I just watched my last ER episode last night

[Ortho]

Little Mary:

That is far different situation from putting an already scared teen in an ER exam room with a strange doctor/nurse and hearing her parents being sent away amidst their protests, and then having abortion and birth control thrown in her lap and basically have an abortion performed when they scarcely know what is happening - and all this after having just experienced the horrors of a rape.

How could anyone possibly make a good decision under those circumstances?  SHe'll be scared and trying to please the doctor and her parents all at the same time.  Nightmarish.

No Ortho, we are talking about two different things here. It’s one thing for a minor to walk into a drug store and buy something because they want to “have a good time tonight”. What I just described above is a very different set of circumstances.

And, for argument’s sake, there isn’t a doctor in a lab coat standing in the drug store by the condoms sending parents away and forcing the kids to get the birth control.

this thread is a blessing because I am going to prepare my child for this NOW. She will be informed and will expect it coming rather than being hit with it like a brick wall. It is something I never considered before and am glad to have it brought to my attention.

Moms! Talk to your daughters! They need to be in the know!!

Nobody is forced to get birth control.

 

[Little_Mary]

Ortho:

Nobody is forced to get birth control.

Oh yes, you’re right, that is correct. Please forgive me. I’ll re-phrase the sentence in which I used the word “force”…

Ahem…
And, for argument’s sake, there isn’t a doctor in a lab coat standing in the drug store by the condoms sending parents away and asking the kids if they want to be on birth control.

Use any word you want to. My point is they (the ER situation, not the drug stores) are exposing the child to topics that I, as a parent, would not want my children to hear from anybody else but me. They are presenting this information without my consent and after they have asked me to leave the room. I have a problem with that.

 

[Mom_of_one]

Ortho:

An ER can provide any service they choose. It’s the choice of the hospital. Many ERs provide basic care for the poor that is not emergency related. That’s their choice.

Really? And you work in the health profession, so you would know this for a fact?

 

[OhioBob]

Ortho:

An ER can provide any service they choose. It’s the choice of the hospital. Many ERs provide basic care for the poor that is not emergency related. That’s their choice.

There’s that word “choice” again. You certainly are a big fan of choice - for everyone accept the unborn, of course.

 

[Rob_s_Wife]

Ortho:

An ER can provide any service they choose. It’s the choice of the hospital. Many ERs provide basic care for the poor that is not emergency related. That’s their choice.

**Only to a certain degree is that true. **

---

If a parent brings in a minor patient which presents with … oh let’s say… severe ear pain. Well any dr. worth a grain of salt knows it’s probably just an ear infection that could be treated out of the ER. However, his job is to make sure that is what it is - eventually, you’re kid is going to have one heck of a wait to get that ear infection diagnosed.

---

Now there’s a mighty big gap between “basic” and “emergency” care. Basic is a simple dianostic care any family dr. can handle. Emergency is care that you may die if not given. I think most right thinking people would agree that an abortion is not ever in the first catagory and rarely in the second. Most ER’s would not treat abortion as basic care.

 

[Ortho]

Little Mary:

Oh yes, you’re right, that is correct. Please forgive me. I’ll re-phrase the sentence in which I used the word “force”…

Ahem…
And, for argument’s sake, there isn’t a doctor in a lab coat standing in the drug store by the condoms sending parents away and asking the kids if they want to be on birth control.

Use any word you want to. My point is they (the ER situation, not the drug stores) are exposing the child to topics that I, as a parent, would not want my children to hear from anybody else but me. They are presenting this information without my consent and after they have asked me to leave the room. I have a problem with that.

I agree the ER doctors are doing somehting you don’t like.

I also observe kids see all kinds of condoms at the local Walgreens. Many more of them are exposed at Walgreens than at the ER. I suspect many more of them use BC from Walgreens than from the ER. I also suspect it’s impossible to keep this information from kids, regardless of what one personally wants.

Any kid with an internet connection can get anything he wants.

There is a world of difference between forcing and asking.

