Voting Democrat a mortal sin?

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🤔 Slippery slope and not much leeway, unfortunately. Personally, I don’t like how I voted. I’m saddened that I might have helped the pro choice agenda. Even though I simply was against Trump for a lot of his own agenda. As for my party affiliation; I’m registered non partisan. Though I generally like Republicans more than the Dems.
 
That’s fine. You’ve thought it out and this will help you with your choices going forward. My point in posting here wasn’t to persuade you to vote for one party or another, only to show that voting for a Democrat is not necessarily a mortal sin, as some people might have you believe. There are over thirty pages in the bishop’s Forming Consciences for Faithful Citizenship document, much to consider, and all pointing to a consistent ethic of life.
 
Michael16 said:
Slippery slope and not much leeway, unfortunately. Personally, I don’t like how I voted. I’m saddened that I might have helped the pro choice agenda. Even though I simply was against Trump for a lot of his own agenda. As for my party affiliation; I’m registered non partisan. Though I generally like Republicans more than the Dems.
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I don’t think it’s really so black and white though, and more than just supporting or not supporting abortion needs to be taken into consideration. The pro-choice agenda has already been won, and unfortunately is the law of the land. In general, republicans are against abortion in principle and against the legality of it. Which is great, but the Supreme Court made its decision, and while it’s possible to over turn Roe V. Wade, how realistic is it?.. I don’t know the answer to that. Very strong arguments can be made that even though Democrats support the legality of abortion, many other issues they support, such as certain government assistance programs and healthcare would do more to fight the actual reasons most abortions occur, and lower the abortion rate that way. So, voting along lines such as that, is not a “pro-choice” vote, and could justifiably be a proportionate reason to vote for a Democrat. The USCCB outlines where we should stand on issues, but it leaves open the possibility of voting for any party based on one’s own judgement. I’m not going to encourage voting in either direction, because that’s for your own moral judgement. I just want to highlight that INTENT MATTERS, there are justifiable reasons to vote for either side from a pro-life perspective.
 
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Canvas said:
Nowhere does the Cardinal Ratzinger spell out what “proportionate reasons” are. This means that the Church leaves it to the individual’s own prudential judgment. This statement nowhere says “vote Trump and the GOP or the baby gets it!”
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Actually, he does give examples of what are NOT proportionate reasons; war and the death penalty. “Proportionate” is easy to understand. When one is talking about an “intrinsic evil” (evil in every case) there’s no “prudential judgment” to it. As to all other current political issues, one may exercise prudential judgment. Proportionate reasons such as killing all Jews or all people over age 55 are obvious, but they’re not part of the current political agenda of any party.

Catholicism will never convert this country from paganism until we refuse to accept the lies we’re fed.

Nowhere does Pope Benedict promote a particular political candidate. They never do.
 
Amen…

That’s why we need rank choice voting …look it up if you haven’t heard of it. That voting system seeks to legitimize 3rd parties and bust up the two party system we are beholden to.

More choice more voice!!
 
Which is what I hoped for when he got elected.
I knew this presidency would be a media circus (although I never dreamed it would be to this level), but on the day he got elected, I hoped he’d be appointing judges.
 
Democratic voters don’t own every abortion that happens, and
GOP voters don’t own the death of every child in border patrol custody.
 
I believe its based on the candidate not the party. If the candidate is pro-abortion, then that is a sin to vote for them, unless:

(1) they would not enact a pro life agenda. A good example of this is Rudy Giuliani in 2008 GOP Primary. He is pro-choice but said he would appoint pro life judges. I think that is one exception where Church says its ok to vote for a pro abortion candidate.
(2) Another exception is where you vote fro the pro abortion candidate only if the other candidate would somehow cause more evil/death, an example of this would be if the alternative of the pro abortion candidate threatened to nuke 3,000,000 innocent people and it was nearly certain that this would happen. Then you’d be morally obligated to vote for the pro abortion candidate since although voting for them kills 1,000,000 babies, its less than the 3,000,000 killed via the other candidate. But this exception is so hypothetical its almost not worth discussing.
 
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I’m a lifelong democrat. The only republican I ever voted for is Trump, but I voted for a republican for governor once. I never liked the democrats view on abortion/gay marriage but I agreed with them on a lot of other things. I hope it’s not a mortal sin to vote democrat.
 
