Most Catholic women use birth control banned by church

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Serap said:
but in using NFP, they are also saying “NO” to God by having relations when the couple is not fertile.

it would be more unitive if they didn’t refrain during the woman’s ovulation.
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How is a couple saying “No” to God by utilizing His design?
 
estesbob said:
I wonder if this applies to an unmarried couple? They are already committing a sin by having sex outside of marriage but is their sin compounded if they use a condom? I’ve never been able to get a clear answer as to whether Humanae Vitae applies to unmarried couples.
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I think their sin would be compounded, yes, because having extra-marital sex AND using a condom is sort of a double slap in God’s face (although, in some cases – as B16 has said – it’s use could be an indication their conscience is recognizing the sin and attempting to mitigate the consequences).
 
wanner47 said:
I think their sin would be compounded, yes, because having extra-marital sex AND using a condom is sort of a double slap in God’s face (although, in some cases – as B16 has said – it’s use could be an indication their conscience is recognizing the sin and attempting to mitigate the consequences).
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The logic escapes me BUT I accept it. To be honest the mechanics of the Transubstantiation somewhat baffle me alo but I accept it!
 
markomalley said:
The trouble is that the majority of the lost sheep dealt with in what we would deem a “kind” manner repented. Jesus was, in fact, very matter of fact with people.

Pussyfooting around something doesn’t serve the other person at all.

This is not an advocacy for being mean, but sometimes plain, candid, forthright, frank speech is called for.
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No one is saying that the truth should not be presented. Its just that some presentations of the truth are better than others…
 
NewEnglandPries said:
No one is saying that the truth should not be presented. Its just that some presentations of the truth are better than others…
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Agreed.

Unfortunately, there are some who classify any sort of proclamation of the truth, no matter the degree of sensitivity with which it is given, as intolerance.
 
Serap said:
but in using NFP, they are also saying “NO” to God by having relations when the couple is not fertile.

it would be more unitive if they didn’t refrain during the woman’s ovulation.
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No, this would only be true if regulation of births was in it’s self fundamentally evil. It is not however, the CCC is clear that the regulation of births is a part of being a responsible parent. This can be achived using the methods God has provided for us, that is fasting from sexuality when one does not want a child. This brings up another good with regard to NFP, fasting… Fasting is always a good, it is a mortification which kills the desires of the flesh and brings us closer to God.

So rather than being another form of contraception, it becomes something quite different.
 
This is my disconnect:

A couple uses NFP for 10 years to avoid a child. They purposefully avoid sex during her fertile time every cycle and say no to creating a baby - they are happy with 2 kids.

A couple uses condoms for 10 years to avoid a child. They are also happy with 2 kids.

The outcome is the same.
 
Serap said:
This is my disconnect:

A couple uses NFP for 10 years to avoid a child. They purposefully avoid sex during her fertile time every cycle and say no to creating a baby - they are happy with 2 kids.

A couple uses condoms for 10 years to avoid a child. They are also happy with 2 kids.

The outcome is the same.
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A kid really wants a new toy. He asks his mom and she buys it for him.

A kid really wants a new toy. He takes the money out of his mothers purse and buys it himself.

The outcome is the same.
One is a sin, the other isn’t!
 
Serap said:
This is my disconnect:

A couple uses NFP for 10 years to avoid a child. They purposefully avoid sex during her fertile time every cycle and say no to creating a baby - they are happy with 2 kids.

A couple uses condoms for 10 years to avoid a child. They are also happy with 2 kids.

The outcome is the same.
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Another analogy, similar to happymommy’s:

A man wants to support his family, so he gets a job, works hard, and earns a steady paycheck.

A man wants to support his family, so he robs liquor stores every week.

In each case, the family is supported. However, earning a paycheck is moral, but robbing a liquor store is sinful.

The ends don’t justify the means. Each scenario has a good end, but evil means. As it says in the Bible, we may never do evil so that good may result.
 
Serap said:
This is my disconnect:

A couple uses NFP for 10 years to avoid a child. They purposefully avoid sex during her fertile time every cycle and say no to creating a baby - they are happy with 2 kids.

A couple uses condoms for 10 years to avoid a child. They are also happy with 2 kids.

The outcome is the same.
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The outcome is the same because the intent is the same and each couple uses mechanisms and methods to achieve what they intended. I have no problem with NFP because I have no problem with contraception. NFP is a form of contraception, and it is no more or less “natural” than the other available methods of contraception.
 
TMC said:
The outcome is the same because the intent is the same and each couple uses mechanisms and methods to achieve what they intended. I have no problem with NFP because I have no problem with contraception. NFP is a form of contraception, and it is no more or less “natural” than the other available methods of contraception.
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NFP is not a form of contraception. :rolleyes:
 
TMC said:
The outcome is the same because the intent is the same and each couple uses mechanisms and methods to achieve what they intended. I have no problem with NFP because I have no problem with contraception. NFP is a form of contraception, and it is no more or less “natural” than the other available methods of contraception.
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Well, it doesn’t really matter if you have a problem with it or not. :o The Church has a “problem” with contraception and for one to be faithful to the Church one has to follow what she says.
 
1holycatholic said:
No, it’s heresy.

A Catholic who willingly embraces what they know to be contrary to revealed truth is a formal heretic. There is no such thing as a good faith disagreement. Heresy incurs automatic (latae sententiae) excommunication.
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Thank you for posting this. I was was getting confused with some of the other responses.:confused: I was always under the assumption that if a Catholic disagreed with the teachings, that they were still obligated to follow them, regardless.
 
wanner47 said:
Another analogy, similar to happymommy’s:

A man wants to support his family, so he gets a job, works hard, and earns a steady paycheck.

A man wants to support his family, so he robs liquor stores every week.

In each case, the family is supported. However, earning a paycheck is moral, but robbing a liquor store is sinful.

The ends don’t justify the means. Each scenario has a good end, but evil means. As it says in the Bible, we may never do evil so that good may result.
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Those two analogies make no sense to me!!!

Both married couples are not doing anything wrong.
 
Serap said:
Those two analogies make no sense to me!!!

Both married couples are not doing anything wrong.
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You don’t see the sin in the analogies:confused:

You are right both married couples are not doing anything wrong, just the one!!
 
1holycatholic said:
NFP is not a form of contraception. :rolleyes:
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It is a method to have sex without conception. So, how is it not contraception? The NFP website all tout NFP as being as effective as the pill. To say NFP is not contraception is a strained semantic argument that relies on simply redefining contraception to exclude NFP.
 
happymommy said:
Well, it doesn’t really matter if you have a problem with it or not. :o The Church has a “problem” with contraception and for one to be faithful to the Church one has to follow what she says.
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Well, it matters to me, but I would not expect it to matter to you. I otherwise agree with your post.
 
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