Info on SDA

[greggy53]

Sincere Adventist Christians look at it no differently and yet some Catholics choose to call us “viscious” or worse; but all we are doing, or trying to do, is the same as any Catholic: “Pointing out Catholic false doctrines and heresies.” After 4 years, or is it 5 on this forum; I am still trying to figure out why its “hatred” when an Adventist does just what the Catholics also wish to do.

I think your post makes it clear. Respective/opposing sides should be able to discuss differences, and even why we feel these are heresy without getting so personal.

I will say too that I know some professing Adventists and others have posted on this forum in a very hateful manner.

Not true at all. Pointing out what you believe are false doctrines is one thing, but teaching that the Catholic Church is the whore of Babylon(among many other horrible things) is something entitrely different. Not only has any SDA never posted any evidence to back any of these claims, when we speak up about it and challenge they say we are doing the bashing. .

 

[KathleenGee]

Javl, agree we must be open to share the truths of our faiths.

And for those inclined to talk, we have CAF. Jointly, we are being tested as well…any Catholic parish has a number of people who receive the sacraments but poorly catechized or living in ‘irregular’ arrangements. It seems it is seldom we find people exactly on the ‘same page’ as us even in our own Church.

I do see the spirit of Christ when non-Catholics speak of their faith in Christ. What I do not acknowledge is their condemnation on our Church from disinformation and other sources. And it is our duty to say the truth of what the Church truly is…and that is on many different levels…so you will find Catholics coming in with truthful insights from different angles.

So back to non-Catholics, to Hindus, Buddhists, etc., anyone who is achieving the common good is extending the presence of God into the world whether we share same beliefs. It is a different story when such congregations use anti-Catholicism as one of their constructs.

 

[Javl]

Javl, agree we must be open to share the truths of our faiths.

And for those inclined to talk, we have CAF. Jointly, we are being tested as well…any Catholic parish has a number of people who receive the sacraments but poorly catechized or living in ‘irregular’ arrangements. It seems it is seldom we find people exactly on the ‘same page’ as us even in our own Church.

I do see the spirit of Christ when non-Catholics speak of their faith in Christ. What I do not acknowledge is their condemnation on our Church from disinformation and other sources. And it is our duty to say the truth of what the Church truly is…and that is on many different levels…so you will find Catholics coming in with truthful insights from different angles.

So back to non-Catholics, to Hindus, Buddhists, etc., anyone who is achieving the common good is extending the presence of God into the world whether we share same beliefs. It is a different story when such congregations use anti-Catholicism as one of their constructs.

You are right in your assessment, Kathleen. It is up to us to dispell the mis-understandings that non-Catholics have about Catholicism. But…what do you do when some don’t listen to, or believe, what you say in explanation?

God Bless. Shalom haMeshiach

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

 

[me_again]

Sincere Adventist Christians look at it no differently and yet some Catholics choose to call us “viscious” or worse; but all we are doing, or trying to do, is the same as any Catholic: “Pointing out Catholic false doctrines and heresies.” After 4 years, or is it 5 on this forum; I am still trying to figure out why its “hatred” when an Adventist does just what the Catholics also wish to do.

I think your post makes it clear. Respective/opposing sides should be able to discuss differences, and even why we feel these are heresy without getting so personal.

I will say too that I know some professing Adventists and others have posted on this forum in a very hateful manner.

Due to Ellen Gould White’s writings, SDA’s teach that Catholicism is the “whore of Babylon,” which is a rubbish SDA interpretation of the bible.

Conversely, if Catholics were to accuse the SDA church of being a “whore,” then would Adventists be offended?

Ellen White deceived her followers by mixing the truth with a lie. The truth gives the lies credibility.

 

[Javl]

Due to Ellen Gould White’s writings, SDA’s teach that Catholicism is the “whore of Babylon,” which is a rubbish SDA interpretation of the bible.

Conversely, if Catholics were to accuse the SDA church of being a “whore,” then would Adventists be offended?

Ellen White deceived her followers by mixing the truth with a lie. The truth gives the lies credibility.

