree.
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c659smith
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You are having a block here now open up.
The Catholic Church began the University system as continues it today. Without this system there would be no science.
There are no Apes left? very funny, I guess some orangatangs and Gorillas are as intelligent as some of our scientists today.
If you read the story without bias concerning Galileo it was not that the Church at the time was not in agreement with him but that ( proof ) at the time was conjecture and yet to be proven. The Catholic Church awarded him with many awards and paid his salary. the first telescope ( first ever made) including the one he used was built and paid for by the Catholic Church. ( it was the churche’s dime )
The Catholic Church asked him several times to hold off on publications until his work could be verified and he refused. Believe me the house arrest was not a bad thing for him he was fed, paid, his continued his work, was well kept, and at the end of the day he still died as a devout Catholic.
He had many audiences with the Popes at the time along with their respect and admiration.
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c659smith
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I think also that the facts of the scandal of the Church was a bad thing and will help make us a better church. but there will be people in all walks of life that do bad things.
Now the scandal though needs to be put in context. that some church leaders avoided or disrupted attemts to investigate allegations of sexual abuse that occurred 3 to 4 decades ago or more.
That many of these allegations did not go to criminal court for several reasons.
The main being a Golden Goose seen.
Many were not children but young adults and these relationships continued well into adult hood and as such it was consensual in the eyes of the law.
However even if one case was true and covered up does not excuse an injustice.
The Catholic Church does seek truth and truth will be and was revealed and took it’s lumps.
The fact remains most of these cases would have gone in favor of the church due to time, verification of facts, and he said / she said
testimony.
99 5 % did not go to any trial so the alleged victims were not seeking justice. if it was me I would want my assailant in jail to pay for his crime and no amount of money would have given me that.
For one I am happy that this was brought out in the open, dealt with, and is behind us.
Most sought this justice though for a dime. Otherwise the accusers in my mind would have come foward much earlier.
Remember the majority of these accussers were in their late 30s to early 50s that sought this monetary gain.
When money is involved justice and truth is always suspect.
The Catholic Church is not responsible for the independent actions of others.
If that was the case then every business and goverment institution in the world would always be in court.
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c659smith
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Like Galileo? Just because the church had him under house arrest doesn’t mean they get credit for his discoveries.
Also now lets be fair the Catholic Church did not destroy his work and they did not hide on what they did.
As far as credit you just have to look at the workplace today.
Now if you work as a Scientist in a drug firm and discover a new drug to cure whatever you do not get to take credit for such a discovery, The drug company does.
For they paid that Scientist a salary, gave him the equipment, and resources. All that then becomes the property of the drug company including al acclimations.
The Scientist gets a pat on the back and a bonus.
On the other hand if the drug company does not want this new drug made and the scientist fights back and attempts to publish/manufacture himself on that research the drug company will have him arrested and put in jail for theft.
Not much difference here.
Like Galileo? Just because the church had him under house arrest doesn’t mean they get credit for his discoveries.
Also now lets be fair the Catholic Church did not destroy his work and they did not hide on what they did.
As far as credit you just have to look at the workplace today.
Now if you work as a Scientist in a drug firm and discover a new drug to cure whatever you do not get to take credit for such a discovery, The drug company does.
For they paid that Scientist a salary, gave him the equipment, and resources. All that then becomes the property of the drug company including al acclimations.
The Scientist gets a pat on the back and a bonus.
On the other hand if the drug company does not want this new drug made and the scientist fights back and attempts to publish/manufacture himself on that research the drug company will have him arrested and put in jail for theft.
Not much difference here.
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lkddav
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Hello Psyche
I found your reply interesting. I have also wondered how i could ever be a theist. How I could live my life believing in things without evidence. If I lived like that i would have to believe in everything, trolls, santa, thor etc…
If theist believe without evidence (faith), why limit yourself to one invisible being??
Why would living your life based in reality make you suicidal? I rather enjoy it
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c659smith
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I posted the rules of evidence in previous posts. The definitons were met in scientific, phlospjy, and law definitions. Christianity’s evidence was placed in a mock trial in the Harvard law school and guess who won.Hello Psyche
I found your reply interesting. I have also wondered how i could ever be a theist. How I could live my life believing in things without evidence. If I lived like that i would have to believe in everything, trolls, santa, thor etc…
If theist believe without evidence (faith), why limit yourself to one invisible being??
Why would living your life based in reality make you suicidal? I rather enjoy it
Thats right Christianity and the bible,
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psyche23
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Well, if you really want to know… it’s kind of long…Hello Psyche
I found your reply interesting. I have also wondered how i could ever be a theist. How I could live my life believing in things without evidence. If I lived like that i would have to believe in everything, trolls, santa, thor etc…
If theist believe without evidence (faith), why limit yourself to one invisible being??
