Mary- other children

[CARose]

Xavier,

You are thinking of Mary’s motherhood in human terms. Remember, she bore the Christ Child. This Child came to her from God, through God. The angel came to her and she submitted to the Will of God, “Be it done unto me according to your Word”. Holy Spirit overcame her and she bore a son. This son was God.

She was his mother, as much as my daughter calls me Mom, Christ spoke of Mary as his mother. Scripture refers to her as His Mother. He is only one person. My daughter is only one person. She, Mary, bore the person Christ, in her womb.

In his last breath, he cared for / honored his mother by entrusting her to his beloved disciple, John. He gave her to John as his new mother, just as he gave her to us. We follow his example, as we desire to follow all that he has done. We honor his mother as the 10 commandments tell us to do, as he did when he walked the earth.

When he was in the temple his teaching astounded those who heard a young boy speak. And yet he obeyed his mother when she told him to come with her and return home.

It was time for his first miracle when they attended the wedding in Cana. His mother knew when it was time to nudge Her Son out, to begin the most important ministry of His life. He didn’t need for her to ask Him to change the water to wine, and yet this is how it was done. She interceded on behalf of the host and the wedding couple.

She’s His mom, how can He refuse her? David’s mother was raised to the position of Queen Mother, and her primary role was to take petitions from the people that she might sort through them and bring them forward to be fulfilled. Would Christ not give His mother status at least as high as is known for human women in their courts?

And in Revelations, we see how the baskets of prayers are brought forward by the elders. This is how Mary helps us. She is in heaven, and yet she’s a creature! A Creature, like us.

Even Christ, while he was God, didn’t aspire to Be God. But we can aspire to fulfill the image of what we were meant to be when God created us man and woman, without sin. We can pray that we might live our lives according to His Plan and do His will.

God Bless,

CARose

 

[Church_Militant]

Xavier:

It is a question of giving Mary honor that belongs only to God.

Not so at all…don’t you listen? Sheesh! You know the Bible so well yet you forget that God knows the hearts of all men and since you can’t understand or accept that we are plainly telling you what we really believe. There is a TREMENDOUS difference between the worship that we Catholics give to the Blessed Trinity, and the high honor with which we esteem the Blessed Virgin. **I cannot believe that you and Dave can be sooo confounded obtuse about something that has been clearly explained to you and hijack the whole thread to boot. Catholic honor and devotion to the Blessed Virgin is NOT the topic here. This thread is for the discussion of the perpetual virginity of Mary and that Jesus was her first and only son.
**
If these other topics are so hot for you then copy and paste them onto another thread and pursue them there.
Pax vobiscum,
http://pages.prodigy.net/indianahawkeye/newpage06/13.gif

 

[oudave]

Tom:

Dave, could I ask a question? Do you have a difficult time staying on one subject? This Forum is divided into “threads” each thread deals with a subject, the subject of this particular thread is “Mary- other children” please explain to us all what in the world your misquote from the CCC has to do with Mary or if she had other children.

Hi
All you have to do is go back and read the post’s. I am just answering questions that are ask of me, I cant help it if the questions are off subject.
In Him and Only Him, Dave.http://forums.catholic-questions.org/images/icons/icon7.gif

PS. Just read it, it’s not a misquote.http://forums.catholic-questions.org/images/icons/icon12.gif

 

[ferdie]

John1717:

MaggieOH:

Then you add an insult by asking if I am a believer. I am a God-fearing Catholic. I love my God. I believe that Jesus Christ is the Messiah and that I have been redeemed. I believe that God can offer me the free gift of grace and that he urges me, through grace to do His Will. Can you say the same or do you just pay lip service by saying “I believe” and “Lord Lord”?

**First of all let me say that I do not know you nor do I presume to know your heart, so I cannot say if you are a believer or not. Only God can judge your heart. That being said, being a God-fearing Catholic, Lutheran, Baptist etc. does not mean you are a true believer! **

**My friend, you have been reading Maggie’s posts and her defense for the Catholic Church and yet you still ask if she’s a believer or true believer. Are protestants and fundamentalist the only true believers? I’m sorry ,I’m assuming that you are not Catholic

**

**My question is do you trust in Christ Alone for your salvation or do you also need the Church, the Sacraments, Mary and your good works? If this is the case then you need to re-examine your faith and discover what Jesus taught as necessary for eternal life. **

**
Why do you have to separate the head from the body? The Lord can’t be against THE Church He founded, nor the church against our founder, the Lord Jesus Christ. We Catholics need the church to guide us just like students needs teachers to guide them. I suggest that you study catholic teaching before you say something against us. If you don’t understand a specific catholic doctrine, ask and they will answer it for you ( don’t ask me because I will only make it more confusing). If you object, say it and they will be happy to explain more.

