M
MaggieOH
Guest
Then you lie when you say that Jesus is God
Maggie
- Status
Maggie
M
Malachi4U
Guest
Xavier, Gods peace be with you,
I have read numerous posts you have made. Perhaps you should read the Catechism and look up the references it makes on each subject. You should also read your Scripture again, but think outside your limited box as you said earlier.
You have failed totally to understand the theology of those you have been writting to. You also have failed to write about that theology correctly as well.
You write good posts and seem to know “RE”-formed opinions but fail to understand the origional Faith before the protestants jumped out of the box and changed what Jesus gave us.
If the theology Jesus taught was good enough for Him, its good enough for me. I love Jesus and I have no reason to think outside the box He gave us. I’m happy living in His box, the “RE”-formers were not.
I urge you to ‘see’ Scripture, not just read it. If Blessed Mary is not the mother of God, then you must not believe Jesus is God. That IS thinking outside His box if you no longer believe Him to be God. Read St. Luke again. Is Jesus God? YES! Did Blessed Mary give birth to Jesus? YES! So, is Blessed Mary the mother of God? YES! You protestants just hate that Catholic logic makes sense. For your protestant logic to make sense then you would have to answer no to at least one of these questions. You may not like it, but Blessed Mary WAS the mother of God! Most protestants admit this one, they just avoid saying it since it sounds too Catholic. Putting your head in a hole like a long necked bird doesn’t change facts or truths though.
St. Lk 1:30-33 “30 Then the angel said to her, “Do not be afraid, Mary, for you have found favor with God. 31 Behold, you will conceive in your womb and bear a son, and you shall name him Jesus. 32 He will be great and will be called Son of the Most High, and the Lord God will give him the throne of David his father, 33 and he will rule over the house of Jacob forever, and of his kingdom there will be no end.””
You seem like a very good Protestant. I look foward to you learning the truth about Catholic theology and writting about it correctly. You do not have to believe it - Faith is free and cannot be forced - but you should at least know it before writting about it.
While you learn the truth and try to correctly understand Catholicism, try to educate us better on your personnal version of “re”-formed theology so we can better understand you opinions vs. our theology. That way we will not speak out of ignorence about your opinions.
A prisoner of Christ our God and son of Blessed Mary,
I have read numerous posts you have made. Perhaps you should read the Catechism and look up the references it makes on each subject. You should also read your Scripture again, but think outside your limited box as you said earlier.
You have failed totally to understand the theology of those you have been writting to. You also have failed to write about that theology correctly as well.
You write good posts and seem to know “RE”-formed opinions but fail to understand the origional Faith before the protestants jumped out of the box and changed what Jesus gave us.
If the theology Jesus taught was good enough for Him, its good enough for me. I love Jesus and I have no reason to think outside the box He gave us. I’m happy living in His box, the “RE”-formers were not.
I urge you to ‘see’ Scripture, not just read it. If Blessed Mary is not the mother of God, then you must not believe Jesus is God. That IS thinking outside His box if you no longer believe Him to be God. Read St. Luke again. Is Jesus God? YES! Did Blessed Mary give birth to Jesus? YES! So, is Blessed Mary the mother of God? YES! You protestants just hate that Catholic logic makes sense. For your protestant logic to make sense then you would have to answer no to at least one of these questions. You may not like it, but Blessed Mary WAS the mother of God! Most protestants admit this one, they just avoid saying it since it sounds too Catholic. Putting your head in a hole like a long necked bird doesn’t change facts or truths though.
St. Lk 1:30-33 “30 Then the angel said to her, “Do not be afraid, Mary, for you have found favor with God. 31 Behold, you will conceive in your womb and bear a son, and you shall name him Jesus. 32 He will be great and will be called Son of the Most High, and the Lord God will give him the throne of David his father, 33 and he will rule over the house of Jacob forever, and of his kingdom there will be no end.””
You seem like a very good Protestant. I look foward to you learning the truth about Catholic theology and writting about it correctly. You do not have to believe it - Faith is free and cannot be forced - but you should at least know it before writting about it.
