Kissing on the lips during the sign of peace

[Bookcat]

GENERAL INSTRUCTION OF THE ROMAN MISSAL

"The Rite of Peace

1. The Rite of Peace follows, by which the Church asks for peace and unity for herself and for the whole human family, and the faithful express to each other their ecclesial communion and mutual charity before communicating in the Sacrament.

As for the sign of peace to be given, the manner is to be established by Conferences of Bishops in accordance with the culture and customs of the peoples. It is, however, appropriate that each person offer the sign of peace only to those who are nearest and in a sober manner."

That is the short of the matter.

 

[RoseMary131]

Catholic newbie wading in here - I find the rite of peace unnatural, where some people are nodding, my boyfriend’s family keeps trying to kiss me on the cheek, my grandmother is bowing like she is Japanese, and others are throwing the peace sign or shaking my hand. As an outsider, it’s confusing and yes, it feels like it doesn’t fit with the rest of the mass.

I get that there is a cultural component to it all, but as that seems to vary so much from family to family in the pews, it makes us RCIA attendees very confused on what we’re to be doing. Like ProVobis said, it doesn’t seem to fit, but if it is going to happen, I wish there was a more standard way to do things. Frankly, I don’t feel peace or welcoming, I always end up feeling awkward, which isn’t really the point, I don’t think.

Welcome to the Church, Alexandra!

Sorry that you feel so confused. Being new to Mass can be pretty confusing. There is a lot going on at Mass and every thing has a specific reason to be part of Mass.

I’m sorry you don’t feel peace at that point. Try to think what you are not at peace about.

If it is because the people around you are all doing something different, simply focus on the words “Peace of Christ be with you.” That is the main point. You want to offer Christ’s Peace to someone. They in turn offer His Peace to you.

Looking within yourself and past the different movements that are taking place… it is a time to offer Christ’s peace in some form. The focus is not the form - shaking hands, firm handshake, weak handshake, kiss on the cheek, kiss on the lip, kiss on top of the little kid’s head, nod, bow, wave, peace sign, pat on the arm, pat on the back, anti-bacterial gel.

For your personal help, speak with those who you attend Mass with. Say, “This shaking hands, bowing, kissing… gets to be over whelming for me. Next Sunday, I would like to just offer you a Sign of Peace by_______”. Stick to your plan.

Even those in front of you or behind you will pick up on your cue of how you want to offer a Sign of Peace to them.

You can also ask your RCIA instructor and your sponsor to assist you so that you do feel peace. It may simply mean that you make your choice on how to extend the Sign of Peace and to feel free to express yourself that way - not in the different directions others are offering to you.

PEACE!

 

[zab]

It all depends on what is decided in a particular part of the world.

I myself prefer a bow to a hand shake.

And that is the problem that we are having- the sign has not been decided. That is why I said that I do not like the “either or” (As apparently Canada has decided). I’d rather one sign be decided. And God help me if it is a handshake.

 

[OraLabora]

The Canadian GIRM says

The French PGMR for Canada (which won’t go into effect until the new French translation of the Roman Missal is promulgated) says

I thought it was implemented at Advent 2011? At least that’s what the CCCB website says. We only had a minor translation change in 2011, from “nous rendons gloire à Dieu” after the first two readings, to “nous rendons grâce à Dieu”, a more faithful translation of “Deo gratias”. I’m not aware of any other translations for the moment, the AELF website says nothing about a new missal translation in French, but recently the liturgical translation of the Bible was completed and published.

I attend Mass in the monastery which is not really part of the diocese, I have to follow the house rules, not the diocesan ones (FWIW as I mentioned the monks bow then kiss each other on the cheek).

Maybe that’s why in the same monastery, there is () mass disobedience among the laity because the majority of married couples seem to be kissing each other or giving each other a hug.

But then many also use the “orans” position a the Lord’s Prayer (I don’t)

The French version you gave is more nuanced than the English. Many would interpret it to say “the way to give the peace is by a handshake or a bow, but whatever you do, do it soberly and only with those around you”.

But then we French are famous for observing the spirit, and not the letter, of the rule. Any driving on our local roads would confirm that

 

[RoseMary131]

Now can we drop it and just have a big extra-liturgical chaste Catholic hug fest?

:grouphug::grouphug::grouphug::grouphug::grouphug::grouphug::grouphug:

 

[RoseMary131]

Now can we drop it and just have a big extra-liturgical chaste Catholic hug fest?

…continuation of my other post due to an 8 image limit per post

:hug1::grouphug::knight2::grouphug: :grouphug::slapfight::kiss4you:

That’s my son who thinks he’s being kind offering to sword fight with you. That’s two of my kids when they were younger fighting over who gets to shake your hand. That’s my friend on the other side of our family who can’t reach my hand. She’s waving to me. That’s me giving my kids and husband a kiss.

Sadly, I know I offended someone as something here might not be “chaste” for them.

PEACE! … and as Tiny Tim says “God Bless us everyone.”

 

[Brendan_64]

Oh ok good! So I can use my own judgement.
It so natural for us. We are Hispanic and a very affectionate family and I’m pretty sure my parents have been doing the same thing for years before we were even born.
I was worried for a minute and wondering why my parents had led me wrong.

But the sign of peace is **not ** a sign of affection amongst your family. Would you turn around and kiss the man in the pew behind you on the lips during the sign of peace?

If is a sign of peace amongst Christians as Christians. A sign that Christ is amongst us. We are all Christians and part of the Body of Christ, showing particular affection for members of our immediate family at this point is to completely miss the symbolism of the sign of peace. I will shake my wife’s hand at the sign of peace, just as I will shake the hand of the man next to me, or the woman behind me.