**

 

[MaggieOH]

oudave:

Hi
All you have to do is go back and read the post’s. I am just answering questions that are ask of me, I cant help it if the questions are off subject.
In Him and Only Him, Dave.http://forums.catholic-questions.org/images/icons/icon7.gif

PS. Just read it, it’s not a misquote.http://forums.catholic-questions.org/images/icons/icon12.gif

Then do not reply in this thread when you know it is off topic. Start a new thread since you want to raise the issue.

Maggie

 

[john_ennis]

oudave:

We say look at the Bible and you say look at some book written by some theologian hundreds of years later.
In Him, Dave.

No, I think we say look at the Bible, and don’t deny that the Bible advises you not to look ONLY to the Bible. Admittedly, we look also to Christ’s teaching Church. Its authority is our proof.

Go back right to the ROOT of what you and we believe, and you’ll see that the insistence that we should only “look to the Bible,” requires proof.

Peace.

John

 

[john_ennis]

oudave:

We say look at the Bible and you say look at some book written by some theologian hundreds of years later.
In Him, Dave.

No, I think we say look at the Bible, and don’t deny that the Bible advises you not to look ONLY to the Bible. Admittedly, we look also to Christ’s teaching Church. Its authority is our proof.

Go back right to the ROOT of what you and we believe–Christ, who built a teaching Church, which then identified and maintained the Bible–and you’ll see that the insistence that we should only “look to the Bible,” requires proof. Where is it?

Peace.

John

 

[MaggieOH]

oudave:

Hi
I would love to expand on your first point but i’m not sure what ‘‘we’’ you are talking about. I have posted many things lately. Please tell me what thread # it is and I would be glad to respond.

I thought that Catholics believed that Mary was assumed to Heaven, if I am wrong then I’m sorry, I don’t think scripture states anywhere that she was.

Billy Graham doesn’t believe that Baptism in essential for salvation, I do. He also believes in once saved always saved, and the rapture, I don’t believe in those things. I think he is misleading many people and would tell him so if I had the chance and not in a mean way.

With all do respect I think that the pope is wrong in many ways as well and would tell him in a kind way as well.

I don’t believe that I said Catholics believe that Jesus was imperfect, I did say that Catholics believe Mary was perfect, when in fact Jesus says in scripture that he was the only perfect one. I believe that to be true.

I don’t question your heart, I think you are very sincere to your faith. I think that the leaders of the Catholic faith have veered off the path that leads to rightousness. People keep telling me to look at the history of the Catholic church. When I look at the differences we have it starts with oral tradition’s. Most traditions were not officialy added to the CCC until many hundreds of years later. I wrote in another post that if the pope were to come out and say that God had just appeared to him and told him that if every church member would go and dip there head in the Jordan river seven time then they would not have to go to purgatory, you would see thousand and thousands Catholics going to the Jordan jordan. That is what I meant by Catholics following man. I hope that I didn’t affend you in any way as well as answered your questions clearly. May God bless you.
In Him and Him only, Dave.http://forums.catholic-questions.org/images/icons/icon7.gif

this response is off topic. If you want to discuss the traditions of the various churches then please start another thread and we will be happy to respond

Maggie

 

[MaggieOH]

Xavier:

No not latter day, but I am familar with them.
Any Spirit filled Christian is annointed.

Now this is where there is a problem. What you are saying is really quite heretical. However, you are getting the thread off topic. So I will not respond any further on this subject. Please start a new thread regarding your beliefs.

Maggie

 

[MaggieOH]

Xavier:

Not if Mary understood that she would have this child before her marriage.

Mary was already married when the angel appeared to her. The covenantal ritual had already been performed and she was still in the betrothal period.

The statement that you have made indicates that you do not believe that Jesus is the Christ. You have in fact just denied the reality of the Incarnation. You have just denied the Divinity of Jesus Christ through the implication that Mary knew she was going to have a child before she was married.

Scripture does not agree with you on that score. The angel gave this news to Mary, and her question indicates that she was not expecting to have children despite her betrothal which was necessary under Judaic Law.

Maggie

 

[MaggieOH]

Xavier:

We do not have the flesh of Christ in us.
How can you not read my scriptures and not know that we have Christ in us?

Xavier, the difference is when we talk of being receiving grace from God we are speaking about receiving the Holy Spirit.

However, you have not answered my response and again you are attempting to drag the discussion off-topic by introducing something different.

