Someone can lose their salvation?

  • Thread starter Thread starter guanophore
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
đź‘‹

I’m a 5 point Calvinist. :whistle:

There seems to be some misunderstanding as to what Refomed Theology is. Here is a good site to browse around to learn:

monergism.com/

:tiphat:
Thanks for the link and you just gave yourself the kiss of death for making that pronouncement…God bless ya!
 
What does “fear and trembling” mean? Security? Not.

I know not if you are Calvinist, but the entire concept seems to be the leading of a demon. Why try for Heaven if you cannot reach it? Why try to avoid hell if it is inevitable?
Such a cruel god that would be. A god whom actively damns people to Hell and they are his mere puppets.

Disgusting.

Maybe that’s why all the Calvinists I know are miserable people. Except for my aunt. She’s about the only one I know that isn’t.
 
Such a cruel god that would be. A god whom actively damns people to Hell and they are his mere puppets.

Disgusting.

Maybe that’s why all the Calvinists I know are miserable people. Except for my aunt. She’s about the only one I know that isn’t.
The only thing a reprobate hates more than being in hell is the thought of being in heaven. What is unmerciful or wrong about justice?
 
I see nothing wrong with acknowledging that the Creator has the power and the right to determine what is to be done with his creation. Should the clay ask the potter “why have you made me like this?”
 
This will be interesting, can’t wait to see…my gut tells me you will not read my words carefully, but we will see.
What do you mean by your “gut?”

When you say that I will not read your words “carefully” I have to wonder what kind of discussion will develop; but I will say that the Catholics here have done a good job of disproving your tenets regarding OSAS.

The only thing thats left for them to do now is to prove their own position a lot better.

I will be back. I am busy reading your words carefully, and won’t have time to both read and reply tonight…
 
The only thing a reprobate hates more than being in hell is the thought of being in heaven. What is unmerciful or wrong about justice?
Nothing is wrong with Justice.

But creating controlled puppets to damn to eternal Hell is not what I call the workings of a merciful deity.
 
In reverence for God in your works - part of sanctification process; nothing to do with justification.
But it remains a process. A life-long process, as we’re never complete and perfected in this life. God, Who created every molecule of our physical being, every firing of each synapse, all thought processes, knows us full well. He alone realizes where we are in our conversion. This causes me to wonder why He would give graces to those who are damned. I also wonder why He would test those who are guaranteed Heaven.
 
The sacrifice of the Mass contradicts the biblical teaching that Jesus died once for all,(Heb. 9:26-28) Protestant 101
101, long time! I hope and pray that you are well. OFF TOPIC RISK: As to your sig, you have certainly been advised that each mass in the same sacrifice - the one sacrifice that also saved you? Please tell me that you can grasp this! Care to begin a thread?
 
Are there Calvinists with more than 5 points? Less? What are those 5 points?
A Five-Point Calvinist follows TULIP:

Total Depravity
Unconditional Election
Limited Atonement
Irresistible Grace
Perserverence of the Elect

Oh, okay, I got it.
 
A Five-Point Calvinist follows TULIP:

Total Depravity
Unconditional Election
Limited Atonement
Irresistible Grace
Perserverence of the Elect

Oh, okay, I got it.
Thank you! it helps to know where they are coming from. I have immediate questions with three of the five. Maybe I’ll just Google a little and read up.
 
101, long time! I hope and pray that you are well. OFF TOPIC RISK: As to your sig, you have certainly been advised that each mass in the same sacrifice - the one sacrifice that also saved you? Please tell me that you can grasp this! Care to begin a thread?
I started one for him earlier today in the Apologetics forum and invited him to join us by PM…we’ll see…
 
Nothing is wrong with Justice.

But creating controlled puppets to damn to eternal Hell is not what I call the workings of a merciful deity.
Paul was asked the same kinds of things. He covered this in Romans 9.

Romans 9:13-24

[13] As it is written, “Jacob I loved, but Esau I hated.”
[14] What shall we say then? Is there injustice on God’s part? By no means!
[15] For he says to Moses, “I will have mercy on whom I have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I have compassion.”
[16] So it depends not upon man’s will or exertion, but upon God’s mercy.
[17] For the scripture says to Pharaoh, “I have raised you up for the very purpose of showing my power in you, so that my name may be proclaimed in all the earth.”
[18] So then he has mercy upon whomever he wills, and he hardens the heart of whomever he wills.
[19] You will say to me then, “Why does he still find fault? For who can resist his will?”
[20] But who are you, a man, to answer back to God? Will what is molded say to its molder, “Why have you made me thus?”
[21] Has the potter no right over the clay, to make out of the same lump one vessel for beauty and another for menial use?
[22] What if God, desiring to show his wrath and to make known his power, has endured with much patience the vessels of wrath made for destruction,
[23] in order to make known the riches of his glory for the vessels of mercy, which he has prepared beforehand for glory,
[24] even us whom he has called, not from the Jews only but also from the Gentiles?

The wonderful thing is that God saves! He doesn’t have to save anyone and he would still be good. There is nothing wrong with Justice. He gives mercy to some. He gives justice to others. Nobody deserves anything but justice. So he is indeed a good God of mercy and justice. 🙂
 
Paul was asked the same kinds of things. He covered this in Romans 9.

Romans 9:13-24

[13] As it is written, “Jacob I loved, but Esau I hated.”
Wasn’t He speaking on a national level here (Esau, meaning Edom and Jacob being Israel and Judah)?
[14] What shall we say then? Is there injustice on God’s part? By no means!
[15] For he says to Moses, “I will have mercy on whom I have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I have compassion.”
[16] So it depends not upon man’s will or exertion, but upon God’s mercy.
[17] For the scripture says to Pharaoh, “I have raised you up for the very purpose of showing my power in you, so that my name may be proclaimed in all the earth.”
[18] So then he has mercy upon whomever he wills, and he hardens the heart of whomever he wills.
[19] You will say to me then, “Why does he still find fault? For who can resist his will?”
[20] But who are you, a man, to answer back to God? Will what is molded say to its molder, “Why have you made me thus?”
[21] Has the potter no right over the clay, to make out of the same lump one vessel for beauty and another for menial use?
[22] What if God, desiring to show his wrath and to make known his power, has endured with much patience the vessels of wrath made for destruction,
[23] in order to make known the riches of his glory for the vessels of mercy, which he has prepared beforehand for glory,
[24] even us whom he has called, not from the Jews only but also from the Gentiles?
Arguing Calvinistic Predestination versus Catholic positions (there is an allowable diversity of opinion on this issue, some Thomists and some Molinists) is my weakpoint, actually, when it comes to theology. But I do not see how you ignore verses which explicitly speak of people falling away or for people to be careful not to fall away. He’s a tidbit: catholic.com/thisrock/1993/9309fea1.asp
The wonderful thing is that God saves! He doesn’t have to save anyone and he would still be good. There is nothing wrong with Justice. He gives mercy to some. He gives justice to others. Nobody deserves anything but justice. So he is indeed a good God of mercy and justice. 🙂
But that shows partiality. And “God is no respecter of persons”. Partiality would overthrow Justice.

I could never worship a God who damns on a whim-- think about it, people created just to rot in Hell. I could never believe in God that way. And plus you have no way of knowing if you really were the ones predestined for Heaven. You could die, and expect Heaven and be suffering in Hell for eternity.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top