Rioting aftermath in Kenosha

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Are you able to answer my question, or just ignoring it?
What’s with the attitude? I went back through the last 100 posts in this thread, and you have not asked me any questions, unless I missed one…which is possible. Are you sure you meant this comment for me?

I only commented about your statement “unarmed.” Your response is fair, but the term “unarmed” IMHO didn’t accurately portray the reality of the situation.
 
CNN is great at creative writing 😉

“FIERY BUT MOSTLY PEACEFUL PROTESTS …”
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Generally, those are “pattern” offenses that don’t necessarily reflect anything other than failure to ensure that one meets a racial quota.
. . . . That’s not what the suits involved at all.

" The lawsuit was based on evidence gathered by testers for the New York City Human Rights Division, which alleged that black people who went to Trump buildings were told there were no apartments available, while white people were offered units.

Back then, Sheila Morse worked as one of those testers. When a black New Yorker was turned down for service and racial bias was suspected, Morse, who is white, would be dispatched to see if she received different treatment.

In this case, a black man in search of an apartment in Brooklyn in 1972 saw a sign on a building: “apartment for rent.”

"He met with the superintendent, and the superintendent said, ‘I’m very sorry, but the apartment is rented — it’s gone,’ " Morse says. "So the gentlemen said to him, ‘Well, why is the sign out? I still see a sign that says apartment for rent.’ And the superintendent said, ‘Oh, I guess I forgot to take it down.’ "

When Morse went to the building to ask about the same apartment, she says, “They greeted me with open arms and showed me every aspect of the apartment.”

Morse says she reported her experience to the Human Rights Commission, and then returned to the apartment building. After she was offered a lease, the black man who had tried to rent the apartment entered the office with a city human rights commissioner, and the three of them confronted the building superintendent.

"He said, ‘Well, I’m only doing what my boss told me to do — I am not allowed to rent to black tenants,’ " Morse says.

The commissioner asked the building superintendent to take him to his boss. That turned out to be Trump Management."


" Donald Trump furiously fought the civil rights suit in the courts and the media, but the Trumps eventually settled on terms that were widely regarded as a victory for the government. Three years later, the government sued the Trumps again, for continuing to discriminate.

In fairness, those suits date from long ago, and the discriminatory policies were probably put in place not by Donald Trump but by his father. Fred Trump appears to have been arrested at a Ku Klux Klan rally in 1927; Woody Guthrie, who lived in a Trump property in the 1950s, lambasted Fred Trump in recently discovered papers for stirring racial hatred.

Yet even if Donald Trump inherited his firm’s discriminatory policies, he allied himself decisively in the 1970s housing battle against the civil rights movement."


Remember Trump tried to say Cruz’ father was involved in the JFK assassination because of ties to ‘Fair Deal for Cuba’? What should we say about Fred Trump’s demonstrated history of racism?
 
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For all the claims that police departments are separate from the Democrat cities they serve in, there is one thing that has to be remembered.

The police chief is usually appointed by the mayor and/or the city council. The police chief typically reports to the mayor or to a commission appointed by the mayor. For instance, Portland Mayor Ted Wheeler is the Portland Police Department’s ultimate boss. One example of many.

So if the Democrats were really and truly serious about reforming police after decades of poor conduct occurrences, they have always had the power to appoint someone at the top to push the changes downward.

Hence the progressives who run the cities and then cry police brutality need to look in the mirror to find where the ultimate blame goes.

Leaf talks about training the cops differently. I’ll buy that. But, but, but … the mayor and the city council of those progressive cities have always had the power to make that happen. But the bad incidents keep happening. Whose fault is that? Run the line of responsibility up to the top and it takes lots of mental gymnastics to not notice that the buck stops not with the police executives but with the people they report to who are running the cities: the mayors and the city councils.

But they won’t go there. Progressives hate that word “responsibility”. Unfortunately, it’s very relevant here.
 