I would like to say that none of the Eastern or Western Catholic Churches would ever say or publish any lies, myths, or other, about any of the Christian denominations or churches as has been done to and about Catholicism. Individual Catholics may ( and they would be wrong and chastised ), but they do not speak for the Church.

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

 

[benidict]

i will contend however that the Adventist Church, is not much different in mindset with the more mainstream fundentalist protestants, in that, they have forsaken the tradition of the apostles, and gone after their own traditions. look where they descended from. its really not their fault. protestants have been doing it years before the Adventist came on the scene. if anything, they laid the groundwork for both Advetism, and Mormonism. ill probably get in trouble here. oh well… Peace

 

[Javl]

i will contend however that the Adventist Church, is not much different in mindset with the more mainstream fundentalist protestants, in that, they have forsaken the tradition of the apostles, and gone after their own traditions. look where they descended from. its really not their fault. protestants have been doing it years before the Adventist came on the scene. if anything, they laid the groundwork for both Advetism, and Mormonism. ill probably get in trouble here. oh well… Peace

No, you are quite correct. But then, think what it would be like if Martin Luther had remained within Catholicism and really helped reform instead of going on an ego trip. Luther was a brilliant theologian, but he managed to take a wrong turn.

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

 

[Protestant101]

Not true at all. Pointing out what you believe are false doctrines is one thing, but teaching that the Catholic Church is the whore of Babylon(among many other horrible things) is something entitrely different. Not only has any SDA never posted any evidence to back any of these claims, when we speak up about it and challenge they say we are doing the bashing. .

I don’t look at you as doing any “bashing;” so I don’t know what you are talking about.

 

[Protestant101]

i will contend however that the Adventist Church, is not much different in mindset with the more mainstream fundentalist protestants, in that, they have forsaken the tradition of the apostles, and gone after their own traditions. look where they descended from. its really not their fault. protestants have been doing it years before the Adventist came on the scene. if anything, they laid the groundwork for both Advetism, and Mormonism. ill probably get in trouble here. oh well… Peace

Well; you won’t get in trouble with me so relax. I do agree that other Protestant groups laid some of the groundwork for Adventism. I am quite happy with our spiritual heritage. I have learned a lot about Jesus as I have been studying our history this last week. It might surprise you though to hear me say that there are ways that Catholics have laid some of the groundwork for Adventism too.

Something I have personally noticed about Catholics is that they know what it is to have the ministry of suffering. The “fellowship of His suffering.” (Phil 3:10). I have a bunch of Adventist books in my office shelf here, and in the middle of these one can see some Catholic books. They are by Catholic authors, and deal with some aspect of human suffering. Suffering is something we all have in common, and I have been enriched by this Catholic influence in my life.

 

[Protestant101]

Due to Ellen Gould White’s writings, SDA’s teach that Catholicism is the “whore of Babylon,” which is a rubbish SDA interpretation of the bible.

Conversely, if Catholics were to accuse the SDA church of being a “whore,” then would Adventists be offended?

Ellen White deceived her followers by mixing the truth with a lie. The truth gives the lies credibility.

It actually is not “due to Ellen White’s writings” that we say anything about Bible prophecy. Many denominations before us had the idea connecting Rome with one of the kingdoms in Daniel 2, Adventists teach that not all who are Catholics will be “lost.” And we also teach that God loves the Catholic as much as the Adventist. I look forward to meeting many of you in heaven. It should be noted too that when deciding about Ellen White’s writings; it helps to know that she just as aggressively denounces error withing the Adventist Church, as she does anyone else.

 

[benidict]

No, you are quite correct. But then, think what it would be like if Martin Luther had remained within Catholicism and really helped reform instead of going on an ego trip. Luther was a brilliant theologian, but he managed to take a wrong turn.

