Sunday Best? Church Leaders Blush at "Casual Catholic" Dress

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I am not asking for a return to the 1950’s where most men and boys wore a 3 piece suit and dress shoes, and women/girls wore a dress or skirt/dress top-blouse with dress shoes combo with a hat.

I would rather see people come to Mass not wearing:

*Athletic wear
*Concert tees
*Tee shirts with vulgar sayings, concert tees, etc
*Tight / Revealing clothing of any fabric
*Excessive showing of chest hair (men) and cleavage (women)
*Sleeveless and/or backless tops mainly spaghetti strap or tank styles as examples
*Dresses / skirts for women that are above the top of the knees
*Flip flop sandals
*Grungy looking tennis shoes
*Shorts that do not reach the knees, and/or tight-revealing.
Ditto. But don’t you know? That’s “pretentious,” “judging people,” and “snotty.” 😉

Who knew?
🙂
I think it’s not asking for much to leave the symbols of the culture, the low standards of the culture, and the degradation of the culture outside of the nave and the sanctuary. (Many who wear extremes of the above, such as short-short-shorts, and high-thigh mini skirts, are EMHC’s.)

Thanks for your civility, and for not calling names. 🙂
 
That sounds very reasonable…however the formal wear rules out other posters who suggest wearing your best like you were going to a wedding or to meet the president… 🙂
How do you dress for a wedding? Men: suit or jacket and slacks, women: nice dress or skirt/slacks and blouse? Same for meeting the President. Hardly formal wear.

And I reject the nonsense that Jesus wants me at Mass any way I choose to present myself there. I think that He deserves at least as good as anyone we’d be meeting at business or work.
 
^ Elizabeth, thank you for your dignified response to an off the wall, completely unmerited remark.

Some on this thread don’t seem to understand that in one sense, it isn’t about the clothes at all, but that the outer being reflects our souls, who we really are. What insult we bring upon ourselves when we don’t dress with dignity for Mass – for the Lord!

But apparently the word casual dress has a politically correct dimension now and is an antonym for respect. Respect for the people around you, respect for the occasion, or even respect for the dignity of self is now lost to the wind. I’m done with this thread, but am very heartened that our priests are being bolder in speaking out and signs are appearing on more doors of Catholic Churches.
I think some of the responses on this thread actually do reflect a very non-Catholic attitude, in that
(1) the standards of the culture can or even should prevail – no matter how inappropriate to a Catholic settting

(2) the idea that any individual should be influenced by even their own Church’s suggestions for an appropriate category (not price) of clothing is something that enrages anyone who considers himself or herself an autonomous unit (Also = a reflection of the culture, as you have said Tigg – it’s about The Supreme Reign of the Self, and watch what happens when anyone, in or out of the Church, dares to suggest otherwise); there is an undercurrent of hostility about the idea of being guided by even one’s own Church’s standards

(3) the concept of giving offense (which is also a Catholic Christian concept) is not one which some Massgoers have any respect for or consideration of

(4) engagement in this topic itself is one which some believe is simply out of bounds, regardless of the document you mention, regardless of the Catholic commentary which precipitated the thread. It’s an excuse by some to turn the topic into something which has nothing to do with it: the straw man of class warfare. I repeat: at least in my region, very casual clothing is often much more expensive than 'business casual" clothing; whether that ultra-casual clothing is T-shirts, jeans, “label” cut-offs, “label” flip-flops, athletic shoes (especially expensive), or micro-mini skirts.

Thanks for all your insightful contributions.
 
Ditto. But don’t you know? That’s “pretentious,” “judging people,” and “snotty.” 😉

Who knew?
🙂
I think it’s not asking for much to leave the symbols of the culture, the low standards of the culture, and the degradation of the culture outside of the nave and the sanctuary. (Many who wear extremes of the above, such as short-short-shorts, and high-thigh mini skirts, are EMHC’s.)

Thanks for your civility, and for not calling names. 🙂
:rolleyes:

“You and I probably wouldn’t associate IRL, because my friends and I value (name removed by moderator)ut from each, see each other as valid role models to look up to”

Translation: Annabelle Marie, I probably wouldn’t consider you a valid role model to look up to.