 

[Ortho]

Mom of one:

Really? And you work in the health profession, so you would know this for a fact?

No, I don’t work in the health profession and I don’t see that as a requirement for learning about what ERs do. Do you think it is?

 

[Ortho]

OhioBob:

There’s that word “choice” again. You certainly are a big fan of choice - for everyone accept the unborn, of course.

I am a big fan of choice. I also recongize that some are incapable of expresing choice. Those include the unborn.

 

[Ortho]

**Only to a certain degree is that true. **

---

If a parent brings in a minor patient which presents with … oh let’s say… severe ear pain. Well any dr. worth a grain of salt knows it’s probably just an ear infection that could be treated out of the ER. However, his job is to make sure that is what it is - eventually, you’re kid is going to have one heck of a wait to get that ear infection diagnosed.

---

Now there’s a mighty big gap between “basic” and “emergency” care. Basic is a simple dianostic care any family dr. can handle. Emergency is care that you may die if not given. I think most right thinking people would agree that an abortion is not ever in the first catagory and rarely in the second. Most ER’s would not treat abortion as basic care.

My point is that it is the choice of the hospital as to the level of care they will provide. The individual hospital decides this, and we will see differences within any big city.

In the general health care debate, one of the target areas often cited by hospitals is the need to get primary care of the indigent out of the ER.

 

[Mom_of_one]

Ortho:

No, I don’t work in the health profession and I don’t see that as a requirement for learning about what ERs do. Do you think it is?

My point is that the people in the profession are the ones who know these things for a fact. There are several nurses and physicians on this board and they will all say the same thing. Abortions are not done in the ER as a matter of routine care.

 

[aimee]

Ortho:

My point is that it is the choice of the hospital as to the level of care they will provide. The individual hospital decides this, and we will see differences within any big city.

In the general health care debate, one of the target areas often cited by hospitals is the need to get primary care of the indigent out of the ER.

you are off topic

 

[Little_Mary]

Ortho:

I agree the ER doctors are doing somehting you don’t like.

I also observe kids see all kinds of condoms at the local Walgreens. Many more of them are exposed at Walgreens than at the ER. I suspect many more of them use BC from Walgreens than from the ER. I also suspect it’s impossible to keep this information from kids, regardless of what one personally wants.

Any kid with an internet connection can get anything he wants.

There is a world of difference between forcing and asking.

It is impossible to keep this information from kids. It is wise to inform them, give them a good set of morals, and then watch them like hawks.

Granted, some children may have more freedom than others, and I suppose there are as many ways to parent a child as there are parents, but unless a parent just **doesn’t care ** what his/her child is doing with his/her spare time, it is worth the effort to monitor their actions. Parents are responsbile for the actions of their minor children.

Watching them like hawks means limiting internet access. And wouldn’t they need a credit card to “get anything they want” off the internet?

There is a world of difference between forcing and asking. And to an adult, the difference is clear. To a pre-teen or young teen, (in the ER setting described above) a doctor merely asking them if they want birth control could come across to the teen as being given permission to, or made to feel like they should for their medical well being.

 

[Rob_s_Wife]

Ortho:

My point is that it is the choice of the hospital as to the level of care they will provide. The individual hospital decides this, and we will see differences within any big city.

In the general health care debate, one of the target areas often cited by hospitals is the need to get primary care of the indigent out of the ER.

Either you are changing your POV or your post is not relavant to the thread.

---

First, you related abortion to basic care provided by ER’s. I stated that even if an ER does provide basic care, an abortion would not be in that catagory.

---

Then, you go off about primary care in hospitals… which as ziltch to do with the thread, especially as very few primary care drs. do abortions either.

 

[Rob_s_Wife]

Little Mary:

Parents are responsbile for the actions of their minor children.

**Yet, another sore point, imo, because they say this, but then encourage other people’s dc to make choices contrary to the parents. **

There is a world of difference between forcing and asking. And to an adult, the difference is clear. To a pre-teen or young teen, (in the ER setting described above) a doctor merely asking them if they want birth control could come across to the teen as being given permission to, or made to feel like they should for their medical well being.