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

i wish he would have. i believe it was Saint Catherine of sienna who worked to reform the Church from within, and never left. and she was before luther if i am not mistaken. and i could be, due to her not being my patron St. im not as familiar with her. Peace

 

[benidict]

It actually is not “due to Ellen White’s writings” that we say anything about Bible prophecy. Many denominations before us had the idea connecting Rome with one of the kingdoms in Daniel 2, Adventists teach that not all who are Catholics will be “lost.” And we also teach that God loves the Catholic as much as the Adventist. I look forward to meeting many of you in heaven. It should be noted too that when deciding about Ellen White’s writings; it helps to know that she just as aggressively denounces error withing the Adventist Church, as she does anyone else.

on that i will agree with you. she was harder on her Fellow adventist, than she was on others. i vaugely remember reading about some of her discourses with them. and some of the writings on the subject. and you are right about yall not being the first to pin the tail of the anti-christ on rome. the early reformers did it too. and just as the Adventist, they were badly and sadly mistaken. Peace p.s. do Adventist find it offensive to use the term SDA? i read on the new logo website, that they do not prefer this term, and that it would not be used by their fellowship. peace

 

[me_again]

It actually is not “due to Ellen White’s writings” that we say anything about Bible prophecy. Many denominations before us had the idea connecting Rome with one of the kingdoms in Daniel 2, Adventists teach that not all who are Catholics will be “lost.” And we also teach that God loves the Catholic as much as the Adventist. I look forward to meeting many of you in heaven. It should be noted too that when deciding about Ellen White’s writings; it helps to know that she just as aggressively denounces error withing the Adventist Church, as she does anyone else.

It’s abundantly clear that at a declarative level, you love the Lord Jesus.

The Lord allowed division to arise in the Christian world with the rising-up of sect leaders such as Ellen White, Charles Taze Russell and Joseph Smith. Each of these sect leaders claims special divine revelation from God. All of them also preach doctrines that diverge from mainstream Christian beliefs e.g. in the SDA case, the 1844 Sanctuary Doctrine is a classic illustrative example.

You may believe in a divergent belief or even in a heresy, but the question is**:** How to the genuine followers of Christ treat you? That will be revealed at the Judgment Seat of Christ.

Having said that…

I often wonder why the Lord allows some professing Christians to believe such poppycock heresies. It begs the question**:** Where is the Holy Spirit in their life e.g. the bible says that the Holy Spirit will guide us into all truth. Consequently, if a professing Christian believes diabolical heresies that have no basis in reality, then I question the spirit behind it all.

 

[benidict]

It’s abundantly clear that at a declarative level, you love the Lord Jesus.

The Lord allowed division to arise in the Christian world with the rising-up of sect leaders such as Ellen White, Charles Taze Russell and Joseph Smith. Each of these sect leaders claims special divine revelation from God. All of them also preach doctrines that diverge from mainstream Christian beliefs e.g. in the SDA case, the 1844 Sanctuary Doctrine is a classic illustrative example.

You may believe in a divergent belief or even in a heresy, but the question is**:** How to the genuine followers of Christ treat you? That will be revealed at the Judgment Seat of Christ.

Having said that…

I often wonder why the Lord allows some professing Christians to believe such poppycock heresies. It begs the question**:** Where is the Holy Spirit in their life e.g. the bible says that the Holy Spirit will guide us into all truth. Consequently, if a professing Christian believes diabolical heresies that have no basis in reality, then I question the spirit behind it all.

ill vouch for protestant 101. he does love the Lord, and i fully expect to see him in heaven. as well as rexpi, and our other Adventist friends name who escapes me at the time. little sleep recently. lol! peace

 

[Javl]

It’s abundantly clear that at a declarative level, you love the Lord Jesus.

The Lord allowed division to arise in the Christian world with the rising-up of sect leaders such as Ellen White, Charles Taze Russell and Joseph Smith. Each of these sect leaders claims special divine revelation from God. All of them also preach doctrines that diverge from mainstream Christian beliefs e.g. in the SDA case, the 1844 Sanctuary Doctrine is a classic illustrative example.

As is C.T. Russell’s “Studies in Scripture”, Mary Baker Eddy’s “Key to the Scriptures”, and so on.

You may believe in a divergent belief or even in a heresy, but the question is**:** How to the genuine followers of Christ treat you? That will be revealed at the Judgment Seat of Christ.

