Transgender teen who died of an apparent suicide: ‘Fix society. Please.’

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Was the person born with XX or XY chromosomes? There is your answer. End of story.
And before anyone tries bringing up the whole “messed up chromosomes” thing, the case numbers for that are so small that using them to justify sex-changes is as fallacious as using an anecdote of a man stealing food to feed his starving family to say “all theft should be legal just in case of more scenarios like this.”
Being transgender is not an abomination, it is a biological defect, is not the person’s fault and is not a choice.
Indulging it however, is a choice. A choice that, while morally ambiguous at this current time according to the church, is all about damaging the body to please the mind.

On a side note, all surgery damages the body, but good surgery damages the body to heal the body. A sex change, however, damages the body but doesn’t fix something broken in the process. It actually destroys something healthy.
 
We can’t change our faith if that’s what your quietly implying too. Most of these kids have to find the right person to talk with so let us pray that they can find a good Christian person to share their fears and find Christ.
 
And before anyone tries bringing up the whole “messed up chromosomes” thing, the case numbers for that are so small that using them to justify sex-changes is as fallacious as using an anecdote of a man stealing food to feed his starving family to say “all theft should be legal just in case of more scenarios like this.”

Indulging it however, is a choice. A choice that, while morally ambiguous at this current time according to the church, is all about damaging the body to please the mind.

On a side note, all surgery damages the body, but good surgery damages the body to heal the body. A sex change, however, damages the body but doesn’t fix something broken in the process. It actually destroys something healthy.
HRT does not damage the body and helps substantially, keep in mind few transgender people actually get SRS.
Who says it is a biological defect? Has science identified a “transgender gene”?
I said biological, not genetic. It has been shown that for transwomen the brain is substantially undermasculinized and in transmen the brain has been substantially over masculinized.
 
HRT does not damage the body and helps substantially, keep in mind few transgender people actually get SRS.
Oh so it’s okay as long as it’s consensual hormone poisoning. I get it. And here I thought pumping a woman full of testosterone, the hormone that must be kept at very small levels in women, until she grew a beard was a bad thing.
 
Oh so it’s okay as long as it’s consensual hormone poisoning. I get it. And here I thought pumping a woman full of testosterone, the hormone that must be kept at very small levels in women, until she grew a beard was a bad thing.
It isn’t poisoning.

For transmen getting facial hair is an acceptable side effect.
 
I wonder if it is a good idea for a society to be manipulated into change through suicide?

Has suicide now become a good argument for changing one\s point of view of what is correct and incorrect, right and wrong?
 
It isn’t poisoning.

For transmen getting facial hair is an acceptable side effect.
So it’s not poisoning just because they are okay with it?
Because if you forced me against my will to get pumped full of estrogen in the same manner as HRT, I’d say I was suffering from Estrogen Poisoning.
 
The ideology the Holy Father addressed and criticized in the speech referenced above, gender deconstructionist theory, has nothing whatsoever to do with the medical diagnosis and treatment of gender dysphoria (formerly called transsexualism), and the fact that Cardinal Antonelli makes the jump from pp. Benedict’s speech to transsexualism, only proves that Cardinal Antonelli has no clue about what the diagnosis entails.

The medical diagnosis of gender dysphoria, and the treatment thereof, is not based on gender deconstructionist theory. On the contrary, a transgender individual does not think that they can (or want to) change their gender. Most report having been that way from birth. The Pope effectively (and rightly!) criticized gender deconstructionism in his speech. But he did not criticize the medical phenomenon of gender dysphoria, nor the treatment thereof. If he intended to, he still did not do it - it is simply not contained in the text. Only someone ignorant on the subject will see the speech as an condemnation of transgenderism.

Seriously, American Conservatives only have two things to cling to in this debate - the sub secretum pastoral (not doctrinal) document, which states that sex reassignment does not change your gender, and Pope Benedict’s speech. As for the former, well, d’oh. No one claims that sex reassignment changes your gender. When a patient undergoes male-to-female sex reassignment, it is because she is, always was, and always will be female. The same obviously goes for female-to-male. As for the latter, the speech simply does not apply to transgenderism, since the ideology described does not fit with the opinion of most transgender individuals. To clarify, most transgender individuals would agree wholeheartedly with Pope Benedict’s speech.

So I can only conclude that the basis for the American Conservative stance in this specific case is nil. They are grasping for straws, and cannot even prove that the Church agrees with them. Which is good, since the Church would in that case violate what Vatican I has to say about the limitations of papal infallibility (the Pope can never pronounce on matters scientific, and gender is determined through science, not faith), much like She did during the heliocentrism feud.
This post is very informative. Biologists, psychologists, and religious leaders have a lot to learn about transgenderism and sexuality in general. Rabbis in the Orthodox Jewish community are just beginning to grapple with the issue.
 
An interesting field of study might be how much transgenders exhibit features of borderline personality disorder, such as manipulating behavior through threat of suicides, which in turn actually end up being actual suicides.
 
An interesting field of study might be how much transgenders exhibit features of borderline personality disorder, such as manipulating behavior through threat of suicides, which in turn actually end up being actual suicides.
I can assure you, I have been in therapy for a decade now, and not one single therapist has ever as much as suspected borderline personality disorder :rolleyes: .

By your standard, one could just as well cherry pick other traits of borderline personality disorder, such as black-and-white thinking, to slander conservatives similarly.

Lastly, you should know that I have never once threatened suicide. Nor do I know one, single trans person who has. However, I have attempted suicide. With no warning, no threats, no one even knew until after since I survived by pure chance. If a therapist asks me, I will say that I have been suicidal, but never once have I used it as a threat.

