Synagogue Shooting

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I thought that might be your objection. I dug into those statistics, so for anyone else curious, the 2015 death by firearm rate was 36,252 fatalities. Approximately 96% of these fatalities are accounted for by suicide and homicide. The remaining deaths are presumably firearms accidents, accounting for roughly 1,450 deaths.

Honestly I think this disproves your concern for rampant accidental firearms injuries and deaths in a nation with something like 357 Million firearms, though I don’t expect that to convince many of the relatively rare occurance of firearms accidents. That is 0.000004 accidental fatalities per firearm, or 0.0004% of the US population.

Morever, while I can hear the collective eye rolling, crimes stopped by firearms is one of those negative statistics that is hard to prove. While 310 crimes were physically stopped with the lethal use of a firearm, that does not account for crimes stopped by either the brandishing of a firearm or the suspected presence of a firearm by the criminal. I also think it demonstrates the relatively low rate of violent crime in this country, where despite what you might hear in the media the US isn’t the Wild West.

As for professional training, that depends on what you mean by professional training. Every firearm owner should know how to properly handle a firearm and have recieved some firearm safety. It doesn’t necessarily have to come from a police instructor- it can be a kid learning from his dad (as I did originally). People often have little faith in their fellow citizens I’ve noticed. There is nothing inherently more safe about learning firearm safety from a family member as from some training academy. And for the record I am well acquainted with professional firearms use, safety, maintenance, training, among multiple platforms, I will wager more so than 99% of Americans and at least as well as the vast majority of police forces. This is not some theoretical subject for me. I do not take firearm safety lightly.

I have found in my experience that most people who fear firearms, especially firearms in the hands of fellow citizens, simply aren’t very familiar with them. Unfamiliarity breeds discomfort, discomfort breeds fear. Those of us who have handled firearms regularly see firearms as simply a tool. A powerful and dangerous tool that demands responsibility, but a tool none the less. It would be highly improbable that anyone concealed carrying at church is (1) incompetent in safely handing a firearm (2) untrained (3) unaware of the danger shooting in a crowded building presents (4) has not thought hard about details like round type, weapon placement, etc (5) has not spent significant time at the range familiarizing themselves with their weapon and how to use it. Etc. Honestly I think if schools ran marksmanship programs and kids were well taught on the subject people would have less of a boogeyman problem with firearms. JMO.

Please don’t take this as a denigration of your opinion, it was not meant that way, only as a discussion of the subject of perceived firearm danger vs actual danger. Just offering another angle on the issue. 🙂
 
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It may SEEM that way, but statistically no ONE Joe or Jane Schmoe is at greater risk than a celebrity or political or religious figure of status such as the Pope or the POTUS. Thus the pizza delivery man, mentioned earlier, does not have or need a secret service to protect him, but the President does, and the Pope needs the Swiss Guards as well. Can an ordinary person be killed? Of course they can; but the odds are in their favor that they won’t.
 
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Yes, pray for those kidnapped nuns, and for the muslims in China who have ‘disappeared’. Its all religions. Religion is a threat , it gives people something to believe in besides (insert here) … ( rebels, government, domineering individuals, money, freedom, imprisonment, paganism…
 
I did not see this, on my multiple trips to the states, people were not thinking they were at greater risk to their safety then a public figure who incites division and violence just by representing what they represent.

It is sad when we believe we have to assess our individual risk and protect ourselves as we see fit, when going about our daily lives.
And that counts for every country, not just USA, but certainly the Aussies I know, and the Americans, don’t go around assessing risks to their personal safety unless they are engaging in a hazardous activity, like swimming in the sea, trying to catch a poisonous snake, skydiving, law, military, or fire services.
 
And I stand by my statement, If you have a problem with it, then its your problem.