Having said that…

I often wonder why the Lord allows some professing Christians to believe such poppycock heresies. It begs the question**:** Where is the Holy Spirit in their life e.g. the bible says that the Holy Spirit will guide us into all truth. Consequently, if a professing Christian believes diabolical heresies that have no basis in reality, then I question the spirit behind it all.

Oh, the Holy Spirit is/was there alright. The trouble is that no one listened to Him. If they did, then we would all be one in belief.

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

 

[RonTheNewJew]

Your statements have all the truth in them. Remember that Satan appears many times as an angel of light. He has an almost perfect knowledge of the scriptures and twists and uses them to his advantage to destroy Jesus Christ’s true Church and to try to defeat even God Himself. As long as we keep this in mind and pray, Satan can never disuade us to abandon Jesus’ Church, or even defeat us. God Bless.

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

I am a Messianic Jew. However, I must now stand up for their truth, not because it is a Seventh-day Adventist truth, but because it is truth…Period.

The RCC’s first huge mistake is in calling anythng that came from God, “Jewish.”
As my many Jewish friends say, “Gimme a break already.” The God, the only true God who ever existed, was NOT a blood Jew. The ethnic people called “Jews” today are the ethnic group that came from Israel’s (Jacob’s) family and from there forward. God chose the Israelite (blood-Jews) people to whom to give His Everlasting Covenant to…Period.

As that Covenant said to them, they were to proselyte from among all the nations to bring people into that Covenant, which, among the “Ten Words,” the headlines if you will, that are further explained in the statutes and judgements which includes the headline called the Sabbath Commandment (the Fourth Commandment in the original Ten Commandments given by God to Moses on Mount Sinai. God said of His Everlasting Covenant *Exodus 34, starting with verse 10 in the “received,” not the Origen originated Alexandria, Egypt version of the Bible. The “received” texts were disovered after the Origen ones,but were, in fact older. They came from the original text as written by the ethnic, but Torah-observant Jewish authors.

But, the ethnic Jews were not faithful to the love of God found in the Moses-written Torah. Instead, they created many man-made rules and regulations that basicly caused people to blame God’s very written Torah, and then they made more rules that, as Jesus said, caused the people to actually break the commandments of God, including the Ten Commandments by making people disobey God’s statutes and judgmens as given by God to Moses at Mount Sinai.

God the Son, whose voice Moses actually heard speak the statutes and judgements, including God’s announced “moedim” (the annual holy convocations, and annual sabbaths each convocation containing a theme from the Plan of Salvation quite apart from the animal sacrifices that were carried out every day of the year, but more of them on the
Sabbath and the annual holy times each year), when He was with us, never once said He would change any aspect of His permanent religious calendar.

Colossians 2, 13 through 17, because Paul’s new converts were former pagans, not observant Jews, since as verse 13 states that the new believers were “uncircumcised in (your) their flesh,” Paul was speaking to these former sun-god worshipping pagans, means that when Paul told them that “The chierographonus dogmassen” (from the
Greek meaning “the hand-written list of accusations which was against us” was nailed to His cross. Not the Ten Commandments or the statutes and judgements of God.

In verse 17, after the statement is made (from the received texts) “Let no man judge YOU (meaning the new converts from pagan sun-god worship t whom Paul was speaking) in name of meat nor drink, nor of the new moons or a feast day, or the Sabbaton (Greek word that has always meant the seventh-day Shabbat (Hebrew for seventh-day Sabbath)
Paul then does us good service by saying in the very next verse: For these ARE (not “were” as Origen decided quite on his own) shadows of things to come.”

That means that the Roman Catholic Church is in heresy for thinking it could change what God the Son said in Exodus 34 after announcing what God there called the “New Covenant” when He said “I shall not alter the thing which has gone out of My LIPS.”
(That means the spoken, and Moses-written Torah)

Jesus came, lived that Law perfectly as an example to us, then because of disobedience by those whom He had entrusted with His laws, statutes and judgments, died that we today would not seek after pagan ways which have always taught that they could establish their own system of worship, then put the name of Jesus on it, and call it “Christian.” The children of Israel did that with the golden calf at Mount Sinai. They said they were worshipping the unchanging God. How absurd!

