Transgender teen who died of an apparent suicide: ‘Fix society. Please.’

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I do not think that the “supportive” friends were *trying *to make the situation worse. But then *neither were the parents. *

So what happened was that the God-given authority of the parents, the people who knew the teen the best, the people who loved the teen the best, was *usurped *by the society that pushes only one line on how to deal with any manifestation of GID, the teenage friends who were supportive of the teen (altho as mentioned in the suicide note, only friends because of proximity), the “supportive” next-door parents.

And now even we Catholics, who ought to know more about vice and about the virtues of honoring parents and subsequently authority, are joining in to judge and condemn the parents of this teen.

Would you proseletyze someone else’s children? Or would you recognize the duty and subsequent right of the parents to raise their own children without interference? How would you as a Catholic parent feel if some atheist started pushing another theology on your children while they were still under your authority and care?
Yes, the parents have responsibility, but they handled it very poorly. No, I do not have any right to force the parents to do anything differently. But I have every right to state my belief that they handled this situation poorly. I have no idea what it would be like to be a transgender teenager. However, for someone like that, their home should have been a safe haven. Obviously it wasn’t.
 
Yes, the parents have responsibility, but they handled it very poorly. No, I do not have any right to force the parents to do anything differently. But I have every right to state my belief that they handled this situation poorly. I have no idea what it would be like to be a transgender teenager. However, for someone like that, their home should have been a safe haven. Obviously it wasn’t.
I have been a teenager, and I know that there are times when a home is not a safe haven simply because it is not what the teen wants or doesn’t give what the teen wants. When one girl’s parents tell her that if she’s going to have sex, have it at home instead of in the woods or a sleazy hotel, that is not actually making the home a safe haven, even tho the girl’s friends may all think so and rail against their parents for not making their homes safe havens too.

We can see in the teen’s note that the refusal of the parents to ok *and pay for *the beginnings of the sex change caused an attitude of despair and anger. The note says that life would be terrible, awful, never ever right because the desire was not fulfilled right then and there by the parents in the way desired.
 
.Women nowadays are not called sluts but are "embracing their sexuality"Society and laws encourage them to do so but only with adequate protection from disease and pregnancy That is the societal view whereas the view of the Catholic Church is that sexual activity outside of marriage is sinful.

The Catholic view is also that God made us male and female and that is generally evident at birth
No, women still get slut shamed and the truth is that the term is mostly a classist.

Responsible psychology and psychiatric practitioners are frustrated in their attempts to study and share research in these areas by a political movement whose ascendancy in western culture has legalized sexual disorders as normal behavior, frustrating and penalizing disagreement with the assertions of those with urges to use sexuality to try to satisfy needs of safety, belonging, acceptance, and integration into society of their behaviors and lifestyles.

Despite society’s growing tolerance of these sexual behaviors, the underlying anguish and pain seem to remain.
The political insistence of the ‘right of the individual to self-determination,’ to remove all language that might frustrate the anguished person’s attempt to determine identity, sexual practice, or societal acceptance, continues the pain in the individual.
The suicide claim has been a political tactic of those with sexual urges outside of man and woman marriage for many years now.
They may not be related but they are certainly lumped together under the general label of GLBT.
Transgender people get lumped under there, but usually the LGB community doesn’t care in the slightest. The LGB community talks about sexuality motivated hate crimes, but transgender women of color get no mention despite them being the majority of LGBT people murdered and despite them being a much smaller number than LGB people.
Actually, to a certain extent yes, I am.

This “poor child” of 17 just devastated several if not many lives, including that of the complete stranger the teen forced to take a human life by stepping in front of the truck.

The notes timed to appear after death show a totally self-centered attitude towards the situation, condemning the parents with a literal “F you.”

OK, the person had GID–what, GID makes a person unable to be a selfish jerk? No. The teen had GID, but that does not lift the obligation to be considerate of others.

The suicide note itself explained that the act s chosen to cause changes in society as well as to let the world know what rotten crummy parents he had. This is extortion–it is worse than extortion because threatening to take one’s own life if someone else does not do what one wants is forcing them to choose which way to violate their conscience. It is showing one has less care for one’s own life than one hopes the other to have.