So no, “transgenders” do not “exhibit features of borderline personality disorder”. Believe me, if this were true, it would have been in diagnostic manuals and medical schoolbooks decades ago.
 
I can assure you, I have been in therapy for a decade now, and not one single therapist has ever as much as suspected borderline personality disorder :rolleyes: .

By your standard, one could just as well cherry pick other traits of borderline personality disorder, such as black-and-white thinking, to slander conservatives similarly.

Lastly, you should know that I have never once threatened suicide. Nor do I know one, single trans person who has. However, I have attempted suicide. With no warning, no threats, no one even knew until after since I survived by pure chance. If a therapist asks me, I will say that I have been suicidal, but never once have I used it as a threat.

So no, “transgenders” do not “exhibit features of borderline personality disorder”. Believe me, if this were true, it would have been in diagnostic manuals and medical schoolbooks decades ago.
It would only be cherry picking if person after person had not come on the thread worrying about what effect this thread on suicide might have on transgenders stumbling upon it and reading it; life or death concerns even that have lead to repeated calls to shut the discussion down even.

The behavior in question is manipulation through suicide, which is a common enough tendency among borderlines, and pyschopaths too for that matter.

By the worries expressed about transgenders reading things here, it seems to be a tendency among transgenders too.

Since so little is known, according to the pyschologist who post here, this seems like a potentially fruitful line of research to follow.

But I don’t want to delve into matters that are better left off as private matters between a poster and his or her psychiatrist.
 
This is your opinion, the medical community thinks differently. To me what the medical community thinks is more important. At the end of the day your stance does not alleviate suffering.
The medical community disagreed with their own current unsubstantiated position years ago. It’s so… PC to believe in nonsense today. Officially, women do not suffer major psychological consequences from elective abortions either. It matters not how many thousands of abortion victims say otherwise. :cool:
 
And before anyone tries bringing up the whole “messed up chromosomes” thing, the case numbers for that are so small that using them to justify sex-changes is as fallacious as using an anecdote of a man stealing food to feed his starving family to say “all theft should be legal just in case of more scenarios like this.”

Indulging it however, is a choice. A choice that, while morally ambiguous at this current time according to the church, is all about damaging the body to please the mind.

On a side note, all surgery damages the body, but good surgery damages the body to heal the body. A sex change, however, damages the body but doesn’t fix something broken in the process. It actually destroys something healthy.
👍
 
It would only be cherry picking if person after person had not come on the thread worrying about what effect this thread on suicide might have on transgenders stumbling upon it and reading it; life or death concerns even that have lead to repeated calls to shut the discussion down even.

The behavior in question is manipulation through suicide, which is a common enough tendency among borderlines, and pyschopaths too for that matter.

By the worries expressed about transgenders reading things here, it seems to be a tendency among transgenders too.

Since so little is known, according to the pyschologist who post here, this seems like a potentially fruitful line of research to follow.

But I don’t want to delve into matters that are better left off as private matters between a poster and his or her psychiatrist.
Warning that a group is prone to suicide does not constitute threat of suicide. This is not manipulation, it is being in touch with reality. If I found myself personally in danger of suicide by reading this thread, I would get as far as way as possible and never come back. However, at certain points earlier in life, I am not sure I would have handled it the same way. But then I also kept away from online forums.

That a group is prone to suicide, does not mean they share traits with borderline personality disorder. It simply means their lives are extraordinarily difficult. As I said, I could just as well say that “conservatives have things in common with borderline personality disorder, since they often exhibit black-and-white thinking.” But this would be wrong, since black-and-white thinking alone is not indicative of borderline personality disorder. It would also ignore that liberals think just as black-and-white at times.

That little is known, does not mean that little is known in regard to the mental parts of it. We know very well how transsexualism presents psychologically; what we know less about is how it is caused. That said, we do know that the brains of transgender individuals have significant differences from the normal population, in that the gender dimorphic parts are more resembling of the opposite chromosomal sex. We do know that differentiation of the brain happens independently from the reproductive system. There are still many answers to be found, but that the condition is neurological in nature is no longer in question. Whether these neurological differences merely dispose the person to develop gender dysphoria, or whether they will always cause it, is one thing that is not known. But nevertheless, it is not true that we do not know enough to conclude that it is a real condition with physiological causes.

I agree it is best to leave this aside - you’ve hit a blind road here. Psychiatrists have noted since the very beginning of diagnosis of this condition, that there is no present personality disorder or delusion. Actually, personality disorders may be contraindicative of treatment (unless one can justify that it is secondary and not primary), and delusions are always contraindicative.
 
People who threaten suicide invariably do not know how manipulative they are being.
Very definitely, the subject of this thread was using his or her suicide as an emotional blackmail to change society.

but again, I don’t want to delve into the personal psychological state of any individual poster, or deal with arguments based on the psychological state of anyone posting here.
 
People who threaten suicide invariably do not know how manipulative they are being.
Very definitely, the subject of this thread was using his or her suicide as an emotional blackmail to change society.

but again, I don’t want to delve into the personal psychological state of any individual poster, or deal with arguments based on the psychological state of anyone posting here.
But you’re more than happy to delve into the personal psychological state of the subject of this thread and base your non-professional argument on what you believe their motivations were. How nice of you to limit yourself to speaking ill of just the dead.
 
That a group is prone to suicide, does not mean they share traits with borderline personality disorder.
Well that’s good news for white males since the most common factor of suicides is that the person was male and of a European ethnic group.
 
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