 

[zab]

But the sign of peace is **not **a sign of affection amongst your family. Would you turn around and kiss the man in the pew behind you on the lips during the sign of peace?

If is a sign of peace amongst Christians as Christians. A sign that Christ is amongst us. We are all Christians and part of the Body of Christ, showing particular affection for members of our immediate family at this point is to completely miss the symbolism of the sign of peace. I will shake my wife’s hand at the sign of peace, just as I will shake the hand of the man next to me, or the woman behind me.

So what about the lady who hugs her spouse, and the man next to her, and the woman behind her?

 

[RoseMary131]

And God help me if it is a handshake.

Help me out here, Zab. If I sit beside you, how would you like to extend the Sign of Peace to me?

Should I bring antibacterial gel. Will we be waving or bowing :bowdown: or kissing :kiss4you: or no kissing :tsktsk: or nodding ? I know we won’t be reaching across the aisle :hug3:

The Joys of Being Catholic - To Shake or not to Shake :dancing:

 

[Bookcat]

Well, kissing on the lips isn’t exactly making out, so I think it is perfectly acceptable. We call it the sign of peace, but it is traditionally referred to as a kiss of peace. It is symbolic and ritualistic and how it is carried out varies from culture to culture.

Yes the “kiss of peace” …

…the kiss spouses give to each other -do they give it also to their neighbors?

The “kiss of peace” from the past would be a “kiss of peace” not just given to ones spouse.

 

[Bookcat]

Any how …to all a good night!

And “peace of Christ be with you!” (as I bow…covering my lips)

 

[zab]

Yes the “kiss of peace” …the kiss of spouse for each other but no one else is not a “ritual sign of peace” but a sign of marital affection…

I disagree. If no one sign has been designated to be “the sign”, then how can you say that the kiss of spouses is not a “ritual sign of peace”. It is no less “a ritual sign of peace” than the various other signs that are given.

 

[JimG]

It seems that the sign of peace is a matter which does not necessarily generate peace! In the pre-Vatican II Mass, and in the EF, the sign of peace was not exchanged by the congregation. It was just a response to the priest: “And with your spirit.” At a solemn high Mass with several celebrants, it was exchanged by the celebrants only, with a quite formal double kiss on each cheek, in the European manner.

The first time I ever experience the sign of peace, the priest came down the aisle saying “peace be with you,” to the first person in each pew, who then passed it on.

The problem is not so much with exchanging a kiss. It is that the sign has gotten away from its liturgical function. It has changed—from a sign of ecclesial communion to what is most often an affectionate family moment.

But that was never its purpose. We can have a family moment anytime. We do not often express ecclesial communion with one another except in the context of Mass.

 

[ProVobis]

The Canadian GIRM says

The French PGMR for Canada (which won’t go into effect until the new French translation of the Roman Missal is promulgated) says

The IGMR #82 states:

Ad ipsum signum pacis tradendae quod attinet, modus a Conferentiis Episcoporum, secundum ingenium et mores populorum, statuatur. Convenit tamen ut unusquisque solummodo sibi propinquioribus sobrie pacem significet.

sobrium - not intoxicated, sober, moderate, continent, sensible, cautious

 

[Havard]

I know plenty of people who are A-Okay with the sign of peace being a sign of affection, even though that’s not what it’s supposed to be. There are definitely worse things you can do, but the mindset isn’t good.

Essentially people have expressed:
-Signs of affection are good, Jesus would approve
-This is how I’ve been doing it forever (and my priest/family/parents/grandparents/etc.)
-You’re just being a Pharisee :doh2:

I’ve seen this same type of response applied to other practices. Imho, the only way it can be resolved is through better catechesis.

 

[zab]

Help me out here, Zab. If I sit beside you, how would you like to extend the Sign of Peace to me?

Should I bring antibacterial gel. Will we be waving or bowing :bowdown: or kissing :kiss4you: or no kissing :tsktsk: or nodding ? I know we won’t be reaching across the aisle :hug3:

The Joys of Being Catholic - To Shake or not to Shake :dancing:

RoseMary, I have arthritis. I would probably extend my hand to you with some reservation knowing how painful it could mean for me.

 

[zab]

I know plenty of people who are A-Okay with the sign of peace being a sign of affection, even though that’s not what it’s supposed to be. There are definitely worse things you can do, but the mindset isn’t good.

Essentially people have expressed:
-Signs of affection are good, Jesus would approve
-This is how I’ve been doing it forever (and my priest/family/parents/grandparents/etc.)
-You’re just being a Pharisee :doh2:

I’ve seen this same type of response applied to other practices. Imho, the only way it can be resolved is through better catechesis.

In my opinion the best way for this to be resolved is for the bishops to determine “the sign”

 

[RoseMary131]

RoseMary, I have arthritis.

Sorry to hear that. Ouch… I won’t shake your hand. But you didn’t tell me what is best if you are next to me… so, I’ll follow your cue in Mass… which is what I normally do… sometimes I start to shake someone’s hand and it turns into a hug because I was going to shake and they were going to hug or kiss me on the cheek… I just roll with it.

 

[RoseMary131]

In my opinion the best way for this to be resolved is for the bishops to determine “the sign”

I nominate Zab to call Cardinal Dolan and will await Zab’s report. In the mean time, let’s all be at Peace at Mass.

 

[RoseMary131]

RoseMary, I have arthritis. I would probably extend my hand to you with some reservation knowing how painful it could mean for me.

Are my eyes tricking me… I didn’t see that extended hand to shake earlier… God bless you Zab for your kindness…offering me your hand while knowing it will be painful… I’ll softly touch your arm, if that’s okay.