Gun Carrying Catholics Armed

[grotto]

Wisdom should come with age - and even I still don’t know everything, but I’ve seen a thing or two! IMO a law abiding citizen is allowed to own and operate firearms. Personally, protection is an excellent reason. Some folks are better at the shooting range and many are engaged in their careers. Our military have the best trained - performing with firearms. Its all good. Our world today is full of disasters waiting to happen - human dangerous behaviors being something we have to deal with every day. Today we need to be alert and as ready as we can be if we find this danger “right here, right now”. We do not have to be a College grad with a Masters Degree in order to use a gun for our’s or another’s defense. Reasonable knowledge and hands on training with regular practice is adequate. Thankful for our 2nd Amendment. I carry concealed.

 

[TheOldColonel]

Generally, those who prevail in crisis are the ones who’ve trained well. I have countless friends who carry but do not train. One called me recently because he forgot how to safely decock his 45 cal. Things like that should worry everyone who must do daily business among the overly confident, inept armed.

 

[MonteRCMS]

Maybe gift him with a session at the gun range.

 

[TheOldColonel]

I have and it helps. I train regularly, myself, and will give it up if ever I lose my ability.

 

[grotto]

Why not get something going with your friends that could use practice. A jammed firearm does require a safe way to undo it - doesn’t happen that often but when it does, one does not want to make a mistake. There are some really nice shooting ranges - this is not an AD but I will tell a personal experience at “Shoot Straight” - it was safe, helpful, range had individual walled shooting spaces, and much merchandise. If there were such a range not too far away, it would stay busy every day and evening. I suppose liability insurance would be pretty expensive.

 

[TheOldColonel]

I do offer to help them. But they clearly feel training is not necessary. One told me he’s an “expert marksman” despite the fact he’s only shot his gun once at 3 yards to qualify for a CWP. By the way, my other friend’s gun wasn’t jammed. He actually forgot how to operate it. Yikes!

 

[grotto]

Well, sometimes your the bug and sometimes the windshield!

 

[Bradskii]

A refusal to answer a simple question? You have your head in the sand. Thanks for playing. I’ll call in again when there’s been another mass shooting in the US and you can claim the ‘perp’ would have been taken out by a John MCain wannabe if only gun laws were more lax.

God protect America. From you and others like you…

Even I thought it might have taken longer.

But it’s the price you are willing to pay for a gun culture. Shame on you all for getting to this point.

 

[Theo520]

A refusal to answer a simple question? You have your head in the sand. Thanks for playing. I’ll call in again when there’s been another mass shooting in the US and you can claim the ‘perp’ would have been taken out by a John MCain wannabe if only gun laws were more lax.

God protect America. From you and others like you…

I must respond to your strawman.

I’ve never asked for our gun laws to be more lax. If I had a wish, it would be that we aggressively enforce the gun laws that we do have. It’s our enforcement of existing sound laws that is lax.

I notice you never provided evidence of John MCain going wild and killing innocent bystanders as he was legally defending himself.

Be an adult about this discussion, stop playing with strawmen.

 

[Bradskii]

Bradskii:

A refusal to answer a simple question? You have your head in the sand. Thanks for playing. I’ll call in again when there’s been another mass shooting in the US and you can claim the ‘perp’ would have been taken out by a John MCain wannabe if only gun laws were more lax.

God protect America. From you and others like you…

I must respond to your strawman.

I’ve never asked for our gun laws to be more lax. If I had a wish, it would be that we aggressively enforce the gun laws that we do have. It’s our enforcement of existing sound laws that is lax.

I notice you never provided evidence of John MCain going wild and killing innocent bystanders as he was legally defending himself.

Be an adult about this discussion, stop playing with strawmen.

If you couldn’t see the logic of the point I made earlier then it seemed a waste of my time explaining it. But as I am back yet again following more tragedy I will spell it out for you.

There are very many professionally trained people who go to work each day expecting trouble, are actively sent to confront trouble and have as part of their very job requirement a certain expertise with firearms. Which they openly carry.

It is undeniable that your average member of public who might be carrying a concealed weapon would be much less able to deal with an armed person intent on doing harm than a trained professional. It would be perverse in the extreme to deny that.

Extremely accurate and well kept records over a number of years of the trained professionals levels of expertise show that their abilities with weapons against an armed person is dismal. From memory, even with training and weapons openly carried and a mind set that expects trouble, 82% of bullets hit anything and everything except the bad guy.

Any reasonable person (and there appears to be a dearth of them on this thread) would agree that Joe Public would do a lot worse.