Yes, according to what I know, yes, I am against the teen’s decision to commit suicide in a way to cause maximal pain and devastaion to others and to hope that it be used to further one narrow personal belief.
It was terrible that she choose suicide and even more so that she did it in such a way that someone killed her.

The notes were basically a modern suicide note.

She was in a lot of pain as a result of her parents’ ignorant actions and it compromised her ability to reason. Or perhaps reasoned to take a permanent solution to a permanent problem.

The act was primarily to end her pain, she wrote her suicide note so perhaps it would not be in vain.
 
Actually it appears of those around him, including the parents of some of his so-called friends, were making the situation worse. Now ,in his parents time of grief,they want to kick them some more and use their son’s tragic death push their agenda . Shame shame shame on them
If parents loved their lesbian daughter and tried to use corrective rape to excise her demons would you be upset when people blamed the parents? That might sound ridiculous, but it has happened before.
Is the fix that people are advocating this:

“Give money to your son/daughter to do surgery on his/her penis/vagina, or else when s/he kills himself the blood is on your hands, and we will be all over the internet denigrating you as monsters?”

Never let a suicide go to waste. It is almost like a page from the playbook of Obama and his Chicago machine.
No, no that is not what is being argued; what is being argued is that they should have referred to their child with female pronouns,
What I am struck by is no matter how sad this case is, at 17 years old, that is way to young for someone to commit suicide yet, many teens do or contemplate it.

So, yes, the teen may have been part of a group that has a higher suicide rate, say higher than young males or females but that group can be broken down further. Those bullied as we have seen happen to a number of young women, they are not just in a group of females but “females who were bullied”, likewise, one can say “teen age males who were jilted” rather than the general category of “teenage males”.
Transgender teens rejected by parents have an attempted suicide rate of over 50%, note, this only counts people who failed to commit suicide so the real rate is even higher.
I’ve spent years listening to the liberal left “gender equality lobby” complaining about heterosexist, CIS gender, role-conditioning in advertising, fashion and kids toys etc.

They have been telling us for decades that tabula rasa children CAN be psychologically conditioned/confused to prefer x, or y or z based on how they are nurtured.

The modern day LGBTQ lobby clearly agrees with them (despite their protestations that everyone’s sexual preferences and identity are fixed from birth/conception.)
TERFs don’t understand the world, children are not blank slates, if they were then the David Reimer case would not have turned out so horribly
 
If parents loved their lesbian daughter and tried to use corrective rape to excise her demons would you be upset when people blamed the parents? That might sound ridiculous, but it has happened before.
You do not view your above as a comparison in the extreme? I personally believe the parents completely isolating their child from social contact was misguided and incorrect, but it hardly compares to what you describe above.
 
Yeah, it’s really mean for parents to try to help their children, to take them away from what they see as bad influences, to send them to counselors to help them, and, oh, heaven forbid! to deny them something which costs 10s of thousands of dollars for something science has noticed in some people to be a phase.

I keep hearing stories of teens with GID being kicked out of their home by their parents when they reveal their desire to be the opposite sex. Wow, and not all of these teens kill themselves by forcing a stranger to kill them!
Have you ever read the short story “The Yellow Wallpaper”? I highly recommend it. The upshot is that when someone experiences depression, the worst thing one can do is remove that person from human contact and outside stimuli. I am most definitely not blaming these parents – I can’t even imagine the horror of this experience, which I’m sure will remain with them. But I would never encourage anyone who has a depressed, struggling child to isolate that child.
 
Actually, to a certain extent yes, I am.

This “poor child” of 17 just devastated several if not many lives, including that of the complete stranger the teen forced to take a human life by stepping in front of the truck.

The notes timed to appear after death show a totally self-centered attitude towards the situation, condemning the parents with a literal “F you.”

OK, the person had GID–what, GID makes a person unable to be a selfish jerk? No. The teen had GID, but that does not lift the obligation to be considerate of others.