 

[benidict]

I am a Messianic Jew. However, I must now stand up for their truth, not because it is a Seventh-day Adventist truth, but because it is truth…Period.

The RCC’s first huge mistake is in calling anythng that came from God, “Jewish.”
As my many Jewish friends say, “Gimme a break already.” The God, the only true God who ever existed, was NOT a blood Jew. The ethnic people called “Jews” today are the ethnic group that came from Israel’s (Jacob’s) family and from there forward. God chose the Israelite (blood-Jews) people to whom to give His Everlasting Covenant to…Period.

As that Covenant said to them, they were to proselyte from among all the nations to bring people into that Covenant, which, among the “Ten Words,” the headlines if you will, that are further explained in the statutes and judgements which includes the headline called the Sabbath Commandment (the Fourth Commandment in the original Ten Commandments given by God to Moses on Mount Sinai. God said of His Everlasting Covenant *Exodus 34, starting with verse 10 in the “received,” not the Origen originated Alexandria, Egypt version of the Bible. The “received” texts were disovered after the Origen ones,but were, in fact older. They came from the original text as written by the ethnic, but Torah-observant Jewish authors.

But, the ethnic Jews were not faithful to the love of God found in the Moses-written Torah. Instead, they created many man-made rules and regulations that basicly caused people to blame God’s very written Torah, and then they made more rules that, as Jesus said, caused the people to actually break the commandments of God, including the Ten Commandments by making people disobey God’s statutes and judgmens as given by God to Moses at Mount Sinai.

God the Son, whose voice Moses actually heard speak the statutes and judgements, including God’s announced “moedim” (the annual holy convocations, and annual sabbaths each convocation containing a theme from the Plan of Salvation quite apart from the animal sacrifices that were carried out every day of the year, but more of them on the
Sabbath and the annual holy times each year), when He was with us, never once said He would change any aspect of His permanent religious calendar.

Colossians 2, 13 through 17, because Paul’s new converts were former pagans, not observant Jews, since as verse 13 states that the new believers were “uncircumcised in (your) their flesh,” Paul was speaking to these former sun-god worshipping pagans, means that when Paul told them that “The chierographonus dogmassen” (from the
Greek meaning “the hand-written list of accusations which was against us” was nailed to His cross. Not the Ten Commandments or the statutes and judgements of God.

In verse 17, after the statement is made (from the received texts) “Let no man judge YOU (meaning the new converts from pagan sun-god worship t whom Paul was speaking) in name of meat nor drink, nor of the new moons or a feast day, or the Sabbaton (Greek word that has always meant the seventh-day Shabbat (Hebrew for seventh-day Sabbath)
Paul then does us good service by saying in the very next verse: For these ARE (not “were” as Origen decided quite on his own) shadows of things to come.”

That means that the Roman Catholic Church is in heresy for thinking it could change what God the Son said in Exodus 34 after announcing what God there called the “New Covenant” when He said “I shall not alter the thing which has gone out of My LIPS.”
(That means the spoken, and Moses-written Torah)

Jesus came, lived that Law perfectly as an example to us, then because of disobedience by those whom He had entrusted with His laws, statutes and judgments, died that we today would not seek after pagan ways which have always taught that they could establish their own system of worship, then put the name of Jesus on it, and call it “Christian.” The children of Israel did that with the golden calf at Mount Sinai. They said they were worshipping the unchanging God. How absurd!

may God bless you and keep you. have you ever had Adventist worship with you? i have in principle no problem with them worshipping on the Sabbath as opposed to the Lords day. however, i think that if you are going to keep the Jewish Sabbath, it should hold to the teachings and customs of the Jews. such as the lighting of the Shabbat candles, the blessings recited over them etc. a sundown to sundown Sabbath. we have asked them, why they do not join with the messianic Jews, to worship on the Sabbath. i think they would be more than welcomed and blessed, would they not? Peace

 

[Rexpi]

Hello my Dear Friend:

It has been a while since I’ve seen and talked to you and also since we locked horns. I pray that you are well. You are still, and always will be, in my prayers as a friend.