Mary had the physical flesh of Christ within her. We do not have the physical flesh of Christ within us. He is there with us in a spiritual sense, not a physcial sense. That is the real difference and that is why we are not the Ark of the Covenant. That belongs to Mary alone.

Maggie

 

[MaggieOH]

oudave:

Hi
I have one question for you, do you kneel before a statue and pray to your Mother like you do Mary? thats the difference we are trying to make. You can put as many fancy words around it as you want but kneeling before a statue is idolitry.http://forums.catholic-questions.org/images/icons/icon12.gif
In Him and Him only, Dave.

This question is off topic. If you want to discuss this issue please open a new thread.

 

[MaggieOH]

oudave:

Hi
Isnt claiming that Jesus is not the only way to Heaven enough to get you to thinking. If it is not, then you are denying Christ’s sacrifice on the cross.
In Christ and only Christ, Dave.http://forums.catholic-questions.org/images/icons/icon6.gif

You are misquoting the teaching of the Catholic Church and you are hijacking the thread by going off at a tangent. This has nothing to do with the subject of this thread. If you want to discuss these issues then start a new thread.

Maggie

 

[MaggieOH]

Xavier:

Using your logic, Mary didnt say I will not know a man. She said I have not known a man.

However, the meaning of Mary’s statement is that she is not intending to know man. Once again you cannot use the English translation of Hebrew to come up with such a loose explanation as to what was exchanged between Mary and the angel.

As I have constantly stated, and you have ignored, this doctrine is about who Jesus is, not Mary.

If there were younger brothers and sisters then Jesus is a liar and not the son of God.

Maggie

 

[sfp]

Xavier:

Mary could not give birth to Christs divine nature as this nature predates her. As such she could not be the mother of God. God had no mother.

Did your mother give birth to your soul? If not, then why do you call her your mother?

Catholics do not claim that Mary gave birth to Jesus’s soul. She gave birth to his BODY. Just like your mother gave birth to YOUR BODY. Neither gives birth to the soul…that’s only God’s ability.

So again, why do you call your mother, “mother?”

 

[sfp]

Xavier:

Stop it your better than that.
God is preexistant He can have no mother. Mary was not mother of Jesus divine nature.

No one ever said she is. What is your problem?

 

[Church_Militant]

MaggieOH has endeavored to ask you guys several times as have I to open other threads and take these off topic questions with you. Pretending that you cannot wait to answer is nothing more than thread hijacking and disruption. KINDLY do as you’ve been asked before the mods close this thread because it was wandered so far.

http://pages.prodigy.net/rogerlori1/emoticons/retard.gif

 

[MaggieOH]

Xavier:

Mary was the earthly vessel god used to birth the Messiah. Mary was not the mother of God that is blaspheous. In the beginning was the Word. Jesus was in the begining with God, Mary was not.
A mother bestows qualities on and into her son. Mary bestowed natural (earthly) qualities on Jesus not Divine.

Well now. That is the heresy of Arius, Nestorius, the Watchtower Society (who believe that the Watchtower is god) and Joseph Smith all rolled into one. It is also the heresy of Gnostic dualism.

The Word became Flesh and dwelt among us. Jesus was born of a Woman and that woman is Mary. He was in the womb for a 40 week gestation period. His Flesh is of Her flesh. His Blood is of Her blood. She gave birth in a stable in the normal way. He was a normal baby, except for one thing. Jesus is both Human (Son of Man) and Divine (Son of God).

Mary is identified in the Scripture as “Mother of my LORD” by Elisabeth. Therefore it is Scriptural to call Mary Mother of God (the Son).

Yes, it is true the Divine qualites come from God, and what is also true is that Jesus from the moment he was conceived in the womb had those Divine qualities, as well as the earthly qualities of His Mother.

Maggie

 

[MaggieOH]

Xavier:

If you had faith in God why not ask Him?
When you seek answers to prayer would you not ask the one you believe in?

If you want to discuss faith and prayer please open another thread. This has nothing to do with the topic.

MaggieOH

 

[MaggieOH]

Xavier:

I am trying to get you to think out of the box.
Jesus said God is spirit and He is truth, was He speaking of only the Holy Spirit? No
For The Spirit of Christ is within us. Is the Spirit of the Father in us? If it is in Christ is it not within us?
And if this be true are we not tabernacles of God?
If we are tabernacles and the law is written in our hearts, are we not the Ark of the Covenant?

NO NO NO We are not the Ark of the Covenant. That role belongs to the Woman who bore the Son of God/Son of Man. We have grace within us, not the flesh of Jesus Christ who is Divine.

Again you are dragging this off-topic as a result of those crazy doctrines you have been taught.