While you learn the truth and try to correctly understand Catholicism, try to educate us better on your personnal version of “re”-formed theology so we can better understand you opinions vs. our theology. That way we will not speak out of ignorence about your opinions.
A prisoner of Christ our God and son of Blessed Mary,
X
Xavier
Guest
OK hopefully I can address all your questions,
Mary was the mother of Jesus.
Jesus is God.
Mary is therefore the mother of God.
No, although this may seem rational it does not hold up.
God pre existed Mary. Can a creature be the mother of the creator?
The incarnation is a totally unique, and mystical occurance which transended natural law.
A mother is the elder of a son. Is Mary an elder to Jesus?
A mother is the source of her child. Is Mary the source of God?
Mary is the mother of Jesus, Jesus is God, Mary can never be the mother of God. To say Mary is the mother of God would to deny Gods self sufficency. To say Mary is the mother of God would deny Gods transendancy. The Great I Am whos name cannot be uttered because once you name something it is given an identidy and God cannot be contained in a name. Your intent may not be such but when you say Mary is the mother of God you deminish God.
Mary was the mother of Jesus.
Jesus is God.
Mary is therefore the mother of God.
No, although this may seem rational it does not hold up.
God pre existed Mary. Can a creature be the mother of the creator?
The incarnation is a totally unique, and mystical occurance which transended natural law.
A mother is the elder of a son. Is Mary an elder to Jesus?
A mother is the source of her child. Is Mary the source of God?
Mary is the mother of Jesus, Jesus is God, Mary can never be the mother of God. To say Mary is the mother of God would to deny Gods self sufficency. To say Mary is the mother of God would deny Gods transendancy. The Great I Am whos name cannot be uttered because once you name something it is given an identidy and God cannot be contained in a name. Your intent may not be such but when you say Mary is the mother of God you deminish God.
X
Xavier
Guest
When examining Luke you must compare with Matt 1
NRSV
18 Now the birth of Jesus the Messiah F9 took place in this way. When his mother Mary had been engaged to Joseph, but before they lived together, she was found to be with child from the Holy Spirit. 19 Her husband Joseph, being a righteous man and unwilling to expose her to public disgrace, planned to dismiss her quietly.
I believe that Matt 1 supports my point of as opposed to Toms
NRSV
18 Now the birth of Jesus the Messiah F9 took place in this way. When his mother Mary had been engaged to Joseph, but before they lived together, she was found to be with child from the Holy Spirit. 19 Her husband Joseph, being a righteous man and unwilling to expose her to public disgrace, planned to dismiss her quietly.
I believe that Matt 1 supports my point of as opposed to Toms
X
Xavier
Guest
Mickey said:
This passage must be interpreted in light of Matt12:47-50 and mark 3:32-35
X
Xavier
Guest
john doran:
You were in need so you knelt down and prayed.
You pray to who you have faith will answer your prayer. If your faith is in God then you will pray to God. If you believe that Mary the mother of Jesus will interceed on your behalf you have placed your faith in Mary ahead of your faith in God.
We are instructed to pray for one another.
Yet we never here of asking Moses or Abraham or David to pray for us, doesnt that seem foriegn? Why did not the Jews do this?
Why did not the Aostles?
It just makes sense, look at it this way
You were in need so you knelt down and prayed.
You pray to who you have faith will answer your prayer. If your faith is in God then you will pray to God. If you believe that Mary the mother of Jesus will interceed on your behalf you have placed your faith in Mary ahead of your faith in God.
We are instructed to pray for one another.
Yet we never here of asking Moses or Abraham or David to pray for us, doesnt that seem foriegn? Why did not the Jews do this?
Why did not the Aostles?
