Lockdowns never again: Sweden was right, and we were wrong

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I’m sorry motherwit but a rise ries not mean a rise of correlation.

Look at cases in April and cases now.

Then look at deaths in April and deaths now.

Your theory on “experts” was wrong.
 
Cathoholic said:
I’m sorry motherwit but a rise ries not mean a rise of correlation.

Look at cases in April and cases now.

Then look at deaths in April and deaths now.

Your theory on “experts” was wrong.
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That’s because Sweden admitted that it wasn’t jumping into massive testing at the beginning. It was very slow to account for the number of cases.
 
It is irrelevant.

You see the same lack of correlation with Finland and Norway too.

It just doesn’t work.

There was no correlation of a “spike” in deaths proportional to cases.

That is just a fact.
 
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Cathoholic said:
It is irrelevant.

You see the same lack of correlation with Finland and Norway too.

It just doesn’t work.

There was no correlation of a “spike” in deaths proportional to cases.

That is just a fact.
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This from today in Sweden.

New infections and hospital admissions have surged in Sweden as the country battles a second wave of the coronavirus pandemic that officials had hoped its light-touch, anti-lockdown approach would mitigate.

“We consider the situation extremely serious,” the director of health and medical care services for Stockholm, Björn Eriksson, told the state broadcaster SVT this week. “We can expect noticeably more people needing hospital care over the coming weeks.”

Swedish hospitals were treating 1,004 patients for Covid-19, SVT said, an increase of 60% over the previous week’s 627. Data from the European Centre for Disease Prevention and Control suggests the rise in recent weeks may be Europe’s fastest.

New infections are also surging, hitting a seven-day average of more than 4,000 this week against fewer than 500 at the beginning of October. The country recorded 4,635 new infections on Thursday.

Anders Tegnell, the country’s chief epidemiologist, told a press conference that case numbers had shown “a pretty big increase last week” and would “certainly increase” again this week, although perhaps not by quite as much.

The prime minister, Stefan Löfven, however, said on Wednesday that all indicators were “going in the wrong direction. The infection is spreading fast, and in the past week the number of people being treated in intensive care has more than doubled.”

 
Motherwit . . . .
The country recorded 4,635 new infections on Thursday.
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I checked their deaths today and it was ten.

WHY are there 10 deaths/day of 4600+ infections today,
. . . but in April, there were about 100 deaths/day cases with 700 cases/day?

You keep posting information that repudiates your own comments about this “spike” that you said was coming but didn’t.

Why do you keep posting information that oppose your own earlier posts?
 
Motherwit . . .
But I told you why Swedens early case count was distorted. They admit to not doing the testing to the degree other countries were doing it. The case count would have been a lot higher than actually recorded.
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Link to that “admission” please. Then I will ask a set of other questions that you just raised in my mind.

And for comparison, show me how Norway and Finland WAS doing the amount of testing you presumably think should have been done too please.
 
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I do not know what miracle is over there, but I
think with this speed of spreading, maybe CA would have another lock down before Thanks Giving. So sad that I must isolate myself at home from Monday and quit Sunday mass again!
 
The death count is irrelevant it was known from the beginning people were going to die. Some didn’t need to happen.The issue was and always will be the strain on the health system and available beds for treatment they may not die but they require treatment if the hospitals are full people will not be able to access heath care. Thats what all this prevention is about nothing more. The constant argument about the death rate is stupid . Its not a political issue people know what to do they don’t have to be told anymore they just won’t do it.
 
BT3241 . . . .
they require treatment if the hospitals are full people will not be able to access heath care.
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People haven’t been able to access health care for a long time (at least to a certain extent).

I have not been able to see my oncologist in person since February.

This is part of the reason WHY hospitals are overflowing NOW. Because the inaporopriate lockdowns earlier have resulted in a backlog of patients needing care.

Now it is to the breaking point.

This is the fault of the lockdowns that we HAVE HAD. At least in part.
 
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BT3241 . . .
Its not a political issue people know what to do they don’t have to be told anymore they just won’t do it.
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Are you talking about the leftist politicians that the mainstream media is trying hard to ignore?
 
Cathoholic said:
This is part of the reason WHY hospitals are overflowing NOW. Because the inaporopriate lockdowns earlier have resulted in a backlog of patients needing care.
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There’s no dispute that lockdowns flattened the curve. Without lockdowns, elective surgeries would still have been postponed because of the increasing volume of covid hospitalizations. Can you see that?
 