:yup: At the very least, it undermines parental authority. We can work our fannies off trying to teach these kids morals and values, but if they learn from a young age (and they sure do!) that all they have to do is walk out the door and the parent has no authority or respect - that sends a big flag up to these kids that their parents aren’t good for much other than financial backing.

---

**So we tell our kids, “you are not old enough to make adult choices yet”, “listen to us”, “we know what’s best”, but they go to an emergency room and the drs kick the parents out and tell the kid the opposite?? It’s not just medical situations either. It seems kids hear this practicly 24/7 between school, friends, media, and society. It’s a miracle anyone’s children have respect for their parents these days. **

 

[Ortho]

Mom of one:

My point is that the people in the profession are the ones who know these things for a fact. There are several nurses and physicians on this board and they will all say the same thing. Abortions are not done in the ER as a matter of routine care.

Glad to know the level of professional qualification here. Does their knowledge cover all ERs? Is the level of service provided by a hospital the choice of the hospital or the health care professinals on this board?

I wonder if the word “abortion” is losing its meaning? It used to mean a surgical procedure. On ER it was the insertion of some gadget. Others say the pill is an abortificant. Others say the morning after pill causes abortion. Perhaps a bit more precision would be helpful?

 

[Ortho]

Little Mary:

It is impossible to keep this information from kids. It is wise to inform them, give them a good set of morals, and then watch them like hawks.

Granted, some children may have more freedom than others, and I suppose there are as many ways to parent a child as there are parents, but unless a parent just **doesn’t care ** what his/her child is doing with his/her spare time, it is worth the effort to monitor their actions. Parents are responsbile for the actions of their minor children.

Watching them like hawks means limiting internet access. And wouldn’t they need a credit card to “get anything they want” off the internet?

There is a world of difference between forcing and asking. And to an adult, the difference is clear. To a pre-teen or young teen, (in the ER setting described above) a doctor merely asking them if they want birth control could come across to the teen as being given permission to, or made to feel like they should for their medical well being.

I agree that one needs a credit card to order a plasma TV on the internet. One also needs one to get into may porn sites. But most sources of information are free. The Wall Street Journal charges. So does the opoinion page of the New York Times. And Lexis/Nexis charges, too. But that is not an (name removed by moderator)ediment to getting information. It’s all available somewhere else.

Kids can also go to the library, sit down at a terminal, and surf without anyone stopping them. Any kid who cannot find what he wants on the internet today has a serious problem.

 

[Ortho]

Either you are changing your POV or your post is not relavant to the thread.

---

First, you related abortion to basic care provided by ER’s. I stated that even if an ER does provide basic care, an abortion would not be in that catagory.

---

Then, you go off about primary care in hospitals… which as ziltch to do with the thread, especially as very few primary care drs. do abortions either.

I think you are stretching my remarks a bit. Just quote where I related abortion to basic care offered by ERs. “Relation” is a somewhat ambiguous term, so refresh me from your POV.

The remarks about primary care in hospitals were a response to others who said ERs only give emergency care, or should only give emergemncy care. If the people to whom I was responding went off the thread, you should deal with them.

Are we still talking about a TV show?

 

[Ortho]

Rob’s wife wrote:
“So we tell our kids, “you are not old enough to make adult choices yet”, “listen to us”, “we know what’s best”, but they go to an emergency room and the drs kick the parents out and tell the kid the opposite?? It’s not just medical situations either. It seems kids hear this practicly 24/7 between school, friends, media, and society. It’s a miracle anyone’s children have respect for their parents these days.”

And the ones who don’t need medical treatment just go to Walgreens.

 

[rocklobster]

What do you expect from the show that gave George Clooney his starting point?

 

[Ortho]

rocklobster:

What do you expect from the show that gave George Clooney his starting point?

The guy who really got his start was Noah Wylie (spelling?)