X
Xavier
Guest
Jesus the Christ the Son of the Living God was crucified
X
Xavier
Guest
I just read Church Militants message. I guess if anyone wants to further discuss prayer lets open a new thread.
mia culpa, mia culpa mia maxima culpa
mia culpa, mia culpa mia maxima culpa
B
Benadam
Guest
It wasn’t untill the Son returned to the Father that the bonds between divine persons included a human. The bonds between persons establishes the means for the indwelling of the Holy spirit and the Day of Pentecost. There was no Triumphant Church untill Christ brought back trophies from the enemies clutches. The apostles were the first Christians known those souls who followed Christ out of hell were not known. Though this in no way discounts the possibility that that Triumphant community wasn’t communicating with the Church Militant. St Paul was taken up to what he descrtibed as the third heaven. Those who die in Christ are as much alive and members of the Church as Christ Himself is. They are in Him after all.
J
John1717
Guest
Catholics continue to assert that they don’t worship Mary, yet they call Mary Gods mother! It is illogical to say that Mary is Gods mother. To call her such is to rob God of His glory!
Gods Church is not the Roman Catholic Church! Lets see, Jesus started the Church where? I didn’t read anywhere that He started it in Rome! The “Church” is not a denomination
I pray for all poor deceived Catholics daily. It is the burden of my heart! If you detect some anger it is due to the fact that the people closest to me are in a religious system that has deceived them as to what is necessary for salvation. They blindly follow the unbiblical teachings of a self-proclaimed infailible Church that is leading them down the broad road to destruction.
**I pray that God will illuminate your mind to the truth by His Holy Spirit. **
C
Church_Militant
Guest
John1717 said:Catholics continue to assert that they don’t worship Mary, yet they call Mary Gods mother! It is illogical to say that Mary is Gods mother. To call her such is to rob God of His glory!
Gods Church is not the Roman Catholic Church! Lets see, Jesus started the Church where? I didn’t read anywhere that He started it in Rome! The “Church” is not a denomination
I pray for all poor deceived Catholics daily. It is the burden of my heart! If you detect some anger it is due to the fact that the people closest to me are in a religious system that has deceived them as to what is necessary for salvation. They blindly follow the unbiblical teachings of a self-proclaimed infailible Church that is leading them down the broad road to destruction.
**I pray that God will illuminate your mind to the truth by His Holy Spirit. **
Off Topic… why dontcha open a thread for this allegation, and I’ll be happy to respond to it if it’s really important to you. I will tell you now that your allegations in this post are bunk. Open the thread…we’ll deal with all this.
J
John1717
Guest
Prayer is an act of worship reserved for God alone! Luke 1:28 is a greeting not a prayer!
We are not to pray to the dead!
Deuteronomy 18:9-12 states, “When thou art come into the land which the LORD thy God giveth thee, thou shalt not learn to do after the abominations of those nations. There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass through the fire, or that useth divination, or an observer of times, or an enchanter, or a witch, Or a charmer, or a consulter with familiar spirits, or a wizard, or a Necromancer. For all that do these things are an abomination unto the LORD: and because of these abominations the LORD thy God doth drive them out from before thee.”
In practice, Catholics worship Mary. They pray to her and most notably at “May Crowning,” bow down to her statue and sing praises!
**** **:yup: **
J
John1717
Guest
Scott Waddell:
Now, try digesting this one more time! Scripture interprets Scripture!
**Rev 12:1 A great and wondrous sign appeared in heaven: a woman clothed with the sun, with the moon under her feet and ****a crown of twelve stars on her head.
Rev 12:2 She was pregnant and cried out in pain as she was about to give birth.
Rev 12:3 Then another sign appeared in heaven: an enormous red dragon with seven heads and ten horns and seven crowns on his heads.
Rev 12:4 His tail swept a third of the stars out of the sky and flung them to the earth. The dragon stood in front of the woman who was about to give birth, **so that he might devour her child the moment it was born.
Rev 12:5 She gave birth to a son, a male child, who will rule all the nations with an iron scepter. And her child was snatched up to God and to his throne.