The suicide note itself explained that the act s chosen to cause changes in society as well as to let the world know what rotten crummy parents he had. This is extortion–it is worse than extortion because threatening to take one’s own life if someone else does not do what one wants is forcing them to choose which way to violate their conscience. It is showing one has less care for one’s own life than one hopes the other to have.

Yes, according to what I know, yes, I am against the teen’s decision to commit suicide in a way to cause maximal pain and devastaion to others and to hope that it be used to further one narrow personal belief.
Yes, well, thankfully God and His Church respond to suicide victims with a less embittered and more compassionate view. At times like these, I feel truly blessed to give all power to judge over to Him.
 
You do not view your above as a comparison in the extreme? I personally believe the parents completely isolating their child from social contact was misguided and incorrect, but it hardly compares to what you describe above.
It doesn’t even deserve a reply.
 
Have you ever read the short story “The Yellow Wallpaper”? I highly recommend it. The upshot is that when someone experiences depression, the worst thing one can do is remove that person from human contact and outside stimuli. I am most definitely not blaming these parents – I can’t even imagine the horror of this experience, which I’m sure will remain with them. But I would never encourage anyone who has a depressed, struggling child to isolate that child.
Well, aside from being *fiction, * the story you mention is about a woman who was suffering from some “nervous disorder” who was locked in a room alone in a country house that was not her own home.

The teen in in question does not seem to have been locked in a room with no human company but to have been with family, seeing, counselors, etc. The prohibition seems to have been against those those things which the parents considered to be a bad influence, much as many parents attempt to keep their drug-using children away from their drug-using friends.
 
Even though “isolating” a person seems wrong, I think we need a clarification of facts on this matter.

Being “grounded” has always been something parents have done to their children.

Likewise, I am sure there have been many a parent who have denied a child seeing their friends if they think alcohol or drug use might be at stake, I can imagine a parent smelling potsmoke on a youth and telling them not to leave the house.
 
Even though “isolating” a person seems wrong, I think we need a clarification of facts on this matter.

Being “grounded” has always been something parents have done to their children.

Likewise, I am sure there have been many a parent who have denied a child seeing their friends if they think alcohol or drug use might be at stake, I can imagine a parent smelling potsmoke on a youth and telling them not to leave the house.
I think the lack of in-depth information and personal views has us looking at two versions of this-

-a- locked away from everyone, i.e. solitary confinement 24/7- which everyone seems to be in agreement on is incorrect, unhelpful, and most likely immoral

-b- removed from those individuals and situations the parents felt were having a harmful or negative impact on their child- which everyone seems to be in agreement on in principle is what parents are supposed to do, but in disagreement on what classifies as harmful or negative and/or how effective or ineffective it was in this case
 
You do not view your above as a comparison in the extreme? I personally believe the parents completely isolating their child from social contact was misguided and incorrect, but it hardly compares to what you describe above.
It is a comparison in the extreme, but some people here seem to believe that things that are extremely harmful are okay because the parents loved their child and gender dysphoria is evil. Social isolation of a severely depressed person functions as an echo chamber of their negative thoughts and dramatically increases the chance of suicide. The so called Christian counselors were worse than ineffective, all they accomplish was tearing apart her hopes and reducing her will to live.
Have you ever read the short story “The Yellow Wallpaper”? I highly recommend it. The upshot is that when someone experiences depression, the worst thing one can do is remove that person from human contact and outside stimuli. I am most definitely not blaming these parents – I can’t even imagine the horror of this experience, which I’m sure will remain with them. But I would never encourage anyone who has a depressed, struggling child to isolate that child.
I know from personal experience that social isolation is one of the worst things that can happen, in this case the social isolation was of my doing and I nearly died as a result.
 
Well, aside from being *fiction, * the story you mention is about a woman who was suffering from some “nervous disorder” who was locked in a room alone in a country house that was not her own home.