Nice.

Not that I would know if Annabelle Marie would really care what you thought of her.

But apparently what is civil and charitable, pretentious and judging, all appear to be in the eyes of the beholder.
 
How do you dress for a wedding? Men: suit or jacket and slacks, women: nice dress or skirt/slacks and blouse? Same for meeting the President. Hardly formal wear.

And I reject the nonsense that Jesus wants me at Mass any way I choose to present myself there. I think that He deserves at least as good as anyone we’d be meeting at business or work.
No. I’ve attended many weddings inside a Catholic church without a suit or jacket.
 
How do you dress for a wedding? Men: suit or jacket and slacks, women: nice dress or skirt/slacks and blouse? Same for meeting the President. Hardly formal wear.

And I reject the nonsense that Jesus wants me at Mass any way I choose to present myself there. I think that He deserves at least as good as anyone we’d be meeting at business or work.
Again, it depends upon the formality of the situation: I’m going to a wedding this weekend, Catholic, that is a picnic theme. The wedding is in the morning, the picnic is immediately after. The attire is casual, I kid you not.

And if I was meeting the President for a casual occasion, I wouldn’t dress in fancy clothes if it was something on the White House lawn and he was also dressed casually.
 
:“You and I probably wouldn’t associate IRL, because my friends and I value (name removed by moderator)ut from each, see each other as valid role models to look up to”

Translation: Annabelle Marie, I probably wouldn’t consider you a valid role model to look up to.
No. That’s not the translation. The translation is in the behavior she said she would engage in if a friend merely made a comment about changing clothes:

She would consider the comment “snotty.”
She would “simply ignore” her friend.

I can’t conceive of doing that. I don’t ignore my friends. I have immense respect for them; that’s precisely why they are my friends: they and I share values and are not superficial. If I questioned their comment or their judgment about something, I would discuss it with them directly, not “simply ignore them.” Second, I would not consider such a personal comment a friend made, on his or her own individual clothing preferences (the category of clothing, not the price or ostentatiousness or social importance of the clothing), to be “snotty.” If I questioned why my friend wanted/needed to change clothing, I respect my friends enough to ask them directly, not “ignore” them or walk away.

Thanks, however, for the mistranslation, and another Straw Man. A few more of these and we can start a politically correct bonfire. 😉
 
source: Matthew 6:25

Getting people to Mass for the good of their souls is much more important than what they are wearing. And if the body is more important than clothes, how much more so the soul?
And Antonivis, taking this a step further, I would think for Catholics their desire that people be called to receive the Body of Christ, would be of far, far greater importance than worrying about what clothing those souls receive Him in.
 
And Antonivis, taking this a step further, I would think for Catholics their desire that people be called to receive the Body of Christ, would be of far, far greater importance than worrying about what clothing those souls receive Him in.
It’s not about “worrying.” It’s about joining together as a common Body with the same mind/purpose, distinguished from the mind/purpose we have when:

going to the beach
going on a picnic
grocery shopping
watering the lawn
watching a football game
walking the dog

The less outrageously people are dressed (for the occasion), the less most people are focused on the appearance of others, the more they can focus on their common purpose in attending. That is verifiable human behavior. The ones who are distracting are the ones whose attire and/or behavior (often they’re combined) are inappropriate for the moment, whatever that moment or setting is.
 
No. That’s not the translation. The translation is in the behavior she said she would engage in if a friend merely made a comment about changing clothes:

She would consider the comment “snotty.”
She would “simply ignore” her friend.

I can’t conceive of doing that. I don’t ignore my friends. I have immense respect for them; that’s precisely why they are my friends: they and I share values and are not superficial. If I questioned their comment or their judgment about something, I would discuss it with them directly, not “simply ignore them.” Second, I would not consider such a personal comment a friend made, on his or her own individual clothing preferences (the category of clothing, not the price or ostentatiousness or social importance of the clothing), to be “snotty.” If I questioned why my friend wanted/needed to change clothing, I respect my friends enough to ask them directly, not “ignore” them or walk away.