**Now lets look at Genesis 37:9 which records the dream of Joseph: “…Lo, I have had still another dream; and behold, the sun and the moon and eleven stars (Joseph being number twelve) were bowing down to me” The twelve stars are the twelve tribes of Israel. You can also read Gen 49:1-28. **
Now read Jer. 4:31: "For I heard a cry as of a woman in labor, The anguish as of one giving birth to her first child, The cry of the daufgter of Zion gasping for breath"
Now read Isiah 66:7-8: “Before she travailed, she brought forth; Before her pain came, she gave birth to a boy. Who has heard such a thing? Who has seen such things? Can a land be born in one day? Can a nation be brought forth all at once? As soon as Zion travailed, she also brought forth her sons.” You can also read Isiah 26:17 and Micah 4:9.
This Woman is not a person but a symbol ! It is the poeple of God from whom comes the Messiah! Notice this Woman cries out in the pain of childbirth, which is contrary to Catholic teaching. This passage has nothing to do with Mary!
**The only reason you believe the Woman to be Mary is because thats what you have been taught by the Catholic Church. However, the Catholic Church is dead wrong and in fact is not the Church founded by Jesus Christ!!!
**
Mary is said to be sinless and as such did not have pain in childbirth! Thats what I was taught!
Now, try digesting this one more time! Scripture interprets Scripture!
**Rev 12:1 A great and wondrous sign appeared in heaven: a woman clothed with the sun, with the moon under her feet and ****a crown of twelve stars on her head.
Rev 12:2 She was pregnant and cried out in pain as she was about to give birth.
Rev 12:3 Then another sign appeared in heaven: an enormous red dragon with seven heads and ten horns and seven crowns on his heads.
Rev 12:4 His tail swept a third of the stars out of the sky and flung them to the earth. The dragon stood in front of the woman who was about to give birth, **so that he might devour her child the moment it was born.
Rev 12:5 She gave birth to a son, a male child, who will rule all the nations with an iron scepter. And her child was snatched up to God and to his throne.
**Now lets look at Genesis 37:9 which records the dream of Joseph: “…Lo, I have had still another dream; and behold, the sun and the moon and eleven stars (Joseph being number twelve) were bowing down to me” The twelve stars are the twelve tribes of Israel. You can also read Gen 49:1-28. **
Now read Jer. 4:31: "For I heard a cry as of a woman in labor, The anguish as of one giving birth to her first child, The cry of the daufgter of Zion gasping for breath"
Now read Isiah 66:7-8: “Before she travailed, she brought forth; Before her pain came, she gave birth to a boy. Who has heard such a thing? Who has seen such things? Can a land be born in one day? Can a nation be brought forth all at once? As soon as Zion travailed, she also brought forth her sons.” You can also read Isiah 26:17 and Micah 4:9.
This Woman is not a person but a symbol ! It is the poeple of God from whom comes the Messiah! Notice this Woman cries out in the pain of childbirth, which is contrary to Catholic teaching. This passage has nothing to do with Mary!
**The only reason you believe the Woman to be Mary is because thats what you have been taught by the Catholic Church. However, the Catholic Church is dead wrong and in fact is not the Church founded by Jesus Christ!!!
**
C
Church_Militant
Guest
John1717,
This is all off topic…can’t you follow simple directions and show courtesy and abide by the forum rules. Put this stuff on another thread and I’ll politely eat your lunch, but do not continue to hijack this thread or I will report you. C’mon man do this right…
This is all off topic…can’t you follow simple directions and show courtesy and abide by the forum rules. Put this stuff on another thread and I’ll politely eat your lunch, but do not continue to hijack this thread or I will report you. C’mon man do this right…
J
John1717
Guest
Scott Waddell:
Now, try digesting this one more time! Scripture interprets Scripture!
**Rev 12:1 A great and wondrous sign appeared in heaven: a woman clothed with the sun, with the moon under her feet and ****a crown of twelve stars on her head. (Notice it says the Woman is a sign-something that point beyond itself)
Rev 12:2 She was pregnant and cried out in pain as she was about to give birth.
Rev 12:3 Then another sign appeared in heaven: an enormous red dragon with seven heads and ten horns and seven crowns on his heads. (Notice the red dragon is also a sign-Satan)
Rev 12:4 His tail swept a third of the stars out of the sky and flung them to the earth. The dragon stood in front of the woman who was about to give birth, **so that he might devour her child the moment it was born.