You and many other SDA always make the comment that you are “Pointing out Catholic false doctrines and heresies”. I have asked many times what these false doctrines and heresies are and have yet to be told. Would it be asking too much again to tell me what these falsities are? Thank you and God Bless. Shalom haMeshiach.

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

G’day over there,

I dont know why anyone havent told you yet the false doctrines and teachings that the SDA church proclaim are not correct within the Christian world and out…
Like I said many times in this forum, we base our beliefs only in the word of God, everything is there and seriously you dont have to burn your brains to understand what God is saying in there… I found many people complicating themselves in order to make a point in the Bible, but the Bible, that was inspired by God, its also interpreted by Him. Studying the whole of the Bible and contexts its the right way to understand it and of course, with previously praying for guidance. The truth is one and is within the Word of God, nothing can change it.
Now saying that, I can sort of name some of the teaching that are not totally according to the Bible and that we know its our duty to show others:

The state of the dead which is related to the inmortality of the soul
Hell as a place where wicked are burning for eternity
Purgatory, Limbo [hope spelling is right]
The use of images, statues, etc of saints, Mary, Jesus… and kneeling in front of them asking petitions, etc.
The idea that a priest or man can forgive you for your sins or at least that you have to confess to them in order to get to God.
The idea that the Law of God, the ten commandments, are not to be kept any more because we are safe by grace.
The first day of the week, Sunday, instead of the seventh day, Saturday as the Sabbath and Holy day for the Lord.
The idea that men have the authority to change or add things to the Word of God and that God left a man to be his representative on earth when clearly he left His Holy Spirit since pentecost.
The idea that it doesnt matter what we eat or drink.
Baptizing babies and not baptizing by inmersion [as it has a purpose and meaning]

I’m sure there are more around in the diversity of churches and religions but this are just some of them… I wouldnt have any problem to believe them if they were supported clearly by an It is written. I believe the church have to be subordinated to the Bible and not the other way around.

Anyways, I hope it helps to clear your question…

Have a good one

 

[RonTheNewJew]

may God bless you and keep you. have you ever had Adventist worship with you? i have in principle no problem with them worshipping on the Sabbath as opposed to the Lords day. however, i think that if you are going to keep the Jewish Sabbath, it should hold to the teachings and customs of the Jews. such as the lighting of the Shabbat candles, the blessings recited over them etc. a sundown to sundown Sabbath. we have asked them, why they do not join with the messianic Jews, to worship on the Sabbath. i think they would be more than welcomed and blessed, would they not? Peace

The Seventh-day Adventists would indeed be welcomed into our worship services, as would Roman Catholics, Baptists, Methodists, or any others who decide, at long last, to return to the practices followed by Jesus at Capernaum, a city some distance from Jerusalem. Then, followed by the apostles after Pentecost and, later, after the Jerusalem Council.

The reason that the Council decided on just the four blood and food requirements for Gentiles at the Council is not because they were released from keeping the seventh-day Sabbath and the rest of the Ten Commandments, as well as the annual pilgrim festivals (now kept away from Jerusalem by Paul and John and the rest of the apostles because of Jesus’ example). There was no discussion at the Council about the days of worship. The first Christians were ethnic, blood Jews who had converted to a belief in Yeshua ha-Maschiach (Jesus, the Messiah). There were a few Gentiles who worshipped with them on the seventh-day Sabbath, and during the annual holy convocations (Passover, Shavuot, etc.)

We need to try to remember that Jesus was a blood, Torah-observant Jew. The disciples followed the same religious calendar as did Jesus, and with the same worshipful practices as had their Master. They did this after the ascension, and Pentecost, and the Jerusalem Council, used by Adventists and many others by skipping over the Jesus-centered feast-keeping of th apostles and their former pagan converts.