Check out some lowlights:


Trump’s real-estate company tried to avoid renting apartments to African-Americans in the 1970s and gave preferential treatment to whites, according to the federal government.

Trump treated black employees at his casinos differently from whites, according to multiple sources. A former hotel executive said Trump criticized a black accountant: “Black guys counting my money! I hate it. … I think that the guy is lazy. And it’s probably not his fault, because laziness is a trait in blacks .”

In 1989, Trump took out ads in New York newspapers urging the death penalty for five black and Latino teenagers accused of raping a white woman in Central Park; he argued they were guilty as late as June 2019, more than 15 years after DNA evidence had exonerated them.

He began his 2016 presidential campaign with a speech disparaging Mexican immigrants as criminals and “rapists.”

He uses the gang MS-13 to disparage all immigrants . Among many other statements, he has suggested that Obama’s protection of the Dreamers — otherwise law-abiding immigrants who were brought to the United States illegally as children — contributed to the spread of MS-13.

In December 2015, Trump called for a “a total and complete shutdown of Muslims entering the United States ,” including refusing to readmit Muslim-American citizens who were outside of the country at the time.

Trump said a federal judge hearing a case about Trump University was biased because of the judge’s Mexican heritage .

In June 2017, Trump said 15,000 recent immigrants from Haiti “all have AIDS” and that 40,000 Nigerians, once seeing the United States, would never “go back to their huts” in Africa.

At the White House on Jan. 11, Trump vulgarly called for less immigration from Haiti and Africa and more from Norway.
 
Oh me, too. Innocence just looks far-fetched at this point, but hopefully the courts can work this out without any lies or deception involved.
At that time we can then agree, regardless of the outcome. I agree now that, pending the evidence, it looks outside a reasonable response.
Democrats tend to cluster in urban areas. I don’t trust any politician to run them.
That just tells me they get elected over and over. It doesn’t answer the question of why this continues to happen. Why have they not changed the culture and practice when they’ve controlled it for decades.
But the Right needs to stop this silly thinking that every time a cop does something good, they get the credit, and every time a cop does something bad, it’s the Democrats’ fault.
I’m perfectly willing to give credit where due.
There is not a single Democrat politician who has shot a citizen that I know of, but they are in charge of these institutions. They are ultimately responsible for the culture and practice in their police departments.
This isn’t about race. It is about how we view the role of government, the primary role being to protect individual rights.
Shifting the blame for sin is unbecoming to us as Catholics and as Americans.
Do you want to claim that only the police officer is responsible for Blake being shot in the back? Okay.
Then do not shift the blame to America writ large, or Americans who happen to be Caucasian.
Do not shift the blame for slavery to Americans today through “reparations”.
Do not shift the blame for the rioting and looting to those not doing it.
How do you figure? If Democrats can “set the culture” for the police force, why can’t the police force itself?
For whom do they work?
For the record, I don’t know if the cop had racist thoughts at the time. I’m not a mind reader, and racism occurs passive-aggressively, i.e. deliberately made difficult to call out.
The first part I agree with. The second not so much. Racists tend to make their views known. It is often a cause to them.
Which coroner?
 
The rioters at least do not pretend to abide by the law. What they are doing is against the law, they know it and everyone knows it.
Not according to some**strong text**, but I agree.
A cop brutalizes someone which is not part of police procedure and they get away with it.
Name one who has “gotten away with it”. Every one of these incidents goes through the legal process.
The latter is more dangerous.
The rioters are at least as dangerous. We’re beginning to see the evidence, as others have started to fight back, protect their property. People will not sit back indefinitely when their property and lives are threatened.
 
CNN is great at creative writing 😉

“FIERY BUT MOSTLY PEACEFUL PROTESTS …”
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Just look at how peaceful that fire is. Anyone have marshmallows?
 
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The rioters are at least as dangerous. We’re beginning to see the evidence, as others have started to fight back, protect their property. People will not sit back indefinitely when their property and lives are threatened.
When the police are told to stand down or are otherwise occupied elsewhere, the people will take matters into their own hands.