As Jesus said to Peter, put down that sword and stop cutting off the ear of that slave.
 
love to ask you one day what you think of the Good Friday agreement and Mo Mowbray. I met her once. Very impelling personality. but thats another thread
 
Worth noting one of our newest saints was canonized recently (romero) was shot while saying Mass. By a hostile, antiCatholic government of Latin America. I sure wish that those governments received the same criticism as Americans do. But no, that dang America won’t even let anyone across the border. But crickets when discussing the horrid evil governments causing the humanitarian crisis.

You are welcome world for freedom. Please continue to ridicule us…
 
i will say that Jewish schools in Australia have always been very aware of security , but do not have armed security guards.

I haven’t done a search but don’t think there has been an religiously motivated attack on a Jewish school or synagogue here…yet. But as with global trends, the anti Jewish rhetoric is growing. again.

My fiancé, now passed on, was Jewish living in Germany. He was beaten very badly once, for being Jewish, in the 1980s. on a street in Germany.
 
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I thought that might be your objection. I dug into those statistics, so for anyone else curious, the 2015 death by firearm rate was 36,252 facilities. Approximately 96% of these fatalities are accounted for by suicide and homicide. The remaining deaths are presumably firearms accidents, accounting for roughly 1,450 deaths.
Is there any reason to ignore the suicides? It seems they are every bit as important as firearms accidents.
Morever, while I can hear the collective eye rolling, crimes stopped by firearms is one of those negative statistics that is hard to prove. While 310 crimes were physically stopped with the lethal use of a firearm…
Would this include robberies? It seems the more relevant statistic would be how many innocent lives were saved. Can you be sure 310 innocent lives were saved by the use of firearms?
, that does not account for crimes stopped by either the brandishing of a firearm or the suspected presence of a firearm by the criminal.
Those statistics are difficult to collect. So without them any assumptions about them would be pure speculation.
I will wager more so than 99% of Americans and at least as well as the vast majority of police forces. This is not some theoretical subject for me. I do not take firearm safety lightly.
Good intentions alone do not make up for lack of professional training. I will take your bet.
 
And that counts for every country, not just USA, but certainly the Aussies I know, and the Americans, don’t go around assessing risks to their personal safety unless they are engaging in a hazardous activity, like swimming in the sea, trying to catch a poisonous snake, skydiving, law, military, or fire services.
Living in a neighborhood where there isn’t much work but there is a drug dealer down the block and lots of traffic from out of the area…??? People tend to think of personal safety and safety of their property…
 
they do from me, I don’t have favourites, I am even critical of my own government, the complete shite it has been , culminating in the SSM referendum and now the flow on from that, is just the beginning of the erosion of this country.

we fought with you, you are welcome , we fought for you, we led you all into whatever middle eastern hell hole of a country it was when the ‘war on terror’ started up, you are welcome.

its time to stop that rhetoric, its got nothing to do with what we are discussing and is a straw man.

You are free to ridicule me and my country, you have my permission. However, do not assume I am ridiculing you or your country.
 
And I sure hope our people are not ready to turn it over to socialism… even democratic socialism…😦
 
I live about two doors down from several drug dealers, I am in one of those neighbourhoods. I still don’t feel the need for a gun.

The police will be onto it. I have complete trust in Jesus.

Now if I were on the farm, and it was summer, and there were snakes, I would LOVE a gun.
If I was in Sydney and there were funnel web spiders, I would prefer a flame thrower
 
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Yeah, I mean really, instead of a gun debate we really should be focused on the antisemitism that seems to be growing worldwide. It’s time to truly end that. I love the Jewish people so much. My heart breaks when this happens.

On a lighter note, my wife will be traveling to Australia for business soon! I’m so excited for her!
 
thankyou, he passed away from an aggressive brain tumour, it was a few decades ago now. If he had lived, I would be in Germany now and who knows how different life would have been.

God has a plan for us all. Its a good week to pray for his soul.
 
I have spent quite a bit of time in your country, work and pleasure. Its a wonderful country with beautiful people.

Will your wife be flying through NZ
 
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