Do you think RCIA needs reform?

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Went to mass, sat and listened and prayed and learned to love and to worship in my new home.

Frankly, if I had to go through all the “rigmarole” that is RCIA today, I’d likely still be Methodist. My instruction process was part of a conversion process that will last my entire life long. I am a different Catholic today than I was 35-plus years ago, but I am also a different Catholid today than I was yesterday.
Every little thing that you call “rigmarole” has meaning and purpose, if one cares to learn or explain it. I realize that many people never have the RCIA history and ancient Christian roots explained to them, because many places simply skip over the Inquiry phase where this can take place.
 
Because it is an important part of the RCIA process and should not be omitted or modified.
What is important? Leaving mass?
I am sorry I want to hear the readings, gospel and homily…that is important to me. Thank goodness our Church did not mandate that anybody leave the mass!
 
What is important? Leaving mass?
I am sorry I want to hear the readings, gospel and homily…that is important to me. Thank goodness our Church did not mandate that anybody leave the mass!
But they get the readings in their own Liturgy of the Word.
 
What is important? Leaving mass?
I am sorry I want to hear the readings, gospel and homily…that is important to me. Thank goodness our Church did not mandate that anybody leave the mass!
The Catechumens are not dismissed until AFTER the Readings, Gospel and Homily. They are dismissed before the Liturgy of the Eucharist.
 
Every little thing that you call “rigmarole” has meaning and purpose, if one cares to learn or explain it. I realize that many people never have the RCIA history and ancient Christian roots explained to them, because many places simply skip over the Inquiry phase where this can take place.
I wish that were true, my friend. Too often I see things done in the name of “meaning and purpose” when it is more a case of liturgical directors gone wild, drawing attention to themselves and their corner of the parish universe.
 
I wish that were true, my friend. Too often I see things done in the name of “meaning and purpose” when it is more a case of liturgical directors gone wild, drawing attention to themselves and their corner of the parish universe.
I won’t disagree with you on that. But the RCIA when properly followed is not an opportunity for spotlight grabbing, it is for the illumination of everyone involved.
 
Another difference with the old system was that it was much more private. Converts did not have to be “put on display” at all the various ceremonies. Some people are more reserved and do not enjoy this type of thing. Most of us who are cradle Catholics had our Baptism privately with just our family and godparents. The whole congregation did not watch. It was a similar experience for a woman I know who was Lutheran and converted to Catholic prior to the RCIA program. She was received into the Church with only her sponsor and immediate family present. She said she would have been uncomfortable with all the extra attention required now.
Agreed with this.

I would enjoy this process MUCH more if it were more private.
 
I won’t disagree with you on that. But the RCIA when properly followed is not an opportunity for spotlight grabbing, it is for the illumination of everyone involved.
To that I will join with a heartfelt -

:amen:
 
Another difference with the old system was that it was much more private. Converts did not have to be “put on display” at all the various ceremonies. Some people are more reserved and do not enjoy this type of thing. Most of us who are cradle Catholics had our Baptism privately with just our family and godparents. The whole congregation did not watch. It was a similar experience for a woman I know who was Lutheran and converted to Catholic prior to the RCIA program. She was received into the Church with only her sponsor and immediate family present. She said she would have been uncomfortable with all the extra attention required now.
Part of becoming Catholic is becoming part of the community. It’s not a private Jesus-and-me thing. Baptisms are no longer private affairs, but often happen during Mass. The whole community prays for and welcomes these infants into the Church. When we do dismissals, the choir and the congregation sing as the catechumens and catechist leave. It’s a prayer by the community for those who hope to enter the community.
Is there something online that I can read about this? I find that at BOW, I need to do some teaching. If Noah is mentioned in a reading, I need to go back and explain the story about Noah as background info. If the reading mentions “saints”, I have to explain who these are (not just the canonized ones). This happens because the group often has no idea what to make of the readings. Last Sunday was a confusing one for our group. They wanted to know what the “thief” was and what it meant by one being taken. We are told to answer questions like these and make the readings understandable to them.
That’s what we do as well. If people don’t understand the basics of what’s being said, how can they possibly hope to make it part of their lives? We talk about the upcoming readings during our class on Thursday so everyone has been exposed to it. But sometimes the catechumens don’t like to admit their ignorance in front of other people. (Particularly because some of our candidates are very knowledgeable about Scripture.) So that’s when they have the opportunity to say “I don’t get this part about…” and you can explain it.

By the way, for whoever mentioned sections 81-89 of the Rite, I just looked it up and it doesn’t say anything about what is supposed to happen during the dismissal.
 
I find it amazing that people who apparently are on RCIA teams have never read the Rite. Every team member should have their own copy.

The Rite is not some new innovation. Take a look at the great Catechumenal era of the Fourth century and you will know what RCIA should look like. It was VERY public and VERY lengthly. Everyone knew who the catechumens were and their process of initiation was much more rigorous than it ever would be today…and they were baptized stark naked.
 
Part of becoming Catholic is becoming part of the community. It’s not a private Jesus-and-me thing. Baptisms are no longer private affairs, but often happen during Mass. The whole community prays for and welcomes these infants into the Church. When we do dismissals, the choir and the congregation sing as the catechumens and catechist leave. It’s a prayer by the community for those who hope to enter the community.
In most parishes, Baptisms of infants are still done after Mass is over. For instance, in my parish the Baptisms are done on Sunday after 1 pm. The last Mass is at 12 pm. Generally, the whole congregation does not observe the Baptism, and even if they did, the baby would not remember anyway. Some people are more reserved and uncomfortable getting up in front of a large crowd with all eyes on them. When I was in high school, I had terrible stage fright. One of the reasons I became a lector was to help get over that stage fright since I knew I had speeches to make for class. The RCIA needs to be sympathetic toward people who are uncomfortable getting up in front of the whole congregation for Rite of Welcoming, Rite of Acceptance, etc. Not everyone is comfortable doing that, not even cradle Catholics. My mother joined a new parish this year when she moved. The parish had a Mass for new parishioners. She was afraid they would say her name and make her stand up, so she did not attend that Mass and went to another one on purpose. She told me she was not standing up if her name was read, and she has been a Catholic for 78 years. She’s not embarrassed about her faith, she is just a private person.
 
