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You are correct in saying “CATHOLICISM” interprets Sunday as “the Lord’s Day,” but the Bible does not follow suit in this matter.
Adventist theology was developed in the 1800s by a plagiarist named Ellen Gould White who claimed to have visions from God. These demonically inspired visions from Satan include heresies such as**:**
  • The 1844 SDA Sanctuary Doctrine
  • SDA and JW soul sleep
  • Mandatory Saturday worship (or you receive the SDA mark of the beast doctrine)
  • And a myriad of other strange doctrines of demons.
We know that Ellen Gould White’s demonically inspired visions are doctrines of demons because they are the antithesis of the Word of God and apostolic tradition. Beware!!!
 
You are correct in saying “CATHOLICISM” interprets Sunday as “the Lord’s Day,” but the Bible does not follow suit in this matter.
It most certainly does follow suit, at least the Bible I read does…

1 Corinthians 16:2
On the first day of the week let every one of you put apart with himself, laying up what it shall well please him; that when I come, the collections be not then to be made.

John 20:19
Now when it was late that same day, the first of the week, and the doors were shut, where the disciples were gathered together, for fear of the Jews, Jesus came and stood in the midst, and said to them: Peace be to you.

Acts Of Apostles 20:7
And on the first day of the week, when we were assembled to break bread, Paul discoursed with them, being to depart on the morrow: and he continued his speech until midnight.

Luke 24:1
And on the first day of the week, very early in the morning, they came to the sepulchre, bringing the spices which they had prepared.

Apocalypse 1:10
I was in the spirit on the Lord’s day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet,
 
You are correct in saying “CATHOLICISM” interprets Sunday as “the Lord’s Day,” but the Bible does not follow suit in this matter.
Sorry, but there is scriptural support for this. Jesus gave Peter and the Apostles the authority to “bind and to loose” ( Mat.16:19 ) Therefore, under Jesus ( who is God ) given authority, the early Christians held the Sabbath on the first day of the week, which is Sunday, in commemoration of Jesus’ resurrection from the dead. This authority did not cease to be with the death of Peter and the Apostles but has been handed on to their successors down to the present day.

By the way, it isn’t only “CATHOLICISM” that interprets Sunday as “the Lord’s Day”. Although originated by the Catholic Chgurch, it is accepted by the majority of mainline Christian Churches.

PAX DOMINI :signofcross:

Shalom Aleichem
 
Ron: as a Jew you should know that Judaism ( Jews ) DOES NOT have a bible. Judaism has the Torah and The Tanakh. The Bible is strictly Christian and consists of the Hebrew Scriptures ( Old Testament ) and the writings ( scriptures ) that concern Jesus Christ and His Teachings ( New Testament ). The Bible was assembled and given to Christianity by the Catholic Church at the Council of Rome in 385 AD. ( read: thecatholictreasurechest.com/canon.htm ). And, only the Catholic Church is “catholic”, which means universal, since it is found in every country on this planet. The term “Catholic” was first used by St. Ireneus in his letter to the Smyrneans in 110 AD.

The first Christians, both Jewish and Gentile, did use the synagogue for Sabbath worship, but the dispute between the Jews and Christians escalated to a point where the Christians were expelled from the synagogue. In turn the Christians started meeting in private homes for worship and the Agape. These homes later became Chritians Churches. Sunday became the Christian Sabbath as early a 225 AD.

Pax Domini. Thanks for your reply. The only point I was really trying to make is that the first Christians were ethnic, Torah-observant Jews who began bringing Gentile converts into the Church which Jesus, Himself, set up. The early Chritians, both Jews and Gentiles continued to observe Christ’s religious days and ways. This not only involved the keeping of the seventh-day Sabbath/Shabbat, but they also observed Passover, Shavuot/Pentecost, Yom Teruah, Yom Kipper and Sukkot each year. Jesus did not abolish His religious calendar - rather He infused Messianic meaning into these days. Even the Roman Patriarchate kept the seventh-day Shabbat during the time-period which you suggest, about 200 years or so after Jesus’ death, resurrection and ascension.