Rev 12:5 She gave birth to a son, a male child, who will rule all the nations with an iron scepter. And her child was snatched up to God and to his throne.
**Now lets look at Genesis 37:9 which records the dream of Joseph: “…Lo, I have had still another dream; and behold, the sun and the moon and eleven stars (Joseph being number twelve) were bowing down to me” The twelve stars are the twelve tribes of Israel. You can also read Gen 49:1-28. **
Now read Jer. 4:31: "For I heard a cry as of a woman in labor, The anguish as of one giving birth to her first child, The cry of the daufgter of Zion gasping for breath"
Now read Isiah 66:7-8: “Before she travailed, she brought forth; Before her pain came, she gave birth to a boy. Who has heard such a thing? Who has seen such things? Can a land be born in one day? Can a nation be brought forth all at once? As soon as Zion travailed, she also brought forth her sons.” You can also read Isiah 26:17 and Micah 4:9.
This Woman is not a person but a symbol ! It is the people of God from whom comes the Messiah! Notice this Woman cries out in the pain of childbirth, which is contrary to Catholic teaching. This passage has nothing to do with Mary!
**The only reason you believe the Woman to be Mary is because thats what you have been taught by the Catholic Church. However, the Catholic Church is dead wrong and in fact is not the Church founded by Jesus Christ!!! **
Mary is said to be sinless and as such did not have pain in childbirth! Thats what I was taught!
Now, try digesting this one more time! Scripture interprets Scripture!
**Rev 12:1 A great and wondrous sign appeared in heaven: a woman clothed with the sun, with the moon under her feet and ****a crown of twelve stars on her head. (Notice it says the Woman is a sign-something that point beyond itself)
Rev 12:2 She was pregnant and cried out in pain as she was about to give birth.
Rev 12:3 Then another sign appeared in heaven: an enormous red dragon with seven heads and ten horns and seven crowns on his heads. (Notice the red dragon is also a sign-Satan)
Rev 12:4 His tail swept a third of the stars out of the sky and flung them to the earth. The dragon stood in front of the woman who was about to give birth, **so that he might devour her child the moment it was born.
Rev 12:5 She gave birth to a son, a male child, who will rule all the nations with an iron scepter. And her child was snatched up to God and to his throne.
**Now lets look at Genesis 37:9 which records the dream of Joseph: “…Lo, I have had still another dream; and behold, the sun and the moon and eleven stars (Joseph being number twelve) were bowing down to me” The twelve stars are the twelve tribes of Israel. You can also read Gen 49:1-28. **
Now read Jer. 4:31: "For I heard a cry as of a woman in labor, The anguish as of one giving birth to her first child, The cry of the daufgter of Zion gasping for breath"
Now read Isiah 66:7-8: “Before she travailed, she brought forth; Before her pain came, she gave birth to a boy. Who has heard such a thing? Who has seen such things? Can a land be born in one day? Can a nation be brought forth all at once? As soon as Zion travailed, she also brought forth her sons.” You can also read Isiah 26:17 and Micah 4:9.
This Woman is not a person but a symbol ! It is the people of God from whom comes the Messiah! Notice this Woman cries out in the pain of childbirth, which is contrary to Catholic teaching. This passage has nothing to do with Mary!
**The only reason you believe the Woman to be Mary is because thats what you have been taught by the Catholic Church. However, the Catholic Church is dead wrong and in fact is not the Church founded by Jesus Christ!!!
**
J
John1717
Guest
Church Militant:
**I doubt that you have the ability to “eat my lunch.” **
You must recognize that there are more of you than of me. I am more than willing to stay on topic yet I must be given the same opportunity to respond as everyone else!
** **
**Each time I attempt to stay on topic someone continues to lead me down a rabbit trail. **
**I doubt that you have the ability to “eat my lunch.” **
You must recognize that there are more of you than of me. I am more than willing to stay on topic yet I must be given the same opportunity to respond as everyone else!
