Why can't homosexuals see that their behavior is an abomination?

[catholic1seeks]

Nobody here has said that. In fact I don’t recall anyone on CAF ever saying that; if they did the moderators would promptly delete it.

What was said is that it must be Satan who deceives people so that they can’t see how evil, harmful, hateful, un-loving and hurtful their behaviour is. And leads them to think that it is actually an act of love.

Homosexual behavior is a truly disgusting form of sexual abuse, but homosexuals can’t see it or experience it. Why? It must be the deception of Satan!

Saying that homosexual persons cannot see why their behavior is “disgusting” is because of the “deception of Satan,” in addition to saying that Satan causes homosexual persons to have trances, can be simplified to “Satan is behind a homosexual person,” in my mind.

But I do not mean to misrepresent anyone. Nor did I intend for it to sound like the poster(s) meant gay people are possessed, etc. But indeed, the statements did very much sound like Satan has influence over homosexual persons (in more ways than just temptations), which could be harmful and unnecessarily offensive.

 

[Petergee]

Saying that homosexual persons cannot see why their behavior is “disgusting” is because of the “deception of Satan,” in addition to saying that Satan causes homosexual persons to have trances, can be simplified to “Satan is behind a homosexual person,” in my mind.

Then your mind is rather confused and not comprehending what was said but adding your own implications to it. Nobody here has said that Satan causes homosexual persons to have trances.

But I do not mean to misrepresent anyone. Nor did I intend for it to sound like the poster(s) meant gay people are possessed, etc. But indeed, the statements did very much sound like Satan has influence over homosexual persons (in more ways than just temptations), which could be harmful and unnecessarily offensive.

Satan has influence over all of us in more ways than just temptations. If you don’t realise this fact, I suggest that itself is a deception by Satan.

 

[yellowbird]

Petergee - You said: *Then your mind is rather confused and not comprehending what was said but adding your own implications to it. Nobody here has said that Satan causes homosexual persons to have trances. *

Did you miss this post, or are you simply confused and not comprehending what was said?

But what is it that makes some to view homosexual sex as normal while others see it as an abomination? It’s my perspective that it has to do with hypnotic trances that Satan has them (us) under.

 

[catholic1seeks]

Then your mind is rather confused and not comprehending what was said but adding your own implications to it. Nobody here has said that Satan causes homosexual persons to have trances.

Satan has influence over all of us in more ways than just temptations. If you don’t realise this fact, I suggest that itself is a deception by Satan.

A certain user has suggested in more than one post that trances are the cause of homosexual persons not accepting their actions to be wrong. One statement was “It’s my perspective that it has to do with hypnotic trances that Satan has them (us) under.” Another: “…there is such a disparity between those who condone homosexual behavior and those who do not, which I attribute to trance-like states of mind.”

In the context, I was hoping you understood what I meant. Of course Satan has influence in more ways than just temptations in this world. He can possess people; apparently he can affect the created world, God-allowing. The point I was hoping to get across was that the devil shouldn’t be looked to as the source of homosexual activity to the exclusion of other sins. Or should someone think, God forbid, that on an individual case, Satan is the source of one’s homosexuality.

 

[Petergee]

Petergee - You said: Then your mind is rather confused and not comprehending what was said but adding your own implications to it. Nobody here has said that Satan causes homosexual persons to have trances.

Did you miss this post, or are you simply confused and not comprehending what was said?

Yes sorry I missed that post. No need to be rude. Robert seems to be using “trance” figuratively. Obviously practising homoseuals don’t walk around like zombies not knowing what they are doing.

 

[Petergee]

The point I was hoping to get across was that the devil shouldn’t be looked to as the source of homosexual activity to the exclusion of other sins. Or should someone think, God forbid, that on an individual case, Satan is the source of one’s homosexuality.

well ultimately Satan is the source of that and all other evils in the world.

 

[yellowbird]

Yes sorry I missed that post. No need to be rude. Robert seems to be using “trance” figuratively. Obviously practising homoseuals don’t walk around like zombies not knowing what they are doing.

I agree, that was a very rude thing to say. I thought so when you originally said it and probably should not have reposted it back to you.

As far as homosexuals not walking around like zombies …

obviously.

I took Robert’s use of the word “trance” to mean they are blinded or hypnotized by Satan … under his control. I have no idea if he meant figuratively or quite literally.

 

[mitex]

Can we not use the word abomination (even if it is written). It’s insensitive and hurts my feelings.

Let’s just say “Homosexual acts are sinful” instead and leave it at that.

 

[yellowbird]

Can we not use the word abomination (even if it is written). It’s insensitive and hurts my feelings.

Let’s just say “Homosexual acts are sinful” instead and leave it at that.

homosexual acts are sinful… and are among the long list of sinful acts all humans commit on a daily basis.

We’d all be lost without His grace & mercy!

My Priest recently said… one day you do everything right… you do good things all day long. The next day you do everything wrong and sin all over the place. Which day does God love you more?

No difference - God’s love for us NEVER changes. There is nothing we could do to make Him love us any more, or any less. His love for us is perfect.

 

[twoshoes]

First I’m going to offer up one of my favorite verses: Luke 18:9-14

Second as a celibate homosexual maybe I can find the right balance here. Homosexual acts are indeed condemned in both the Old and New Testaments. But I have to say threads like this are kind of hurtful to me because I struggle with celibacy and I don’t appreciate some of the language on here.

