If Jesus did not marry; then he is father of none

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paarsurrey said:
Hi

Well you claim for Jesus is not of a man; your claim is for a perfect man, and a perfect man must marry and have children, only then we could know he his behaviour was with his wife/wives and his sons. One cannot look on Jesus as an examplary Model of a husband or as a father to his sons, so essential for a family. Why should one deny Jesus of this natural instincts gifted to him by GodAllahYHWH? Just for some imaginary sins of the Catholics and their atonement. Can’t one stop sinning so that there is no need for this imaginary sacrifice, that never happened, for Jesus’ sake.

Let Jesus enjoy his life; like you all yourself enjoy so much. Why to make him a scape goat, for nothing?

One could however differe with me with solid reasons; that is one’s birth right.

I love Jesus and Mary

Thanks
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Marrying and fathering of children are worldly things. For a “perfect” man to engage in these things would, in fact, make him imperfect, since the world itself is imperfect. No, the perfect man is faithful to the Father only, not also to a wife or children, which is why the Father allows us to have spouses and children, because we are imperfect, and need human companionship so as not to despair. Jesus is the Son of God and is God and does not need the imperfect world trappings that we imperfect humans need.
 
paarsurrey said:
Hi

Did I ever say to you to become an Ahmadi here.No, never.

I do present my arguments with **rational reasons :cool: **really? Um…no I have to disagree that your arguments are even close to rational; to extract sound reason from the Catholics here, if they think that they have not been able to present their case in the same spirit, they **are free to improve their arguments. **Every argument I’ve seen from a Catholic has been quite good. It is the arguments AGAINST Catholicism that you attempt to make that are so full of holes they leak! It is as simple as that, in my opinion…

Nothing is lost yet; don’t be restless, please.

If one wants to become an Ahmadi and is fully convinced heart and soul; one won’t even listen to me or you. Can I or you stop one?

I think you agree with me.

Be confident on your faith/religion, please, and concentrate on improving substance in your arguments, which is the purpose of a discussion. **Then why don’t you follow your own advice? :cool: **

I love Jesus and Mary as I do love Adam and Eve. **Uh, yeah, sure you do. If you truly and honestly did, you would not fight against His church so much.:mad: **

Thanks
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paarsurrey said:
Hi

Well , I never said that. Kindly quote if I ever said that.

I love Jesus

Thanks
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Because you believe that you have a solid reason to discredit Paul, but never been able to share it to us. You make a claim that Jesus survive the crucifixion, but never been able to proof it, nor even been able to show the logic. You claim that an angel visited the wife of Pilate, but never been able to quote the verse. You claim that Jesus went like a beaten chicken to India, but never been able to quote the verse from the bible nor from quran. You claim that quran came later than bible so it is more valid, but reject the Satanic Verses which came later the quran. You claim that the miracle done by Jesus is a myth, but declare that Muhammad made many miracles but unable to proof that.

You see that, Paar. You simply reject others opinion without being able to refute it, but persisting on your defenseless idea and believe it to be the truth.

In the short version, you believe that you have the right to determine which is true and which in not, and does not want to engage a logical debate of your own idea. That is a polite version of enforcing your own idea without question, Paar.
 
paarsurrey said:
Hi

I do present my arguments with rational reasons
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OK then, what is your rational reason of :
  1. Jesus survive the spear of the Roman soldier.
  2. Jesus alive with an open unstiched wound large enough that a palm can be inserted in.
  3. The disciple of Jesus came into the tomb in front of the Roman soldiers guarding, and escape away bringing Jesus out, and let that near death wounded person travel alone to India.
  4. The reference that an angel spoke to Pilate’s wife.
  5. The holybook verses saying Jesus went to India (not a work of not even a world class scientist)
  6. God order you to to face the stone building when praying, but God is not there. Who/what is more important, God of the stone of Abraham make a sacrifice.
  7. The reference of Abraham sacrifice Ishmael. Your quranic quotation did not mention Ishmael name in it.
That is for the beginning.
 
swariffin; 4795731:
Because you believe that you have a solid reason to discredit Paul, but never been able to share it to us. You make a claim that Jesus survive the crucifixion, but never been able to proof it, nor even been able to show the logic. You claim that an angel visited the wife of Pilate, but never been able to quote the verse. You claim that Jesus went like a beaten chicken to India, but never been able to quote the verse from the bible nor from Quran. You claim that Quran came later than bible so it is more valid, but reject the Satanic Verses which came later the Quran. You claim that the miracle done by Jesus is a myth, but declare that Muhammad made many miracles but unable to proof that.