To be truly apostolic in faith and practice, we need to begin going back to the religion and faith that Jesus practiced, preached, and taught His disciples, and a you accurately point out that the apostles did teach and practice these things and so did all Eary Christians for hundreds of years after Jesus’ ascension to heaven.

As Paul said in Colossians 2: 13 through 17, at the end of his comments there, that the new moons, feast days and the weekly Sabbath (seventh day/Sabbaton in Greek), are shadows of things to come. Not were shadows of things that “have come,” otherwise they would not have continued keeping the seventh day Shabbat as you point out that they did. They also continued their Christian observance of the “new moons and feast days.”

What Paul is saying in the text mentioned above is that the yearly feast days and the weekly seventh-day Sabbath are still to be kept as Jesus, his disciples, and later apostles kept them.

The Shabbat is soon to come this evening. So, I must go and help my wife clean the house and, symbolicly be sure I am behaving in accordance with the Ten Commandments, and pray to Jesus to send me the Holy Spirit to live in me so that I might be cleansed of sin, and seek the Holy Spirit of God’s help to not sin in the future.

You may be correct about what I said about the 600 years. I would indicate that, among al the various Christian denominations, based on how many countries each denomination now has an existing work in, that the Roman Catholic Church is in about as many as the Seventh-day Adventist Church is in. They are in, from the research I’ve done on the subject, almost every country on earth. The rest of them are not in anywhere near as many countries on earth. I think their information indicates that they are in about 230 countries at present.

I guess there are really two catholic churches: the RCC and the SDA.

Shabbat Shalom

Ron
 
It most certainly does follow suit, at least the Bible I read does…

1 Corinthians 16:2
On the first day of the week let every one of you put apart with himself, laying up what it shall well please him; that when I come, the collections be not then to be made.

John 20:19
Now when it was late that same day, the first of the week, and the doors were shut, where the disciples were gathered together, for fear of the Jews, Jesus came and stood in the midst, and said to them: Peace be to you.

Acts Of Apostles 20:7
And on the first day of the week, when we were assembled to break bread, Paul discoursed with them, being to depart on the morrow: and he continued his speech until midnight.

Luke 24:1
And on the first day of the week, very early in the morning, they came to the sepulchre, bringing the spices which they had prepared.

Apocalypse 1:10
I was in the spirit on the Lord’s day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet,
Just to help everyone out a litte bit, when the Bible, since it was written by Jews after Christ’s ascension, mentions about what the believers did “early on the first day of the week, very early in the morning,” it is talking about the first day of the week which still should, in Judeo-Christian understanding, be understood as beginning at sundown Sabbath evening (Saturday according to the Gregorian calendar), was sometimes because of 'fear of the Jews."

In the instance of laying up their offerings, this was to be done after the Sabbath had ended, “early on the first day of the week.” This was because, in some cases, their offerings were made up of produce or other things they would have to gather in before putting the offering together before giving to the apostle the next day if he intended to leave early on the first day of the week.

In the case of when the women brought the spices to the Sepulchre where Jesus had been laid after His death, the women brought the spices “early on the first day of the week” because they would not have done such a thing during the hours of the Sabbath.
Again, this could have been done at anytime after sundown which ended the Sabbath day.

“And I was in the Spirit on the Lord’s Day,” refers back to Jesus saying that He was/“is Lord also of the Sabbath.” He never had declared any other 24 hour period of time as the Bible Sabbath.