The teen in in question does not seem to have been locked in a room with no human company but to have been with family, seeing, counselors, etc. The prohibition seems to have been against those those things which the parents considered to be a bad influence, much as many parents attempt to keep their drug-using children away from their drug-using friends.
So fiction doesn’t have anything to say about actual life? Interesting. As a lit prof, I’ll politely disagree with that assumption. But in any case, the woman in question suffers from postpartum depression and is being isolated by her physician husband. She is being kept away from others but she is still receiving medical and (to some limited extent, given the time period) psychological treatment. She, too, was with family and seeing a physician. (Actually reading the story could have revealed all of these things easily.) But isolation does strange things to people who are already depressed. If in fact this suicide victim was being removed from friends and social media, was being kept at home rather than being allowed to engage with peers, etc., I would simply note that while her parents’ desire to remove negative influences may be understandable, it’s quite possible they removed too much from her circle and *unintentionally *made the situation worse.

I don’t understand your anger at this child (and yes, she was a child). This is a tragedy for everyone involved. I feel nothing but tremendous sadness for her parents and for her, as she didn’t realize that life could have gotten substantially better and she could have grown to enjoy a happy life. Hardening one’s heart to the pain she experienced or to the suffering her parents are experiencing seems to be the antithesis of what Christ would demand of us.
 
I know from personal experience that social isolation is one of the worst things that can happen, in this case the social isolation was of my doing and I nearly died as a result.
I definitely understand – I also isolate when depressed, though I’ve come to recognize (as has my dear husband) that this is the worst thing possible. Thankfully, I now have folks who push me to engage outside myself when I am low. I’m thankful, too, that you’re still here. 🙂
 
It is a comparison in the extreme, but some people here seem to believe that things that are extremely harmful are okay because the parents loved their child and gender dysphoria is evil. Social isolation of a severely depressed person functions as an echo chamber of their negative thoughts and dramatically increases the chance of suicide. The so called Christian counselors were worse than ineffective, all they accomplish was tearing apart her hopes and reducing her will to live.

I know from personal experience that social isolation is one of the worst things that can happen, in this case the social isolation was of my doing and I nearly died as a result.
-If it is a comparison in the extreme, then you know that it isn’t actually effective in creating any sort of communication or in explaining why the other party’s position is incorrect
-I know exactly how social isolation impacts suicidal/depressed individuals. What has not been established is if it was a solitary confinement 24/7 type isolation or a remove the harmful/negative influencers isolation (which is what does actually need to take place in treating a suicidal/depressed individual).
-All we know about the Christian counselors is what the child reported, and once again speaking from personal experience, a suicidal/depressed person isn’t the most accurate source of information in regards to what people are telling them. At one point I was convinced one of my counselors was involved in a plot to discredit me in order to profit some sort of Army wide conspiracy against me. On hindsight, he (my counselor) meant well but was just horrible at his job.
 
Yes, well, thankfully God and His Church respond to suicide victims with a less embittered and more compassionate view. At times like these, I feel truly blessed to give all power to judge over to Him.
I’m not responding to suicide in general in this way, each case is different, no?

What I am responding to is a lack of comapssion and respect for the parents in this situation. I do not feel well enough to go back through the 20-odd pages of this thread to pick out all the examples of the lack of compassion for the parents. Instead, their actions have been condemned and re-cast to justify this condemnation.

And this condemnation is based on the fact, not of what the teen did, but of the political coolness of the disorder involved.
 
So fiction doesn’t have anything to say about actual life? Interesting. As a lit prof, I’ll politely disagree with that assumption. But in any case, the woman in question suffers from postpartum depression and is being isolated by her physician husband. She is being kept away from others but she is still receiving medical and (to some limited extent, given the time period) psychological treatment. She, too, was with family and seeing a physician. (Actually reading the story could have revealed all of these things easily.) But isolation does strange things to people who are already depressed. If in fact this suicide victim was being removed from friends and social media, was being kept at home rather than being allowed to engage with peers, etc., I would simply note that while her parents’ desire to remove negative influences may be understandable, it’s quite possible they removed too much from her circle and *unintentionally *made the situation worse.