I think after the last horror with Governor Cuomo, it is pretty clear what the democratic platform is about. Knowing this and still voting democrat could, yes, put ones soul in danger.

I am not saying that the OP is in a state of mortal sin, because that depends on intent and knowledge, which is between the OP and God.

This is something that would best be discussed with a priest and possibly in the sacrament of penance.

I have a theory regarding sin, when in doubt take it to God in the confessional.

God bless.
 
Yeah, I could not vote for him in good conscience. Democrat or not. No way.
 
Agree, though, what about all those other democrats in the room at the time he signed the bill, who were cheering and rejoicing.

That was so sad. :cry:
 
Oh I agree it’s disturbing, no doubt. I’m so upset about what happened to the democratic party. It used to be different. Democrats used to care about the sick, the weak and the helpless.
 
Michael16 said:
It just hit me. I voted Democrat last Congressional elections. My vote wasn’t pro choice; it was an vote against Trump. What just hit me is that voting Democrat May be a mortal sin because the Dems are notoriously pro abort. Even though my vote was an anti Trump vote; could my vote be a mortal sin?
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John put it clearly.

If any one sees his brother committing what is not a mortal sin, he will ask, and God[a] will give him life for those whose sin is not mortal. There is sin which is mortal; I do not say that one is to pray for that. 17 All wrongdoing is sin, but there is sin which is not mortal. [1 Jn 5:16-17]

There was a pro life party running, (Republicans} vs a pro abort party {Dems}.
You knew the Dems are notoriously pro abort, and you voted for Dems anyway. Using John’s instruction, I would advise go to confession. Don 't try and lay the blame elsewhere
 
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OKComputer said:
I’m so upset about what happened to the democratic party. It used to be different. Democrats used to care about the sick, the weak and the helpless.
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I agree.

I come from a long line of Irish Catholic democrats but things are just not the same in the democratic party anymore. I’m not saying the republicans are great because they are not but they are not supporting the same evils as the democratic party. Most of my Catholic family has left the democratic party over the recent years just because of what has happened.
 
Canvas said:
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Ridgerunner:
As we know, Pope Benedict said one cannot vote for one who supports abortion unless for a proportionally grave reason.
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That is not what then Cardinal Ratzinger said in his letter, which was a footnote in a longer letter to the USCCB:
A Catholic would be guilty of formal cooperation in evil, and so unworthy to present himself for Holy Communion, if he were to deliberately vote for a candidate precisely because of the candidate’s permissive stand on abortion and/or euthanasia. When a Catholic does not share a candidate’s stand in favour of abortion and/or euthanasia, but votes for that candidate for other reasons , it is considered remote material cooperation, which can be permitted in the presence of proportionate reasons.
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Nowhere does the Cardinal Ratzinger spell out what “proportionate reasons” are. This means that the Church leaves it to the individual’s own prudential judgment. This statement nowhere says “vote Trump and the GOP or the baby gets it!”
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USCCB on abortion
http://www.usccb.org/issues-and-act...ion/on-the-prochoice-position-on-abortion.cfm

On voting

“It must in any case be clearly understood that whatever may be laid down by civil law in this matter, man can never obey a law which is in itself immoral, and such is the case of a law which would admit in principle the liceity of abortion. Nor can he take part in a propaganda campaign in favor of such a law, or vote for it. Moreover, he may not collaborate in its application.”
Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, Declaration on Procured Abortion, November 18, 1974, nos. 19-22
John Paul II, continuing the constant teaching of the Church, has reiterated many times that those who are directly involved in lawmaking bodies have a «grave and clear obligation to oppose» any law that attacks human life. For them, as for every Catholic, it is impossible to promote such laws or to vote for them.
Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, Doctrinal Note on Some Questions Regarding the Participation of Catholics in Political Life 2002), no. 4
As in, for Catholic politicians, as it is for EVERY Catholic. Not just Catholic politicians, but for EVERY Catholic. Neither, is to vote pro abort, either directly, or Catholics voting for a politician who is a pro abort advocate…
 
Right - - I always this of it this way:
The Republicans are the party of stupid (so often they are terrible at expressing themselves etc) but the Democrats are the party of evil.
Gotta go with stupid over evil! : )
 
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