PS. The New Testament is only the expanding of the New Covenant, Exodus 34, starting at verse 10." Jesus was de-exclusivizing it from where the ethnic Jews had put it: strictly in their own domain. God had told them to give it to the rest of the world, LONG before Jesus was born. They didn’t do it. They wanted God’s blessing for keeping it just to themselves. But that was NOT God’s plan. Jesus died to give His New Covenant, which His blood ratified (the one given at Mt. Sinai the second time)

Shabbat Shalom
Ron
 
BibleTruth, you obviously did not read that quote from a journal, but you simply cut-and-pasted it from a website. Isn’t that right? It’s obviously going to be from a biased anti-Catholic website. :rolleyes:

Is it possible that you cut-and-pasted it from the following anti-Catholic, biased, Adventist-based website**:**

amazingdiscoveries.org/AD-New-Age-Teilhard_de_Chardin-Sprituality.html ?

Pray tell? :knight2:

What an amazing discovery*!!!* :coffeeread:
Is it the source of the quote that you have an issue with? Or do you care at all that the quote actually came from a Jesuit priest?
 
Is it the source of the quote that you have an issue with? Or do you care at all that the quote actually came from a Jesuit priest?
Spiritual Conspiracies Project Journal? :rolleyes:

Journal? :rolleyes:

Ah, now it becomes clear**:** It’s not a scholarly journal but, instead, it’s a journal of this guys personal notes, sort of like a diary. LOL

BibleTruth, you cut-and-pasted a one-sentence quote from an anti-Catholic website. Consequently, readers cannot read the quote in the full context of the original author.

Since it’s not a scholarly journal, it can’t be corroborated. It’s simply the opinion of a Seventh-Day Adventist who created that website**:** amazingdiscoveries.org/AD-New-Age-Teilhard_de_Chardin-Sprituality.html

That cut-and-paste quote has as much merit as your nutty and false claims that infant baptism originates from worshiping the sun and that Jesuits wrote Mein Kampf instead of Adolph Hitler.
 
When Ellen White was alive, she was a proselytizing diddy who was peddling doctrines of demons. However, what’s even more scary is that people actually believe Ellen White’s visionary lies. It is reminiscent of Jim Jones**:** People drank the Koolaide and said it was sweet and delicious. :eek:
 
Adventist theology was developed in the 1800s by a plagiarist named Ellen Gould White who claimed to have visions from God. These demonically inspired visions from Satan include heresies such as**:**
  • The 1844 SDA Sanctuary Doctrine
  • SDA and JW soul sleep
  • Mandatory Saturday worship (or you receive the SDA mark of the beast doctrine)
  • And a myriad of other strange doctrines of demons.
We know that Ellen Gould White’s demonically inspired visions are doctrines of demons because they are the antithesis of the Word of God and apostolic tradition. Beware!!!
Please provide supporting Bible references that teach:
  • that death is NOT sleep until the respective resurrection.
  • that the seventh-day Sabbath is NOT God’s holy day…a day for holy assembly.
  • that God changed the weekly Sabbath to another day.
  • that the Sabbath is NOT the seal of the living God.
  • that the Sabbath is NOT the Lord’s day.
  • that the Sabbath was NOT created for all mankind.
  • that the Sabbath is NOT synonymous with the very NAME of God.
  • that the Sabbath does NOT reflect the authority of God.
  • that the Sabbath is NOT in the New Testament.
  • that we will NOT be blessed by keeping God’s commandments.
  • that the 144,000 do NOT keep God’s commandments in addition to their faith in Jesus.
  • that the prophecies in Daniel do NOT point towards the time of the end…the “latter days”.
  • that a day in Bible prophecy does NOT represent a literal year.
  • that Daniel 8:14 does NOT mean 2,300 literal years.
Please also explain what the “other strange doctrines of demons” are.

Please provide historical proof that Ellen White developed Adventist theology and that she was a plagiarist. Please also explain what “Adventist theology” is.

You say Ellen White was demonically possessed, please provide evidence from her writings that any of it is against God’s word: http://egwdatabase.whiteestate.org/nxt/gateway.dll?f=templates$fn=default.htm$vid=default.

I want to make sure I’m not being deceived. Thanks.
 