I don’t understand your anger at this child (and yes, she was a child). This is a tragedy for everyone involved. I feel nothing but tremendous sadness for her parents and for her, as she didn’t realize that life could have gotten substantially better and she could have grown to enjoy a happy life. Hardening one’s heart to the pain she experienced or to the suffering her parents are experiencing seems to be the antithesis of what Christ would demand of us.
Fiction is useful, but it can also be misleading since the “truth” behind any situation is what the author wants it to be. It would be far more helpful, and should be easy enough to do, to cite actual scholarly articles on the impact of social isolation on depressed/suicidal individuals.
 
One can web search the topic “Lou Reed” and “shock treatment”, he grew up in the 1950s and maybe the 1940s some and actually received shock treatment for his bisexual desires. I guess this is what use to happen. Things are quite different nowadays but I don’t think the pendulum should swing wide towards acceptance either until honest appraisals of these conditions can be made.
 
One can web search the topic “Lou Reed” and “shock treatment”, he grew up in the 1950s and maybe the 1940s some and actually received shock treatment for his bisexual desires. I guess this is what use to happen. Things are quite different nowadays but I don’t think the pendulum should swing wide towards acceptance either until honest appraisals of these conditions can be made.
So how do you think that non-acceptance should still be practiced? Should homosexual activity still be criminalized?
 
So fiction doesn’t have anything to say about actual life? Interesting. As a lit prof, I’ll politely disagree with that assumption.
Well, I have my doubts about lit in general (why is so much that is considered “good literature” so depressing, while more upliftng work is not considered literature?)

Not having a copy at home and not wanting to violate copyright, I am able only to see what others have described the story to be. {ETA: Since I had never heard of this story, I thought it was recent, but actually it is old enough to be out of copyright.}

However, yes, literature often describes aspects of the human condition. However, it is less than anecdotal. The story could easily have been about a woman suffering from PPD and being bought out if her depression by the challenge of being locked up in a room in a strange house, etc. Or the story could have been about a woman suffering from PPD who, upon being locked in a room, recalled the Rosary her grandmother taught her and started praying and thus leaves the room re-united to God. Or it ciuld have been sci-fi or fantasy and any number of things might have happened.
But in any case, the woman in question suffers from postpartum depression and is being isolated by her physician husband. She is being kept away from others but she is still receiving medical and (to some limited extent, given the time period) psychological treatment. She, too, was with family and seeing a physician. (Actually reading the story could have revealed all of these things easily.) But isolation does strange things to people who are already depressed. If in fact this suicide victim was being removed from friends and social media, was being kept at home rather than being allowed to engage with peers, etc., I would simply note that while her parents’ desire to remove negative influences may be understandable,** it’s quite possible **they removed too much from her circle and *unintentionally *made the situation worse.
It’s also quite possible that had the school and the friends supported the parents and helped the teen to deal with that situation in a healthy way that the parents wouldn’t have needed to cut certain social features out of the teen’s life. For example, one can say, look you’rs suffering from GID, your parents are worried about you–they love you and want what is best for you. It’s true that you are not getting what you want at this point, but you are 17 and in one year, you will be anle to do as you please. And that’s a whole different from what so many teens actually say these days, and apparently, looking at this thread, all too many adults.
I don’t understand your anger at this child (and yes, she was a child).
17 is old enough to know better than that. But what really bothers me is not that these teen committed these acts, but that on this, a Catholic forum, the parents have been treated so badly, with such judgement and condemnation and so little lack of even trying to look at the situation from their point of view.
This is a tragedy for everyone involved. I feel nothing but tremendous sadness for her parents and for her, as she didn’t realize that life could have gotten substantially better and she could have grown to enjoy a happy life. Hardening one’s heart to the pain she experienced or to the suffering her parents are experiencing seems to be the antithesis of what Christ would demand of us.
The teen certainly had a hard heart to commit suicide in that way, leaving that note. That was not, I feel so sad… I’m going to kill myself; that was literally F— you to the parents for not going along with the sex change process and a completel lack of compassion for anyone else, like the poor truck driver.
 
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