Info on SDA

[me_again]

I have seen people quoting the bible on this thread. Are you saying that the bible is not true?

Oh Richard Richard Richard, you are once again twisting and turning things. Javl did not say that the bible is not true**;** Javl said that your SDA interpretations of the bible are incorrect.

For over 2000 years, the Catholic Church rests on the apostles and what they taught (tradition) and the scriptures.

Since 1844, the SDAs have rested on Ellen Gould White’s “visions” of:

• Enoch on a planet with four suns
• Ellen’s claim that some American slaves will never be resurrected
• Ellen White falsely prophesied that some of the SDA cult members at that SDA revival would be “translated” without seeing death. They all died without being translated.

 

[me_again]

The truth is contained in the word of God.
Jn.17
17Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.

That is correct. However, Adventism’s heretical interpretations of the bible are spiritually egregious and countermand Christendoms teachings.

 

[BibleTruth]

For violating which of the 10 commandments are Christians authorized to stone people to death?

Why can’t Christians stone people to death for violating the 10 commandments?

Jesus wrote the 10 commandments with His own finger-in-stone**;** and Jesus was nailed to the cross**;** the Finger of God was nailed to a cross**:** we are now free from the law.

Christians now have a new commandment written on the fleshly tablets of their hearts. Jesus said, “a new commandment I give you, that you love one another, even as I have loved you.” If we do this, then we fulfill the intent of the 10 commandments.

However, SDAs are not free from the law. Ellen Gould White preached that you must worship on the Saturday Sabbath – or you are going to hell with the SDA mark of the beast.

Adventism is littered with doctrines of demons.

So you’re free to commit adultery…nice.

You don’t fully understand Colossians 2:13-17. The ceremonial laws were nailed to the cross because they all looked forward to Jesus Christ; He is the fulfillment of the entire sanctuary service which included annual Sabbaths. If you read Leviticus 23, you’ll see that the seventh-day Sabbath was set apart from the annual Sabbaths.

 

[BibleTruth]

The SDAs and JWs force the scriptures to say things that the Lord did not intend. Here is an example**:**

The Lord Jesus is God, so He knows exactly what happens when the mortal body dies. As an illustration of what happens immediately after death, God (Jesus) said that when Lazarus and the rich man died, the angels came and took them away. The angels took the rich man to a place of torment**;** and he was conscious of his torment. Lazarus was taken to be with Abraham**;** he was conscious of this event. Instead of soul sleeping without consciousness until the resurrection (as the SDAs and JWs teach), both men were conscious of their afterlife surroundings. God said it, but the SDAs and JWs argue against it. That’s an example of how the SDAs “put their own spin on scripture.”

Furthermore, Adventists teach that when Jesus died on the cross, He ceased to have consciousness until His resurrection e.g. SDAs teach that Jesus soul slept. Richard, as a devoted SDA, will you please confirm this heresy? :yup:

Jesus is God, so He cannot cease to have consciousness for three days in the grave. :extrahappy:

With all of the overwhelming texts that CLEARLY reveal that death is a sleep, is this PARABLE your only text to back up your position?

Believing in the immortal soul is believing Satan’s lie that “you will not surely die” (Gen. 3:4). It’s a lie he’s been perpetuating throughout the ages.

 

[Protestant101]

I wonder why they not only visit here, but some are regular contributors? Do they consider themselves evangalists? Or perhaps, hopefully some have doubts about their beliefs…We can only hope and pray that this is the case.

Some won’t believe me when I say this but there are some Catholics on this forum who are just very Christ-like, and I enjoy coming here to test my own beliefs and thinking. I never fail to receive a blessing when I come here. And I am looking forward to meeting many of you in heaven. Even in this life, we can choose to live in heavenly pieces, or in heavenly peace.

 

[Richard_Kastner]

The SDAs and JWs force the scriptures to say things that the Lord did not intend. Here is an example**:**

The Lord Jesus is God, so He knows exactly what happens when the mortal body dies. As an illustration of what happens immediately after death, God (Jesus) said that when Lazarus and the rich man died, the angels came and took them away. The angels took the rich man to a place of torment**;** and he was conscious of his torment. Lazarus was taken to be with Abraham**;** he was conscious of this event. Instead of soul sleeping without consciousness until the resurrection (as the SDAs and JWs teach), both men were conscious of their afterlife surroundings. God said it, but the SDAs and JWs argue against it. That’s an example of how the SDAs “put their own spin on scripture.”