No one should be judged for worshipping on either day. Problem is that people have not been very gracious to each other relating to the Sabbath issue. For example, in Germany about a year ago, Catholic Church leaders, and Lutheran leaders influenced their respective memberships to use their political influence and pass Sunday closing legislation which is now in force. What this has done to Jewish and Seventh-day Adventist store and shop owners is force them to keep their businesses (which are their sources of livelihood, closed for two days per week,rather than just one. Catholics, Lutherans, and others who observe Sunday can stay open and earn profits for six days rather than just the five days each week afforded to Jews and Seventh-day Adventists.
Over the years I have posted on this forum; many Catholic members have very adamantly denied that their Church wanted to make “Sunday Laws.” This is one of many examples around the world that show otherwise.
 
When Ellen White was alive, she was a proselytizing diddy who was peddling doctrines of demons. However, what’s even more scary is that people actually believe Ellen White’s visionary lies. It is reminiscent of Jim Jones**:** People drank the Kool-Aide and said it was sweet and delicious. :eek:
 
Spiritual Conspiracies Project Journal? :rolleyes:

Journal? :rolleyes:

Ah, now it becomes clear**:** It’s not a scholarly journal but, instead, it’s a journal of this guys personal notes, sort of like a diary. LOL

BibleTruth, you cut-and-pasted a one-sentence quote from an anti-Catholic website. Consequently, readers cannot read the quote in the full context of the original author.

Since it’s not a scholarly journal, it can’t be corroborated. It’s simply the opinion of a Seventh-Day Adventist who created that website**:** amazingdiscoveries.org/AD-New-Age-Teilhard_de_Chardin-Sprituality.html

That cut-and-paste quote has as much merit as your nutty and false claims that infant baptism originates from worshiping the sun and that Jesuits wrote Mein Kampf instead of Adolph Hitler.
You can read Pierre Teilhard de Chardin’s words for yourself: books.google.com/books?id=ghxWLZ3aD-IC&printsec=frontcover&dq=teilhard+de+chardin&source=bll&ots=bhTXUK63TL&sig=SQrTFwVJQTS0Hya8-WOcIQ-c0I4&hl=en&ei=M5cuTOf0H4H88Aac9PiZAw&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=13&ved=0CGQQ6AEwDA#v=onepage&q&f=false.

He was an influential Jesuit priest who taught evolution.
 
Please provide supporting Bible references that teach:
  • that death is NOT sleep until the respective resurrection.
  • that the seventh-day Sabbath is NOT God’s holy day…a day for holy assembly.
  • that God changed the weekly Sabbath to another day.
  • that the Sabbath is NOT the seal of the living God.
  • that the Sabbath is NOT the Lord’s day.
  • that the Sabbath was NOT created for all mankind.
  • that the Sabbath is NOT synonymous with the very NAME of God.
  • that the Sabbath does NOT reflect the authority of God.
  • that the Sabbath is NOT in the New Testament.
  • that we will NOT be blessed by keeping God’s commandments.
  • that the 144,000 do NOT keep God’s commandments in addition to their faith in Jesus.
  • that the prophecies in Daniel do NOT point towards the time of the end…the “latter days”.
  • that a day in Bible prophecy does NOT represent a literal year.
  • that Daniel 8:14 does NOT mean 2,300 literal years.
Please also explain what the “other strange doctrines of demons” are.

Please provide historical proof that Ellen White developed Adventist theology and that she was a plagiarist. Please also explain what “Adventist theology” is.

You say Ellen White was demonically possessed, please provide evidence from her writings that any of it is against God’s word (http://egwdatabase.whiteestate.org/nxt/gateway.dll?f=templates$fn=default.htm$vid=default).

I want to make sure I’m not being deceived. Thanks.
All of these things have been posted before and even though you have ears to hear and eyes to see, you do not see nor hear the truth.

Let’s rehash the SDA demonic doctrine of soul sleep, just for your spiritual edification.