The Catechumens are not dismissed until AFTER the Readings, Gospel and Homily. They are dismissed before the Liturgy of the Eucharist.
oops, my bad, of course they are. We’ve only had 1 catechumen in the past 10 years so it’s easy to forget. She’s the only convert we’ve had in 10 years.
 
It does not disrupt the Mass, it is part of the Liturgy. Different Rites can be inserted into the Mass for different reasons.
The Dismissal is historically part of the ancient RCIA process from the first centuries.
The Dismissal as formulated at present contradicts the rubrics of the Mass as formulated at present, because the Mass calls for a period of Total Silence from the end of the Homily until the start of the Creed, but the Dismissal entails noisy jumbling around while the Catechumens gather up their things and taggle up toward the front, while the priest (who is supposed to be sitting down silently with his eyes closed) stands up and gives them the Dismissal blessing.

I understand that it is supposed to be a recreation of how things were in the first century, BUT, if we’re going to turn back the clock, then we have to turn back the whole clock; not just the RCIA portion of it - the Mass is going to have to have a Rubric added that noise and moving about is permitted in between the Homily and the Creed.
 
The Dismissal as formulated at present contradicts the rubrics of the Mass as formulated at present, because the Mass calls for a period of Total Silence from the end of the Homily until the start of the Creed, but the Dismissal entails noisy jumbling around while the Catechumens gather up their things and taggle up toward the front, while the priest (who is supposed to be sitting down silently with his eyes closed) stands up and gives them the Dismissal blessing.

I understand that it is supposed to be a recreation of how things were in the first century, BUT, if we’re going to turn back the clock, then we have to turn back the whole clock; not just the RCIA portion of it - the Mass is going to have to have a Rubric added that noise and moving about is permitted in between the Homily and the Creed.
We have the dismissal after the period of silence after the homily. And our priest has a long period of silence. And there are many things that might happen at mass between the homily and the creed. Just look in the Book of Blessings.
 
From what I understand it IS being reformed. I heard last year that the Knights of Columbus are working on a RCIA program to be used nationwide that will abolish all of the inconsistencies found from parish to parish. Whether or not it will actually come to fruition remains to be seen.
 
From what I understand it IS being reformed. I heard last year that the Knights of Columbus are working on a RCIA program to be used nationwide that will abolish all of the inconsistencies found from parish to parish. Whether or not it will actually come to fruition remains to be seen.
The Knights of Columbus can’t reform the RCIA RITE. They may be developing a program that can be implimented in parishes to help get rid of the parish to parish and docese to diocese differences.
 
Part of becoming Catholic is becoming part of the community. It’s not a private Jesus-and-me thing.
My conversion is between me and God, no one else.

I am all for community, but I guess I’m sick of hearing this same old excuse anytime I inquire about an RCIA program. Somehow I am wrong in wanting to convert since I would rather focus on being right with God and giving myself to Him by becoming a member of His Church rather than get involved in a ton of church activities before even converting. Thats how I’m constantly made to feel.

I have a lot of private struggles right now, plus a lot of social anxiety, so I’m not going to be comfortable jumping right into a bunch of social groups and focus only on “community” of church when right now what I need is the “worship” aspect of church. What happened to worship? Yes, its important for converts to realize the importance of community and being involved…but during conversion we are going through a lot of turmoil and hardship and I think too much the community aspect overshadows everything else. We’re trying to learn and grow spiritually and all that keeps getting shoved down our throats is “community! community! hold hands! greet your neighbor!”

Sorry, right now I’m trying to figure out where God wants me and trying to make a life changing decision. I will gladly be involved in community later, but right now my most important concern is following God and growing spiritually. I know community is important and wish my fellow parishioners well and want to make friends and such…but I can focus more on that later after I am actually Catholic and able to feel whole and stable spiritually.
 
We have the dismissal after the period of silence after the homily. And our priest has a long period of silence. And there are many things that might happen at mass between the homily and the creed. Just look in the Book of Blessings.
None of which apply to normal Sunday Mass. If we are doing the Dismissal in the middle of a wedding, funeral, or baptism, we’re good to go with that, but that’s not the normal scenario.

And what about the fiasco of the Scrutinies? The Scrutinies have to use the readings of Year A, even if it is not Year A. So what is the priest supposed to do? He can do the Year A readings, except that throws the regular parishioners off of their track, and none of what they are doing in their home devotions (Liturgy of the Hours, Lenten prayer booklets, etc.) makes any sense. Or, he can do the proper readings of the year, and then none of the prayers for the Scrutinies make any sense, because they are based off the idea that the readings of Year A have just been read out. 🤷

PS: Don’t get me wrong - I toe the party line when I’m working in the RCIA, and I make everyone do it according to the book - I stand on the priest’s foot, get right in his face, and force him to do the Year A readings throughout Lent, because that’s what it says to do in the book. But I have to say, I don’t like it any more than he does, and the reasoning behind it escapes both of us.

Why set up so much confusion? The RCIA participants hate the whole thing, anyway. They’d much rather hide in their classroom downstairs than be paraded around the Church for the Scrutinies - most of them don’t even show up on those days, just to get out of it. (And yes, I call them on it and I give them heck for being absent. I know my place, and I don’t buck the system.)
 
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