Some will decry that as “vigilante justice”. What will they say when rioters are on their street coming for their business and the police they distrust so much is occupied elsewhere?

Today BLM seems to look more like Burning, Looting and Mayhem than Black Lives Matter. The original message of peaceful protesters has long since been hijacked severely. People who take matters into their own hands may end up being the only ones who make sure that Mayhem doesn’t become Murder.
 
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Name one who has “gotten away with it”. Every one of these incidents goes through the legal process.
A policeman killed Daniel Shaver in 2016 and not only got away with it, he was essentially rewarded. He retired in 2018 and received a pension of $2,500. Apparently he suffered from PTSD afterwards. Here is the footage of the killing. It’s very hard to watch.


There have been other such cases.
 
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LeafByNiggle:
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KMC:
Floyd had a lethal amount of drugs in his system
It is important to get the story straight. What the medical examiner said was that Floyd had a level of fentanyl that if he were found dead at home with no other apparent cause of death, they would assume it was the fentanyl. But he specifically said “that does not mean this is what killed him.”
True, but it is quite relevant when a jury looks to convict for murder or manslaughter
Not necessarily. What will matter is whether a reasonable police officer would think that kneeling on someone’s neck like Chauvin did presents an unreasonable threat to the person’s life. If they determine it is so, then the presence of fentanyl would not matter. To give an analogy, most adults can hold their breath for one minute under water quite easily. But if an officer held someone’s head under water for exactly one minute, and if, unbeknownst to the police officer, the person had asthma and could not hold his breath that long, the fact that he had asthma would not change the guilt of the police officer.
If it was mentioned, I missed it, Wisconsin DOJ say he had a knife in the car.
Unless he had the knife in his hand and was threatening people with it, the presence of the knife does not excuse shooting him.
It is progressives, even on this forum, who have decided without all the evidence that the cop is guilty.
The “judgments” expressed here in the forum have no legal weight and will not determine the cop’s fate. In such cases, people tend to say what they think without requiring the proof that a jury would require. All you have to do is look how many times conservatives have declared, quite emphatically, that Hillary is guilty of something and should be locked up. So it seems that the propensity to “jump to conclusions” depends mostly on the degree to which that conclusion conforms to one’s political leaning.
As for progressive run cities…
You might just as well say “large cities” for it is a fact that large cities tend to be led by progressives, and any conclusion that you were about to make probably follows from the size and density of the city and not from the political leaning of the ones leading it.
 
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It was his knee, and it was brutal and cruel and beyond reason, but that isn’t what killed Floyd, according to the coroner.
Wrong. Read the coroner’s report again. He specifically said “that doesn’t mean the fentanyl is what killed him”. He left the issue open.
 
According to the Catholic Bishops there is something wrong with anti-immigration policies.
I have never heard anything more insulting than when middle class white People talk about how black people cannot a) drive to get an ID
Wrong. They say that poor people in general, black or white, have difficulty with transportation.
, b) afford to get an ID,
Just plain wrong.
c) cannot vote republican,
Correction: “Should not vote Republican”. Just like Trump says they “should not vote Democratic”.
c) suffer from ‘white ideas’ like: hard work.
Another “just plain wrong.”
 
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Do not presume to know how I think of them. I cited a reference on immigration. Did you read it? Do you agree with it?
As the Church teaches, a nations first duty is to its citizens, and sometimes that means limiting the amount of immigration.
OK, if you are going to refine your very general statement of “there is nothing inherently wrong with anti-immigration policies” to “sometimes it is necessary to limit the amount of immigration”, that is a much more acceptable statement. But you can see how your more general statement was,…,well,…too general.
 
Unless he had the knife in his hand and was threatening people with it, the presence of the knife does not excuse shooting him.
Knives kill thousands of people. Of course, it was a weapon that one needs to defend themselves from.
 
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