**
**
J
John1717
Guest
Church Militant:
I doubt that you have the ability to “eat my lunch.” I have debated some prominent Catholic Apologists and have had great success!
I am more than willing to stay on topic yet I must be given the same opportunity to respond as everyone else!
Peace!
** **
Each time I attempt to stay on topic I am lead down a rabbit trail. If you review this thread you will discover that many do the same!
I doubt that you have the ability to “eat my lunch.” I have debated some prominent Catholic Apologists and have had great success!
I am more than willing to stay on topic yet I must be given the same opportunity to respond as everyone else!
Peace!
**
**
A
ANWK
Guest
Hi Xavier,
I read with interest regarding your point about Mary not being the mother of God. I am assuming that you will call her the mother of Jesus but not the mother of God?
Humour me a little here and go along with me part of the way. If Jesus is God and Mary is the mother of Jesus, why isn’t Mary the mother of God? Logic demands it as such.
So you say that Jesus predates Mary and thus on that account she cannot be His mother. I think everyone here acknowlegdes the fact that when we say that Mary is the mother of God, we are not saying that she is older than Jesus or anything like that.
We call her the mother of God because she gave birth to Jesus the person. Period.
Just like you, your immortal soul is given by God not your mother, but I seriously doubt that you introduce your mother as “Mrs. so-and-so, mother of my human nature” You would introduce her as “my mother”
For that matter, how do you think Jesus will introduce His mother? “my mother” or the “mother of my human nature”?
If we can claim to be brothers with Jesus and call on God as our Father, is it so difficult to grasp the concept that the woman who physically bore God in her womb for 9 months and shared a most intimate relationship with God, should be called the Mother of God?
You might say that you do not subscribe to logic. What about subscribing to the words of the Bible. If you can explain the words of Elizabeth, (while filled with the Holy Spirit) “the mother of my Lord” away, I think all of us will shut up.
(Try explaining this away and your problem is solved)
You might say that “Lord” does not equate “God”. Let me bring you to the words of Thomas when Jesus appeared to him after the Resurrection, when he exclaimed, “My Lord and my God”. Would that be sufficient proof that the 2 words, “Lord” and “God” when used in reference to Jesus are analagous?
Let’s go back to the Bible shall we, as apparently to you, everything must be proven from there. I think I have shown clearly that the phrase “Mother of God” comes from the Bible and from a source no less than the Holy Spirit Himself.
So what’s your objection this time round? Let’s hear you out.
I read with interest regarding your point about Mary not being the mother of God. I am assuming that you will call her the mother of Jesus but not the mother of God?
Humour me a little here and go along with me part of the way. If Jesus is God and Mary is the mother of Jesus, why isn’t Mary the mother of God? Logic demands it as such.
So you say that Jesus predates Mary and thus on that account she cannot be His mother. I think everyone here acknowlegdes the fact that when we say that Mary is the mother of God, we are not saying that she is older than Jesus or anything like that.
We call her the mother of God because she gave birth to Jesus the person. Period.
Just like you, your immortal soul is given by God not your mother, but I seriously doubt that you introduce your mother as “Mrs. so-and-so, mother of my human nature” You would introduce her as “my mother”
For that matter, how do you think Jesus will introduce His mother? “my mother” or the “mother of my human nature”?
If we can claim to be brothers with Jesus and call on God as our Father, is it so difficult to grasp the concept that the woman who physically bore God in her womb for 9 months and shared a most intimate relationship with God, should be called the Mother of God?
You might say that you do not subscribe to logic. What about subscribing to the words of the Bible. If you can explain the words of Elizabeth, (while filled with the Holy Spirit) “the mother of my Lord” away, I think all of us will shut up.
(Try explaining this away and your problem is solved)
You might say that “Lord” does not equate “God”. Let me bring you to the words of Thomas when Jesus appeared to him after the Resurrection, when he exclaimed, “My Lord and my God”. Would that be sufficient proof that the 2 words, “Lord” and “God” when used in reference to Jesus are analagous?