You see that, Paar. You simply reject others opinion without being able to refute it, but persisting on your defenseless idea and believe it to be the truth.

In the short version, you believe that you have the right to determine which is true and which in not, and does not want to engage a logical debate of your own idea. That is a polite version of enforcing your own idea without question, Paar.
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Hi

I never said that Jesus was “like a beaten chicken”. I think you have not correctly reviewed the things from my point of view.

In fact, I proved that Jesus was a triumphant or victorious man, unlike a weaker god that he was not, so he fulfilled his mission, in my opinion. Jews wanted to kill him on the Cross, a cursed death as per Deuteronomy; however they could never succeed in their nefarious designs. Jesus’ God Allah YHWH came to his rescue and saved him in this time of trial. Jesus accepted what was ordained for him by his God with humility as a perfect man should do; and hence in my opinion, the only fatal casualty on the Cross was Paul’s ascribed mythical divinity to Jesus, perhaps; which Jesus never claimed in my opinion to start with.

This is how Jesus a humble servant of God Allah YHWH showed the greatest Sign of Jonah to his opponents against all odds.

Yet, the humble man Jesus survived as he showed his injured body and his rather fresh wounds to the “Doubting” Thomas when he was helped out of the tomb; to convince him that he was not a ghost or a spirit but the same humble Messenger of God as he was before the event of Crucifixion, in my opinion.

Now sorry, I don’t see any beaten chicken here, in my opinion. I see a Victorious Messenger Jesus beaming light like anything.

There is no intention to injure anybody’s feelings or faith; we are just discussing things in search of truth and comparing our notes.

I love Jesus and Muhammad.

Thanks
 
paarsurrey said:
Hi

I never said that Jesus was “like a beaten chicken”. I think you have not correctly reviewed the things from my point of view.

In fact, I proved that Jesus was a triumphant or victorious man, unlike a weaker god that he was not, so he fulfilled his mission, in my opinion. Jews wanted to kill him on the Cross, a cursed death as per Deuteronomy; however they could never succeeded in their nefarious designs. Jesus’ God Allah YHWH came to his rescue and saved him in this time of trial. Jesus accepted with humility as a perfect man should do; and hence in my opinion, the only fatal casualty on the Cross was Paul’s ascribed mythical divinity to Jesus, perhaps; which Jesus never claimed in my opinion to start with.

This is how Jesus a humble servant of God Allah YHWH showed the greatest Sign of Jonah to his opponents against all odds.

Yet, the humble man Jesus survived as he showed his injured body and his rather fresh wounds to the “Doubting” Thomas; to convince him that he was not a ghost or a spirit but the same humble Messenger of God as he was before the event of Crucifixion, in my opinion.

Now sorry, I don’t see any beaten chicken here, in my opinion. I see a Victorious Messenger Jesus.

There is no intention to injure anybody’s feelings or faith; we are just discussing things in search of truth and comparing our notes.

I love Jesus and Muhammad.

Thanks
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I called it “like a beaten chicken” is because you describe Jesus who escape to India, and let his followers facing tortured, while he was having Kamasutra and live “peacefully” until his natural death. A leader who escape away, enjoy life himself, and let his follower to die it not a leader at all. Definitely you are not talking about the Christian Jesus, who claimed that a good shepherd is the one who gave his life to the flock he is entrusted to. A good leader is the one who die for the follower, not the other way around. That is why I call your version of Jesus is the one escape to India like a beaten chicken.
 
jakasaki said:
Good Sunday morning,

Pardon for asking, I am not the user doughnut but, what purpose would it serve for you to know the if “user” is male or female.