Why would living your life based in reality make you suicidal? I rather enjoy it
When I was a child I went to this Catholic Conference with my family. I remember telling my mom in the car on the way there that I would see a miracle that day. She told me that God doesn’t really work that way and it was unlikely ect,ect,ect…-I was a much bigger believer than everyone else my age that I knew. We get there and in the middle of the conference I walk outside with a friend and see the sun dance. It was beautiful. Pretty soon everyone from the whole building is outside starting at this marvel.
Fast forward to Highschool.
I had a really bad eating disorder in Highschool. Depressed and feeling like the only people that cared was my family and i was doing a huge disservice to them by being alive. Tried killing myself several times but could never do it because in the back of my mind I knew God would hate it if I really went through with it. One night I’d taken lots of pills and went to sleep. There was no reason for me to get up, and I truly did want to die so disputing this would be ridiculous… anyway I woke up and felt compelled to go get my mom. I woke her up and told her what I did. I couldn’t figure out why in the world I would spoil my plan… but I just felt this presence and it couldn’t be ignored…
Later on (different story)
I lost my favorite ring and needed it for graduation. I was going frantic because my aunt and uncle had given it to me and they would want to see me wear it. I looked for months. I finally went to my mom and asked her. She had no idea but said she would pray to St. Jude to help. I dismissed it. Later she asked me to look in the attic (of all places)- and there it was!!! I never take it off to remind me that God helps me even in the smallest of situations if only I would ask him for help.
Fast forward…
My best friend who’s older calls me and tells me she has cancer. Her Doctors tell her it looks malignant and to expect the worst. It’s the worst type there is… she goes in to get one last test with everyone pretty much knowing what to expect but they have to be thorough anyway… I pray like I’ve never prayed before begging God saying if he would take the cancer-make it go away or at least benign, then I would consider being a nun- many people had asked me but I ignored it - A LOT! Next day her results come in and not only has part of the cancer disappeared, but the last part is benign! I later came to the realization God just wanted me to give up control of my life and not fight him. He didn’t necessarily want me to be a nun, just to trust him.
There are more stories like that. You might say these are just coincidence, or medically explainable, or that I’m just crazy. I know what I saw and the real reasons behind it all. Maybe it *I]is * all medically explainable… doesn’t mean God can’t work through science… He made science! But all these things together tell me there’s something more to just living and dying. You don’t have to believe. God will work in ways you don’t expect and in ways most people will ignore and brush off. But I know from experience God’s trying to help us even in the little things (like my ring and countless stories like it).
If He wasn’t there to help me, I know for a fact I’d still be dead. Not only that, but even IF I had survived somehow, I’d still have my eating disorder because I wouldn’t have the strentgh to fight it.
Anyway, you asked I answered. I’ve learned not to doubt in an all powerful-all loving God. I’m now a youth minister for a Catholic Church and can’t BELIEVE the peace I’m surrounded with now!!!
Take it for what you want, but nothing you can say will ever lead me to believe otherwise.
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c659smith
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psyche 23
Remember you are in a Catholic Forum,
The laws and science you have today were built on western civilization and Catholism built it.
Remember you are in a Catholic Forum,
The laws and science you have today were built on western civilization and Catholism built it.
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psyche23
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Not sure what you mean by that… Of course I know I’m on a Catholic Forum. I’m a Catholic Youth minister or did you fail to see that from my last post??? I also attributed all these things to God, even the science…Were you trying to be sarcastic???
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Armor_of_God
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A, I don’t know my fish very well…What are the fish species in your second and third photos?
Nice fish, BTW!
Nice fish, BTW!
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Armor_of_God
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geekborj
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How do we define happiness in this case? Is it defined at one point in time only or throughout her life? I don’t think that she will be happy (in its truest sense, without the person declaring it) until the end of her life due to a bad decision of taking one’s life specially if it was her offspring.
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Armor_of_God
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A, it truly is the responsibility of all members of the Catholic Church to inform themselves of the teachings and laws of the Church. We have all the resources to do this, through Holy Scripture, the Catechism, Canon Law, and all the writings and Encyclicals of the Vatican (Holy See), as well as the writings of the Early Church Fathers and the Doctors of the Church. In addition, there are numerous contemporary works which explain various teachings.
Also, I have not met too many priests (none, come to think of it) with golden rings on every finger, a winter home in Mexico, or a Bugatti Veyron or Ferrari Enza in the driveway. You might want to look into what kind of income they receive, and also where the money goes in your average parish.
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c659smith
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I was directing the question below from ikddav towards you that was left unanswered.Not sure what you mean by that… Of course I know I’m on a Catholic Forum. I’m a Catholic Youth minister or did you fail to see that from my last post??? I also attributed all these things to God, even the science…Were you trying to be sarcastic???
Hello Psyche
I found your reply interesting. I have also wondered how i could ever be a theist. How I could live my life believing in things without evidence. If I lived like that i would have to believe in everything, trolls, santa, thor etc…
If theist believe without evidence (faith), why limit yourself to one invisible being??
Why would living your life based in reality make you suicidal? I rather enjoy
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