Thanks, however, for the mistranslation, and another Straw Man. A few more of these and we can start a politically correct bonfire. 😉
You’re welcome. Just shared how it sounded to me since you were discussing how you and her would probably not associate because your friends are role models to look up. And you were addressing Annabelle Marie.
 
It’s not about “worrying.” It’s about joining together as a common Body with the same mind/purpose, distinguished from the mind/purpose we have when:

going to the beach
going on a picnic
grocery shopping
watering the lawn
watching a football game
walking the dog

The less outrageously people are dressed (for the occasion), the less most people are focused on the appearance of others, the more they can focus on their common purpose in attending. That is verifiable human behavior. The ones who are distracting are the ones whose attire and/or behavior (often they’re combined) are inappropriate for the moment, whatever that moment or setting is.
But some parishes and even depending upon the mass time at other parishes, casual attire is what the majority of the parishoners wear, so they are joining together as a common Body. Especially during football season at some of the parishes in my town, you stick out as sore thumb if you aren’t wearing your favorite team jersey. Its what the common body around here prefers.
 
There is etiquet for any secular event, but for the Lord we give the last of us! This is the example we “catholics” give to the world!!!

God help us!!!
 
I love this from a blog about dress for Mass:

“And then something happened: I started to understand Mass. Once I began making Daily Mass a part of my life, Church wasn’t merely someplace sacred: it was **HOME. **All that really mattered was spending as much time with Jesus as possible. And you can’t spend as much time with Jesus as possible if you maintain that what you normally wear on a Tuesday morning is inappropriate for Mass. Dress snobbery dropped away. Maybe those who wore jeans did so not because they cared less, but because they cared so much about being with Jesus that they weren’t caught up on spending their Sunday mornings trying to look good.”

Some posters are right that it is about the heart and should not be only about us…but who are you to judge what others heart is? If it’s clean, modest, and neat, what do you care? Is there a reason it has to be a suit? Or a dress?

As for me…I’ll dress from the heart…and all the other part of it will fall away.

As a side note…I found this really interesting…I think God has a sense of humor. I’m a brand new EMHC on Sat nights. So I have decided that when I’m serving I will not wear jeans. So for about two months I didn’t even wear jeans on Sat night period…in case I was called to fill in. Then labor day weekend…all the clothes in the wash, I was retaining water like Hoover dam, so I went to Mass in my jeans…I wasn’t scheduled to serve, I had not really been called to fill in…as most people didn’t realize I was an EMHC yet. What happened…you got it…I was called to fill in. Now some of you will berate me I’m sure for not making sure the wash was done, and that I wasn’t bloated or some other thing I’m sure…but see…that’s the reason I go to Mass…because I’m not perfect!
Annabelle Marie, I’ve been to weekday Mass. I’ve seen laborers who wear jeans to work and they stop for Mass on their way. Don’t they receive the same Jesus on Tuesday as Sunday?

But I think while some here seem to believe they are the appointed fashion patrol, God has settled the jeans issue at least. Obviously since He saw you in jeans and He still called you to serve Him, God doesn’t mind if you wear jeans. Thanks for sharing my friend.
 
But some parishes and even depending upon the mass time at other parishes, casual attire is what the majority of the parishoners wear, so they are joining together as a common Body. Especially during football season at some of the parishes in my town, you stick out as sore thumb if you aren’t wearing your favorite team jersey. Its what the common body around here prefers.
And I’ll bet Jesus still calls and welcomes them in His house to receive Him in their team’s jerseys doesn’t He? 👍

Now I’m wondering if He was present in the earthly body He walked on earth in, if He Himself would be dressed in sandals while He welcomed us!
 
You’re welcome. Just shared how it sounded to me since you were discussing how you and her would probably not associate because your friends are role models to look up…
My friends and I respect each other so much that we would never “walk away,” “ignore” each other, consider each other “snotty,” call each other “snotty” privately or publicly, or refuse to consider each other’s opinions (including questioning those opinions, reflecting on those, etc.). Part of sharing common values is the value of behavior toward one another. My friend is not just there to have me approve of absolutely everything he or she is doing. that’s actually not an ingredient of unconditional love, including Christian love.
 