Let’s go back to the Bible shall we, as apparently to you, everything must be proven from there. I think I have shown clearly that the phrase “Mother of God” comes from the Bible and from a source no less than the Holy Spirit Himself.
So what’s your objection this time round? Let’s hear you out.
J
John1717
Guest
Each day I pray for all lost souls who are trustingin a system to save them!
Now let’s get back on topic!
A
ANWK
Guest
Hi Xavier,
I read with interest regarding your point about Mary not being the mother of God. I am assuming that you will call her the mother of Jesus but not the mother of God?
Humour me a little here and go along with me part of the way. If Jesus is God and Mary is the mother of Jesus, why isn’t Mary the mother of God? Logic demands it as such.
So you say that Jesus predates Mary and thus on that account she cannot be His mother. I think everyone here acknowlegdes the fact that when we say that Mary is the mother of God, we are not saying that she is older than Jesus or anything like that.
We call her the mother of God because she gave birth to Jesus the person. Period.
Just like you, your immortal soul is given by God not your mother, but I seriously doubt that you introduce your mother as “Mrs. so-and-so, mother of my human nature” You would introduce her as “my mother”
For that matter, how do you think Jesus will introduce His mother? “my mother” or the “mother of my human nature”?
If we can claim to be brothers with Jesus and call on God as our Father, is it so difficult to grasp the concept that the woman who physically bore God in her womb for 9 months and shared a most intimate relationship with God, should be called the Mother of God?
You might say that you do not subscribe to logic. What about subscribing to the words of the Bible. If you can explain the words of Elizabeth, (while filled with the Holy Spirit) “the mother of my Lord” away, I think all of us will shut up.
(Try explaining this away and your problem is solved)
You might say that “Lord” does not equate “God”. Let me bring you to the words of Thomas when Jesus appeared to him after the Resurrection, when he exclaimed, “My Lord and my God”. Would that be sufficient proof that the 2 words, “Lord” and “God” when used in reference to Jesus are analagous?
Let’s go back to the Bible shall we, as apparently to you, everything must be proven from there. I think I have shown clearly that the phrase “Mother of God” comes from the Bible and from a source no less than the Holy Spirit Himself.
So what’s your objection this time round? Let’s hear you out.
I read with interest regarding your point about Mary not being the mother of God. I am assuming that you will call her the mother of Jesus but not the mother of God?
Humour me a little here and go along with me part of the way. If Jesus is God and Mary is the mother of Jesus, why isn’t Mary the mother of God? Logic demands it as such.
So you say that Jesus predates Mary and thus on that account she cannot be His mother. I think everyone here acknowlegdes the fact that when we say that Mary is the mother of God, we are not saying that she is older than Jesus or anything like that.
We call her the mother of God because she gave birth to Jesus the person. Period.
Just like you, your immortal soul is given by God not your mother, but I seriously doubt that you introduce your mother as “Mrs. so-and-so, mother of my human nature” You would introduce her as “my mother”
For that matter, how do you think Jesus will introduce His mother? “my mother” or the “mother of my human nature”?
If we can claim to be brothers with Jesus and call on God as our Father, is it so difficult to grasp the concept that the woman who physically bore God in her womb for 9 months and shared a most intimate relationship with God, should be called the Mother of God?
You might say that you do not subscribe to logic. What about subscribing to the words of the Bible. If you can explain the words of Elizabeth, (while filled with the Holy Spirit) “the mother of my Lord” away, I think all of us will shut up.
(Try explaining this away and your problem is solved)
You might say that “Lord” does not equate “God”. Let me bring you to the words of Thomas when Jesus appeared to him after the Resurrection, when he exclaimed, “My Lord and my God”. Would that be sufficient proof that the 2 words, “Lord” and “God” when used in reference to Jesus are analagous?
Let’s go back to the Bible shall we, as apparently to you, everything must be proven from there. I think I have shown clearly that the phrase “Mother of God” comes from the Bible and from a source no less than the Holy Spirit Himself.
So what’s your objection this time round? Let’s hear you out.
- Status