Is that clear enough?

 

[Theo520]

Don’t be naive, I get your logic
But if your logic led to a sound theory, then there would be ample evidence supporting it.
I’ve asked you repeatedly for your supporting evindece, but you’ve failed to provide it.

The best another poster could provide was a valid reference to accidental discharge in a Cracker Barrel restaurant. I thought it a good example of someone who should have been prosecuted for their carelessness. But it wasn’t really an example supporting your theory that civilian gun owners will shoot up innocents in a crisis.

Maybe the scenario in your vivid imagination doesn’t exist, because the villains in Die Hard movies also don’t exist in the real world. In the real world it seems a marginally competent gun owner can either shoot or scare off a criminal without shooting everyone else. Maybe they even miss the criminal, but they clearly aren’t mowing down innocent bystanders.

You learned about the scientific process right? People have concealed carry for a very long time, you should have loads of evidence about civilians that supports your theory. Again, your NYPD facts are tangential and support asking the question, but they are not supporting evidence of your theory.

 

[upant]

But as I am back yet again following more tragedy I will spell it out for you.

teachers and students are dying as the anti-gun crowd seeks feel-good laws. why aren’t we hardening our schools?

pipe bomb, pressure cooker, handgun or a shotgun, the perp will find a tool.

we need to provide secure environments for teaching.

 

[pnewton]

pipe bomb, pressure cooker, handgun or a shotgun, the perp will find a tool.

If you are referring to the situation in Sante Fe, Texas, these “tools” were fake, the pipe bomb and the pressure cooker, specifically because the explosive needed was not readily available. The idea that everyone is some sort of improvising genius is simply untrue. If tools for destruction are not readily available, not all will “find a tool.”

 

[o_mlly]

Any reasonable person …

… could see a correlation between taking prayer and God out of the classroom and guns and bullets coming into the classroom. Of course, that is not the sole reason for this increasing level of violence but it is a contributor.

Number of mass shootings at Catholic schools - 0. Thank God.

 

[Bradskii]

Bradskii:

Any reasonable person …

… could see a correlation between taking prayer and God out of the classroom and guns and bullets coming into the classroom. Of course, that is not the sole reason for this increasing level of violence but it is a contributor.

Number of mass shootings at Catholic schools - 0. Thank God.

Congratulations. Most Facile Argument of The Week.

I don’t think there have been any shootings in Muslim schools either. Or Islamic ones. Maybe rather looking for what doesn’t cause shootings (it’s never happened at an all girsl school!), you can try and work out why it does happen. And try these two simple, easy to remember words:

Gun. Culture.

 

[o_mlly]

Congratulations. Most Facile Argument of The Week.

I don’t think there have been any shootings in Muslim schools either. Or Islamic ones. Maybe rather looking for what doesn’t cause shootings (it’s never happened at an all girsl school!), you can try and work out why it does happen. And try these two simple, easy to remember words:

Gun. Culture.

Relax. An observation is not an argument. But thanks for noting that other praying schools also have less violence in the classroom. Makes my point.

 

[Bradskii]

Bradskii:

Congratulations. Most Facile Argument of The Week.

I don’t think there have been any shootings in Muslim schools either. Or Islamic ones. Maybe rather looking for what doesn’t cause shootings (it’s never happened at an all girsl school!), you can try and work out why it does happen. And try these two simple, easy to remember words:

Gun. Culture.

Relax. An observation is not an argument. But thanks for noting that other praying schools also have less violence in the classroom. Makes my point.

So let me extrapolate for you. Places where prayers to God are allowed will suffer less violence. Like churches perhaps?

 

[Ender]

Maybe rather looking for what doesn’t cause shootings (it’s never happened at an all girsl school!), you can try and work out why it does happen.

I think this is exactly what needs to be done: look for the real cause of such shooting.

And try these two simple, easy to remember words:

Gun. Culture.

I doubt it. Rather I strongly suspect that fixating on this as the problem will simply serve to deflect attention away from ever truly looking for the cause. This is just an application of Rahm Emanuel’s dictum of never letting a crisis go to waste.

 

[o_mlly]

So let me extrapolate for you. Places where prayers to God are allowed will suffer less violence. Like churches perhaps?

That’s apparently correct. Churches are safer than your place of employment, corner bar, favorite diner. But most importantly, never go to a rock concert before, during or after school.

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[Theo520]

we need to provide secure environments for teaching.

We also need ‘redirects’ that get real results with problem students.
Pretending the problem doesn’t exist is probably as bad as just locking them up in Juvie.