Jesus is God and He said that when Lazarus and the rich man died, angels came and took them to their respective places. God did not say that they soul slept (without consciousness) until the resurrection. Instead, God said that they were both conscious of their circumstances. Lazarus was conscious of his presence with Abraham and the rich man was conscious of his torment. God does not lie. Ellen White did.
 
When Ellen White was alive, she was a proselytizing diddy who was peddling doctrines of demons. However, what’s even more scary is that people actually believe Ellen White’s visionary lies. It is reminiscent of Jim Jones**:** People drank the Kool-Aide and said it was sweet and delicious. :eek:
Please explain the detail of her “visionary lies”. Thanks.
 
The RCC system is man-focused and not Jesus-focused. It puts its trust in the kingdom of this world and not in the kingdom of heaven. It’s a system that has many beautiful, Christ-loving, caring people in it. There’s no question about that. But the system is at fault and is operating under the assumed authority of Lucifer (Rev. 13:1-4).

The “Church” won’t save you, friends. “Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.” Acts 4:12.
I won’t even address the rest of your rantings, but you are getting really close to being over-the-top offensive here. First of all please stop referring to the Catholic Church as a system. It isn’t a system it is a Church, the one true Church. You have stated that the Catholic Church is under the authority of Satan and that in her there is no salvation. When you bash the Church, you bash Christ himself who is its Head. I’ll report you to the moderators in a second if you keep it up. :onpatrol:
 
I and many others on this forum have presented the evidence time and time again, just to have your fellow SDA members ignore it and then fail to respond with their own. I’m not falling for that one again. Your truth, is just what you or your leaders want you to think it is. You have no authority to interpret the scriptures and it shows.

The Pope is our leader, just as Christ appointed Peter as the leader of HIs Church like the scriptures say. Mary is also honored as the scriptures say she is honored. You may not want to accept all of the scriputres but they are there and that is the historical fact.

After reading much of your SDA material and discussing with other SDA’s I have come to the conclusion that your primary goal as an organization is to tear down God’s Church. You cannot stand on your own without spreading lies about other Christians. You are sowers of discord, and confusion.

Yes Christians from the first century on have worshipped on Sunday. The Church had and has that authority…The Bible says so.

What a bunch of nonsense “Cosmic Christ”? Where is that written in the Bible? It isn’t. It’s some rubbish that some one has decieved you with. Stop being led around by the nose and do some independant research.
More anti-Adventist rhetoric, eh Greg? Thanks. 👍 I suppose you call this post “unity” “peace” and “love?” Or, worse yet, “truth?” :eek:
 
I won’t even address the rest of your rantings, but you are getting really close to being over-the-top offensive here. First of all please stop referring to the Catholic Church as a system. It isn’t a system it is a Church, the one true Church. You have stated that the Catholic Church is under the authority of Satan and that in her there is no salvation. When you bash the Church, you bash Christ himself who is its Head. I’ll report you to the moderators in a second if you keep it up. :onpatrol:
Steve; relax. You are always going to attract this kind of person/s on a forum like this. They usually respond according to the kind of responses the Catholic members here give them. It is my understanding and experience that the Moderators keep a close eye on this forum, Non-Catholic Religions. If you look at some of the posts directed at me here; you will see people accusing me of believing “satanic doctrines” and of being a “cult” etc. I think it’s important to keep trying, and to not respond in kind. (although it is tempting!). What do you think?
 
Please explain the detail of her “visionary lies”. Thanks.
Do you remember when Ellen White claimed to see Enoch on planet Venus in one of her visions? It’s convenient that no one could refute her vision because humankind didn’t have the technology to closely examine Venus. 😉

Then when the Second Coming of Jesus didn’t happen (as promised) in 1844, Ellen White claimed that William Miller’s biblical calculations were correct, EXCEPT that instead of the Second Coming occurring in 1844, Jesus entered the holy of holies in 1844. It’s convenient that no one could refute her claim because humankind didn’t have the technology to closely examine heaven. 😉

Ellen White entraps the gullible by mixing truth with lies. That’s how all false prophets work, to include Mary Baker Eddy (Scientology), Charles Taze Russell, Joseph Smith and all the others. Why would the Lord allow people to believe a lie? Because there comes a certain point where He gives them up to their own delusions.
 