How would that contribute to your answer. I am very curious as to why the gender of the person posting is important. :confused:

God Bless
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I would like to advise: if she is a woman please do not disclose it to him. It might not be safe. 😉

I wonder why someone would want to know a poster’s gender in an Internet forum like this one. I know in dating’s forum such question or sexual preference are being asked. But my goodness, this is religious forum where we are discussing ideas and spirtual faith.

Sure, there’s no harm in disclosing one’s gender in an ordinary sense but people who aks this purposely would most probably want to attack the person and not the idea. This is called bullying. For information, many posters here have been his victims of internet bullying and intimidation

.
 
Good Lord! I can’t stop laughing. That must be the strangest question ever asked. May I attribute that to cultural beliefs and up-bringing?

Planten,
As to your question, my answer shall probably be very disappointing, and I don’t have the heart to burst your fantasy😃

Jakasaki, this question puzzles me too.

Reuben, I supposed Planten has been on a different wavelength, and hence some of the rationale that deemed reasonable to us, may not apply to him.
Reuben_J said:
I would like to advise: if she is a woman please do not disclose it to him. It might not be safe. 😉

I wonder why someone would want to know a poster’s gender in an Internet forum like this one. I know in dating’s forum such question or sexual preference are being asked. But my goodness, this is religious forum where we are discussing ideas and spirtual faith.

Sure, there’s no harm in disclosing one’s gender in an ordinary sense but people who aks this purposely would most probably want to attack the person and not the idea. This is called bullying. For information, many posters here have been his victims of internet bullying and intimidation

.
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Jesus came to us to save us from our sins. He created the Ark of the New Covenant in the person of the blessed Virgin, whom you claim to love. He was born a child through her and grew as a man, yet still divine. Mary is the mother of my Lord.

He proved Himself through His teaching and by raising the dead. He drank the cup of iniquity to take on our sins, sweating drops of blood in great anguish in being asked to fulfill this mission of becoming sin for us. He then took upon Himself the punishment for that sin and suffered on our behalf. He did not complain. He begged forgiveness for the men who tormented Him. He died. He resurrected 3 days later and by doing so He conquered sin and death. The cross is a scandal. That’s the entire point.

He ascended into heaven. He sent His Father’s Holy Spirit to guide the early Church and 3000 were converted in one day. This Church was given power and authority to heal and testify.

It is not the love of Christ that spreads the lie that He moved on to another country after faking everyone out in an elaborate hoax. This is a much later invention created by men who could not believe.

His triumph isn’t in fooling men, but in conquering death.
 
doughnut said:
Reuben, I supposed Planten has been on a different wavelength, and hence some of the rationale that deemed reasonable to us, may not apply to him.
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Maybe you’re right. That has to explain it all. 👍

No wonder there were misses all the times with him. Not just near misses but very often by miles. 🤷

Hey, God bless and take care.
 
Hi

Kindly quote from Jesus if he ever said that he won’t have sex with a legitimate wife.

The Messenger of God Allah YHWH do have marriages and children. Why should you deny Jesus a thing bestowed to him by God Allah YHWH?

I love Jesus and Mary

Thanks
 
Hi

Jesus never mentioned that He would not marry a wife or that there were no woman fit for him to marry. This is only a Catholic mythical imagination that this would make Jesus unholy.

Jesus was born sinless, as every child is born sinless; and Jesus did not sin when he became of age, then unless marrying is sinning in the Catholic religion, Jesus would remain holy and sinless even if he ever married, later. I think marrying is not synonymous with sinning in the Catholicism.

If that is sinful, then why do the churches arrange wedding ceremonies in the churches; as that would be collaborating in the sinful acts, in my opinion, logically?

So, the concept of Jesus not marrying is erroneous, if not sinful.

I love Jesus and Mary as mentioned in Quran.

Thanks
 
paarsurrey,

Jesus is married to the Church. The Church is the bride of Jesus.