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Motherwit . . .
But I told you why Swedens early case count was distorted. They admit to not doing the testing to the degree other countries were doing it. The case count would have been a lot higher than actually recorded.
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Bold mine.

Before you change the subject would you mind linking to that “admission” please?
 
It’s public record. Compare Swedens testing rate to Denmark.

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Sweden didn’t hit the 100,000 per day until week 36 while Denmark got there by week 18.

The Swedish authorities only ramped up testing at the urging of a Dr Stefan Hanson and a group of very concerned doctors. Here.

“From the very start they didn’t believe it was going to become an epidemic in Sweden so they didn’t take any measures to be prepared for an epidemic. The attitude is taking things too lightly and not to cause panic.”

He and a small team set up a pop-up clinic to test for the virus. Swedish authorities subsequently ramped up a national COVID-19 testing campaign, but he said it’s too little, too late.

“Herd immunity is very far … and so many dead. The government is doing nothing, just standing there and doing nothing.”
 
You are posting more information that contradicts your point.

Why?

On week 11 (according to your own graphs), Denmark had negligible testing.

On week 12 for example, Sweden had approximately 11 THOUSAND tests completed. Significantly MORE than Denmark!

In the “early going” Sweden had done MORE testing completed!

Here again was your argument . . .

Motherwit . . .
But I told you why Swedens early case count was distorted. They admit to not doing the testing to the degree other countries were doing it. The case count would have been a lot higher than actually recorded.
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Bold mine.

I think you should go back and re-read my posts, but I think you should also re-read your own posts too.

I am perplexed by your claims,
but even more so, by your “support” of your claims.

.

Motherwit . . .
But I told you why Swedens early case count was distorted. They admit to not doing the testing to the degree other countries were doing it. The case count would have been a lot higher than actually recorded.
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Bold mine.

Would you mind linking to that Sweden “admission” please?
 
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Sweden’s early “patient management strategies” that I have been so critical of . . . .
"A consistent theme is that nursing home residents with suspected Covid-19 were immediately placed on palliative care and given morphine and denied supplementary oxygen and intravenous fluids and nutrition. For many this was effectively a death sentence.

“People suffocated, it was horrible to watch. One patient asked me what I was giving him when I gave him the morphine injection, and I lied to him,” said Latifa Löfvenberg, a nurse. “Many died before their time. It was very, very difficult.”"
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It was worse than Andrew Cuomo’s New York treatment of the elderly even.

But I think Sweden’s epidemiologic approach to the population at large is very good.
 
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You’re straining out a gnat here and I’m wondering why. At this stage around week 46, Sweden is only just catching up with the testing protocols of its neighbors. It hasn’t been a big secret that Sweden was blasé about testing. They freely admitted to a policy of letting the virus ‘run its course’ in the interests of herd immunity.

Your narrow focus on week 11 or 12 is irrelevant. The graphs cover the whole course of the pandemic now in week 46.

When the Swedish authorities announced a ramped up program in June that was in contrast to its previous approach admitting less concentration on testing. Here.

Sweden has carried out fewer tests per capita than its Nordic neighbours and many other countries, and failed to reach the Health Minister’s goal of carrying out 100,000 tests by mid-May. Almost 36,500 coronavirus tests were analysed in Sweden last week.
 
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Motherwit . . . .
Your narrow focus on week 11 or 12 is irrelevant. . . . The graphs cover the whole course of the pandemic now in week 46.
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You said . . .
But I told you why Swedens early case count was distorted. They admit to not doing the testing to the degree other countries were doing it.
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Week 11 is early.

Week 46 is not.

Your own data contradicted your whole thesis.

And I am not sure why, but you just keep contradicting your own points. Why?
admitting less concentration on testing . .
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So what?

You just showed you (here),
that Sweden had more testing then Denmark and no “admission”.

Motherwit . . .
At this stage around week 46, Sweden is only just catching up with the testing protocols of its neighbors.
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They surpassed their neighbor (Denmark) on week 11 according to your own information.

I am still waiting for you to show me where that “admission” you claim is please.
 
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From Motherwit’s new link . . . .
But in a dramatic U-turn on Monday, new restrictions will no longer be a recommendation but enshrined in law as part of Sweden’s Public Order Act, which means there will be harsh penalties for violating them. Lawbreakers could face fines or up to six months in prison.
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Enormous international pressure on Sweden to do this.

It was tough for other countries to maintain CONTROL with Sweden doing so well
without Swedish draconian control measures.

Now maybe Sweden’s deaths will fall from 10 a day down to maybe 10 a day.

Foolishness.
 
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