Do you remember when Ellen White claimed to see Enoch on planet Venus in one of her visions? It’s convenient that no one could refute her vision because humankind didn’t have the technology to closely examine Venus.
I’m sure you can provide a reference, book and page number for this claim?
 
It most certainly does follow suit, at least the Bible I read does…

1 Corinthians 16:2
On the first day of the week let every one of you put apart with himself, laying up what it shall well please him; that when I come, the collections be not then to be made.

John 20:19
Now when it was late that same day, the first of the week, and the doors were shut, where the disciples were gathered together, for fear of the Jews, Jesus came and stood in the midst, and said to them: Peace be to you.

Acts Of Apostles 20:7
And on the first day of the week, when we were assembled to break bread, Paul discoursed with them, being to depart on the morrow: and he continued his speech until midnight.

Luke 24:1
And on the first day of the week, very early in the morning, they came to the sepulchre, bringing the spices which they had prepared.

Apocalypse 1:10
I was in the spirit on the Lord’s day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet,
In 1 Corinthians 16:2, Paul was instructing the Christians to lay up things for the believers in Jerusalem in store (at home) so that when he came to town, they wouldn’t have to scramble around for their collections. Even in the Catholic Bible it’s written like that.

In John 20:19, the disciples weren’t gathered for a worship service…they were gathered “for fear of the Jews” the day that Jesus ascended to heaven.

In Acts 20:7, Paul started preaching on a Saturday night and continued overnight (until Eutychus fell asleep on him…). Remember, in the Bible, the next day starts at sunset. In the full part of the first day, he walked 20 miles.

This verse speaks more about God’s power to raise someone from the dead than it does anything about changing the day of worship. The breaking of bread was simply eating a meal as they did daily: “And they, continuing daily with one accord in the temple, and breaking bread from house to house, did eat their meat with gladness and singleness of heart.” Acts 2:46.

In Luke 24:1, the women came to the tomb Sunday morning because of what the previous verses to this one say: "This man went unto Pilate, and begged the body of Jesus. And he took it down, and wrapped it in linen, and laid it in a sepulchre that was hewn in stone, wherein never man before was laid. And that day was the preparation [Friday], and the sabbath [Saturday] drew on. And the women also, which came with him from Galilee, followed after, and beheld the sepulchre, and how his body was laid. And they returned, and prepared spices and ointments; and rested the sabbath day according to the commandment. Luke 23:52-56.

It’s funny but when a friend of mine actually studied this verse objectively and with an open heart, she saw that the seventh-day Sabbath was still God’s holy day. One thing to bear in mind is that Luke was a “Gentile” doctor, not a Jew. If the Sabbath had been changed in the minds and teachings of Paul and the other apostles, Luke would not have referenced the Sabbath as many times as he does and not have indicated some sort of change. If I can recall, there are at least eight references in the book of Acts (also written by Luke) where the apostles, Jews and non-Jews are keeping the seventh-day Sabbath.

In Revelation 1:10, the vision is given to John on the Sabbath to reveal to him that it was still God’s holy day and it would be the deciding issue in the last days between those who accept the authority of God and those who accept the assumed authority of Satan when faced with a choice.

Please provide a reference from the Bible that PROVES the Sabbath has been changed. I’ll help you with this one:

“Question: Have you any other way of proving that the [Catholic] Church has the power to institute festivals of precept?

Answer: Had she not such power, she could not have done that in which all modern religionists agree with her; - she could not have substituted the observance of Sunday the first day of the week, for the observance of Saturday the seventh day,** a change for which there is no Scriptural authority**.”
  • A Doctrinal Catechism, Stephen Keenan, 3rd ed. p. 174
 
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