Sexual activity belongs in marriage between a man and a woman I affirm. But considering you all are sinners as well; read the verse and maybe be a little more nicer in the way you express yourselves. Use love not disgust. I didn’t become celibate because of people using language like yourselves. I became celibate because someone took the time to love me like Jesus would and didn’t use this kind of language.

Homosexual acts are indeed sinful. But this thread uses unloving approaches.

I Agree!!! He who is with out sin,let him cast the first stone. Man there must be a lot of Saints on this post because the stones are flying.

 

[mitex]

The blunt political incorrectness on here is what upsets. Even if I am celibate I’m still exclusively attracted to guys. I’m a still a homosexual (celibate however), and when they throw the word “homosexuals are abominations, disgusting, sick etc” around without making a distinction for people like me they are lumping me in the same category.

Which is hurtful. Doesn’t the catechism teach “respect, compassion, and sensitivity” for homosexuals? I don’t see a lot of that which hurts me.

 

[Petergee]

I agree, that was a very rude thing to say. I thought so when you originally said it and probably should not have reposted it back to you.

Yep, looks like we both need to re-read daisybee’s excellent post #55. Correction is always difficult to take, even where it is quite appropriate.

 

[Petergee]

Can we not use the word abomination (even if it is written). It’s insensitive and hurts my feelings.

Let’s just say “Homosexual acts are sinful” instead and leave it at that.

why would it hurt someone’s feelings to hear an ACTION (not a person) described as an abomination? Particularly if it is an action which he DOESN’T do?

If one is habitually tempted to this particular grave sin, then it is very important that he does recognise, and constantly reminds himself, that it is in fact an abomination.

 

[Petergee]

I Agree!!! He who is with out sin,let him cast the first stone. Man there must be a lot of Saints on this post because the stones are flying.

I see noone here carrying out a death penalty on anyone. Or even threatening to. Or threatening anyone in any way. Or even attempting to judge anyone. Or claiming to be a saint or free of sin. Your comment is nothing but empty rhetoric.

Our Lord certainly did not say that we must refrain from saying that sin is sin. In fact He said the exact opposite.

 

[empantarhei]

why would it hurt someone’s feelings to hear an ACTION (not a person) described as an abomination? Particularly if it is an action which he DOESN’T do?

If one is habitually tempted to this particular grave sin, then it is very important that he does recognise, and constantly reminds himself, that it is in fact an abomination.

Because he has stated numerous times that he gets it; repeatedly targeting someone’s person and/or non-action who already feels badly and is struggling, is just mean.

 

[Petergee]

The blunt political incorrectness on here is what upsets. Even if I am celibate I’m still exclusively attracted to guys. I’m a still a homosexual (celibate however), and when they throw the word “homosexuals are abominations, disgusting, sick etc” around without making a distinction for people like me they are lumping me in the same category.

Which is hurtful. Doesn’t the catechism teach “respect, compassion, and sensitivity” for homosexuals? I don’t see a lot of that which hurts me.

I have read through this whole thread very carefully and nobody at all here has said anything like “homosexuals are abominations, disgusting, sick etc”, not even about active homosexuals and doubly certainly not about chaste homosexuals.

Your accusation is hurtful. Doesn’t the catechism teach that we must be honest and always speak the truth and especially we must never make knowingly false accusations of wrongdoing against our neighbour (the sin of calumny)? (In fact it says even if there is a slight doubt about whether our neighbour has done wrong, we must give him the benefit of the doubt and not rashly or recklessly accuse him, and must always interpret our neighbour’s ambiguous words or actions in the way which is most favourable to our neighbour). I don’t see a lot of obedience to that in your post.

It is the political correctness which occurs almost everywhere else that upsets me. The political incorrectness that I find here is as welcome and refreshing as an icy cold beer in a desert. The intellectual and moral desert of political correctness which otherwise surrounds us.

 

[Petergee]

Because he has stated numerous times that he gets it; repeatedly targeting someone’s person and/or non-action who already feels badly and is struggling, is just mean.

I’m sorry but could you please explain what you mean by this because it doesn’t seem to make any sense either grammatically or logically or to have anything to do with what anyone has said here.

 

[mitex]

Homosexual behavior is a truly disgusting form of sexual abuse, but homosexuals can’t see it or experience it. Why? It must be the deception of Satan!

Look we all get homosexuality is a sin. That’s a given and no brainer. I’m not specifically referring to this thread alone. I’m specifying to a lot of threads in general on CAF on the issue of homosexuality.

“Homosexuals can’t see it or experience it” it seems to me their lumping all homosexuals in one category.

 

[mitex]

I’m sorry but could you please explain what you mean by this because it doesn’t seem to make any sense either grammatically or logically or to have anything to do with what anyone has said here.

I’m already struggling with celibacy, and and an exclusive homosexual orientation that did not respond to therapy. I don’t need you all saying the word “abomination.” It makes my struggle more painful and hurtful.

I know homosexual acts are a sin. They’re condemned in plenty of passages. But to constantly use language like that doesn’t help me at all. It only hurts me.,

 

[Petergee]

I’m already struggling with celibacy, and and an exclusive homosexual orientation that did not respond to therapy. I don’t need you all saying the word “abomination.” It makes my struggle more painful and hurtful.

I know homosexual acts are a sin. They’re condemned in plenty of passages. But to constantly use language like that doesn’t help me at all. It only hurts me.,

I struggle against habitual temptations to several grave sins, and when someone reminds me that they are abominations, I feel thankful because it helps me to struggle against them. I certainly don’t find it hurtful.