How do you dress for a wedding? Men: suit or jacket and slacks, women: nice dress or skirt/slacks and blouse? Same for meeting the President. Hardly formal wear…
I’m a musician for at least one wedding almost every weekend. I can sometimes do up to 4 weddings a weekend depending on the time of year. These weddings are all over the place, different demographics in regards to culture, race, economic, etc. Many, if not most, are Catholic weddings. I would say over half of the weddings, the guests will come in formal wear. After that would be the suit and tie / nice dress/skirt crowd and then a very small percentage are casual.

In my experience over the years, wedding attire is not usually a good model for appropriate church attire, because most of the time the clothing for the women, especially, can be less than ideal. Over the past summer through now, it seems as if the formal/semi-formal style for the younger women are these super short (about 6 inches or more above the knee standing up), super tight, sleeveless or one strap dresses and these 3-4 inch heels. Most formal wear gowns/dresses are strapless which would be considered inappropriate by many.

I can’t say for meeting the President, as I have never met one, but I think it would depend on the occasion as to how I should dress.
 
I think while some here seem to believe they are the appointed fashion patrol
Straw Man #90.

Not said, not implied. In fact, it would seem that the quite the opposite is happening. Those who dare to choose to distinguish Mass ever so slightly from other events in their lives have been roundly name-called, marginalized, and have become the objects of reverse class warfare that has nothing in common with the Gospels. I would be careful – those of you who are claiming to own some self-appointed morally superior ground. From the PM’s and emails I have received from those lurking, reaidng this thread, it wouldn’t appear that way at all. The stereotyping is not coming from our direction, but from yours.

Like Tigg, I find the entire thread unappealing in its blatant hostility for the significance of Mass and for the guidance that the Church has offered in this matter. It’s very unattractive.
 
But some parishes and even depending upon the mass time at other parishes, casual attire is what the majority of the parishoners wear, so they are joining together as a common Body. Especially during football season at some of the parishes in my town, you stick out as sore thumb if you aren’t wearing your favorite team jersey. Its what the common body around here prefers.
I would agree with this. Although my personal choice is to dress the way as I described in my first post here, I won’t always dress like that if I attend mass at a rural parish near our family’s country property. I would definitely stick out like a sore thumb and bring much more attention to myself than what should happen at mass. Many of the families are farmers or used to be farmers. No one ever, ever wears a jacket and tie and many of the men wear jeans, once in a while dockers. The women will sometimes wear a skirt or a dress, but will also wear jeans or slacks. And the thought of wearing heels? Forget about it, unless you want your heel to get stuck in the dirt road or the grass in the field where you park. They are always washed and clean, but I know that some of them would sometimes have to come directly from their morning work on their farms (as there was only one mass early in the morning since there was only one priest for three parishes in the area). Yes, you sometimes would smell manure (usually from the fertilized fields outside), but that was how it was and is. What they wore, was truly their Sunday best. No one ever dressed immodestly. Also have to mention that some of the women wore veils for mass, so this is definitely not a “liberal” parish. I have to say they are some of the nicest, good-hearted people I know. It was a very small church, but always packed and you knew everyone.
 
Straw Man #90.

Not said, not implied. In fact, it would seem that the quite the opposite is happening. Those who dare to choose to distinguish Mass ever so slightly from other events in their lives have been roundly name-called, marginalized, and have become the objects of reverse class warfare that has nothing in common with the Gospels. I would be careful – those of you who are claiming to own some self-appointed morally superior ground. From the PM’s and emails I have received from those lurking, reaidng this thread, it wouldn’t appear that way at all. The stereotyping is not coming from our direction, but from yours.

Like Tigg, I find the entire thread unappealing in its blatant hostility for the significance of Mass and for the guidance that the Church has offered in this matter. It’s very unattractive.
Strawman #91.

As not a soul here who believes God doesn’t mind if we come to Him, for instance in jeans or a nice pair of cargo shorts like those I wear to Mass, are appointing ourselves as morally superior. We just expect to be treated and welcomed the same by all of you who choose to “dress up”.

But it’s not a problem for me. Because I wouldn’t be part of a community that does not accept me as I come. For a faith community not to do so is what I find even more unappealing.

In any case God bless us all.
 
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