The New Covenant began with the giving of the Covenant described in Exodus 34. Jesus said, before He suffered and died to nail Satan’s list of our transgressions of the Ten Commandments and the New Covenant in Exodus 34, to His cross. “This is My blood of the New Covenant.” What “New Covenant” existed when He spoke those words to His disciples?

Exodus 34 is the key. The second time the Covenant was given at Mount Sinai was because the Jews, faced with the very real possibility of being wiped out by the One who created them, finally understood that they could not keep God’s Covenant without the need for God to help them a whole heaping lot. They then began to understand their need of the coming Messiah, as typified in the animal sacrifices. They began to understand the meaning of the four cups of the Seder celebration, and the Holy Spirit’s presence at Shavuot (Pentecost), and the Day of Atonement (which the Adventists almost grasped the prophetic meaning of on October 22, 1844. That was at Yom Kippur.

You and I need to try to bring our respective relgious communities into a much better understanding of the prophetic significance, from the Plan of Salvation, outlined in the calendar given by God to the ethnic Jews. The Jews did not originate any of God’s laws. They were only the recipients of them.

Baruch Haba. Baruch ata Beshem Adonai
Ye Verechecha Adonai. Amen.

 

[benidict]

The Seventh-day Adventists would indeed be welcomed into our worship services, as would Roman Catholics, Baptists, Methodists, or any others who decide, at long last, to return to the practices followed by Jesus at Capernaum, a city some distance from Jerusalem. Then, followed by the apostles after Pentecost and, later, after the Jerusalem Council.

The reason that the Council decided on just the four blood and food requirements for Gentiles at the Council is not because they were released from keeping the seventh-day Sabbath and the rest of the Ten Commandments, as well as the annual pilgrim festivals (now kept away from Jerusalem by Paul and John and the rest of the apostles because of Jesus’ example). There was no discussion at the Council about the days of worship. The first Christians were ethnic, blood Jews who had converted to a belief in Yeshua ha-Maschiach (Jesus, the Messiah). There were a few Gentiles who worshipped with them on the seventh-day Sabbath, and during the annual holy convocations (Passover, Shavuot, etc.)

We need to try to remember that Jesus was a blood, Torah-observant Jew. The disciples followed the same religious calendar as did Jesus, and with the same worshipful practices as had their Master. They did this after the ascension, and Pentecost, and the Jerusalem Council, used by Adventists and many others by skipping over the Jesus-centered feast-keeping of th apostles and their former pagan converts.

The New Covenant began with the giving of the Covenant described in Exodus 34. Jesus said, before He suffered and died to nail Satan’s list of our transgressions of the Ten Commandments and the New Covenant in Exodus 34, to His cross. “This is My blood of the New Covenant.” What “New Covenant” existed when He spoke those words to His disciples?

Exodus 34 is the key. The second time the Covenant was given at Mount Sinai was because the Jews, faced with the very real possibility of being wiped out by the One who created them, finally understood that they could not keep God’s Covenant without the need for God to help them a whole heaping lot. They then began to understand their need of the coming Messiah, as typified in the animal sacrifices. They began to understand the meaning of the four cups of the Seder celebration, and the Holy Spirit’s presence at Shavuot (Pentecost), and the Day of Atonement (which the Adventists almost grasped the prophetic meaning of on October 22, 1844. That was at Yom Kippur.

You and I need to try to bring our respective relgious communities into a much better understanding of the prophetic significance, from the Plan of Salvation, outlined in the calendar given by God to the ethnic Jews. The Jews did not originate any of God’s laws. They were only the recipients of them.

Baruch Haba. Baruch ata Beshem Adonai
Ye Verechecha Adonai. Amen.

thank you for the invitation. i will gladly take it up one day. just as i and other Catholics at times have no problem attending a synagouge service with the non-messianic Jews. we have also had a rabbi attend Mass, with his family. this would make more sense to me if the Adventist converted to your faith. my main contention with them being, that they do not celebrate the Sabbath as it is celebrated by the Jews. and i for one, would never attempt to talk you out of your practice of Jewish customs. and you are more than welcome to attend mass at any time with us. Peace and a blessing to you. i still believe that you are the Chosen of God. Peace