Christian marriage between a man and a woman is a reflection of the marriage between Jesus and the Church.

I love the real Jesus and Mary as mentioned in the Bible.

God bless,

Rony
 
doughnut said:
Good Lord! I can’t stop laughing. That must be the strangest question ever asked. May I attribute that to cultural beliefs and up-bringing?

Planten,
As to your question, my answer shall probably be very disappointing, and I don’t have the heart to burst your fantasy😃

Jakasaki, this question puzzles me too.

Reuben, I supposed Planten has been on a different wavelength, and hence some of the rationale that deemed reasonable to us, may not apply to him.
Click to expand...
Meedeep bobolot banazalop marmolot ganazadop, Babalouie!
 
paarsurrey said:
Hi

Kindly quote from Jesus if he ever said that he won’t have sex with a legitimate wife.

The Messenger of God Allah YHWH do have marriages and children. Why should you deny Jesus a thing bestowed to him by God Allah YHWH?

I love Jesus and Mary

Thanks
Click to expand...
For goodness sake, do you want everytime he went to the toilet as well? Because he doesnt mention he went, does that mean to you he didnt go?
Look Paars, i know in your religion, you are taught not to think for yourselves, everything is written down for you, you dont have to think.
But not EVERYTHING is in the bible, and God trusts us to use our common sense to determine what is right and wrong.
He gave us rules we must not break, and to obey him, but still, he also gave us a brain to think and to follow his commands.
He has covered EVERYTHING we need to know from him, but we also got a brain to think.
 
paarsurrey said:
Hi

Well that was just an opinion of yours; I did not buy it, and gave my reason for that. You cannot assign a purpose to Jesus now; he had died some 2000 years ago, in India. Yours is an afterthough, in my opinion.

I love Jesus and Mary

Thanks
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Everything you say paarsurrey is just your OPINION

So why keep sprouting it ?

You don’t seem interested in understanding our Faith at all

You don’t answer any of our questions in your own words

What is your point in being at CAF ?

We know your opinion by now

Why keep spamming the forum with new threads saying your same old tired opinion over and over again?

We believe Jesus IS God, and is risen, and didn’t die in India, and has no earthly grave anywhere

You don’t

So be it

You are very tiring with your opinion over and over again

We don’t mind talking to you and discussing facts and history but you aren’t interested in that at all

You are just interested in telling us we are “allowed to believe what we want - no compulsion”

That isn’t worthwhile at all
 
Kellie,
You’ve got to feel sorry for muslims. They are taught how to think, eat, sleep, pray, talk etc etc. Every aspect of their life is set out for them.
They are unable to think for themselves.
They are programmed with answers.
Its almost like a computer, in programming, there is a process called ‘go to command’. Thats how muslims work.
Its like they have a set of answers for everything, but when they dont have an answer, it shuts down and doesnt respond, which is called ‘looping’. When a computer loops, you have to rewrite the whole program again to get it right, and its a lengthy process sometimes, trying to rewrite a muslims brain is a daunting task to say the least!
 
paarsurrey said:
Hi

Kindly quote from Jesus if he ever said that he won’t have sex with a legitimate wife.

The Messenger of God Allah YHWH do have marriages and children. Why should you deny Jesus a thing bestowed to him by God Allah YHWH?

I love Jesus and Mary

Thanks
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paarsurrey,

Do you believe ALL messengers of God have sex?
 
kellie said:
paarsurrey,
Do you believe ALL messengers of God have sex?
Click to expand...
Hi

I think Quran and OTBible mention that marrying a woman and having children is a bounty from God Allah YHWH.

When God Allah YHWH was pleased with Abraham; it is mentioned in the OTBible that God promised with him that He would give him so many children from his lineage that it would be difficult to count them. Obviously, one cannot physically have children if one does not marry a wife.

If Abraham had not got married and had children; then Jesus would have not born even, as Jesus was a Jew and all Jews are from lineage of Abraham.

So, it is quite clear, in my opinion. I wonder, you doubt it!

I love Jesus and Abraham as mentioned in Quran.

Thanks
 
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