So, you are saying that this PARABLE is to be taken literally. Is that right?

Furthermore, Adventists teach that when Jesus died on the cross, He ceased to have consciousness until His resurrection e.g. SDAs teach that Jesus soul slept. Richard, as a devoted SDA, will you please confirm this heresy? :yup:

Jesus is God, so He cannot cease to have consciousness for three days in the grave. :extrahappy:

Jesus was also a man. He took upon Himself not only our sins, but the punishment for those sins. The punishment for our sins is death
Rom.6
23For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
Luke 23
46And when Jesus had cried with a loud voice, he said, Father, into thy hands I commend my spirit: and having said thus, he gave up the ghost.

Why would Jesus commit His spirit into the keeping of the Father me? Well, the answer is that He died. He died that we might live.

5.Ecclesiastes 12:7
Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.

But God raised Him and us who believe up from the dead.

Eph.2
4But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us,

5Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved)

 

[Protestant101]

It gives me great pleasure to provide links to these SDA heresies and false prophecies from Ellen Gould White because knowledge is power!

Yes, you seem like you are enjoying yourself; I am glad to hear that. I guess I would just say that when you can provide book and page number for your accusations; then we can talk about the OFFICIAL teachings of our church on same…

 

[Javl]

[SIGN][/SIGN]

I don’t believe the Bible states that Jesus gave the authority that was His over to sinful man (read Matt. 16:23).

Because you don’t believe it does not mean that it’s not so. Read Mat. 16:19. Mat. 16:23 has nothing whatever to do with Jesua delegating authority to the Apostles. You are putting your own spin on scripture ( sola scriptura ).

Later, in the same book (28:18-20), Jesus reiterates that all power is given unto Him. He empowers us through His Holy Spirit to take the Gospel message to the world. But He is still the foundation.

Yes, and He has given the Apostles the authority to bind and to loose. Jesus is the cornerstone. He is the Head of the Church and the Church is His body. As such it cannot err and is infallible since He is infallible. ( Please do not confuse the Church with those that are in the Church ).

God’s church uphold’s His commandments (Rev. 12:17; 14:12). They don’t attempt to change them.

Again, yes. His Church does uphold His commandments, but under His authority to bind and loose, the Church holds “the Lords Day” ( Sunday ) as the Sabbath. Please understand that Sabbath DOES NOT mean Saturday. Sabbath means REST. The commandment states to keep the Sabbath holy and not Saturday. We work six days and rest on the seventh, dedicating it to God.
My work week begins on a Monday and my Sabbath day is Sunday. I AM NOT in violation of the commandment..

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

 

[Javl]

With all of the overwhelming texts that CLEARLY reveal that death is a sleep, is this PARABLE your only text to back up your position?

Believing in the immortal soul is believing Satan’s lie that “you will not surely die” (Gen. 3:4). It’s a lie he’s been perpetuating throughout the ages.

Did the SDA pick this bit from the Jehovahs Witnesses, or vice versa? If you would only open your eyes and mind, and submit to the Holy Spirit, you will see that scripture is full of references, and proof, that the soul is immortal and that there is no such thing as “soul sleep”.

Satan has surely blinded the SDA to the immortal existence of the soul. Also, one scriptural reference should be sufficient proof, since scripture is the word of God. Or don’t you believe that either?

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

 

[Protestant101]

Did the SDA pick this bit from the Jehovahs Witnesses, or vice versa? If you would only open your eyes and mind, and submit to the Holy Spirit, you will see that scripture is full of references, and proof, that the soul is immortal and that there is no such thing as “soul sleep”.

Satan has surely blinded the SDA to the immortal existence of the soul. Also, one scriptural reference should be sufficient proof, since scripture is the word of God. Or don’t you believe that either?

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

Well, the first question I would have for you is if this is so what you say; fine. But why can’t you also explain the scriptures we give to show our point of view? “The dead know not anything” (Eccl 9:5) is pretty clear to me. Why isn’t it to Catholics?

 

[Protestant101]

Again, yes. His Church does uphold His commandments, but under His authority to bind and loose, the Church holds “the Lords Day” ( Sunday ) as the Sabbath. Please understand that Sabbath DOES NOT mean Saturday. Sabbath means REST. The commandment states to keep the Sabbath holy and not Saturday. We work six days and rest on the seventh, dedicating it to God.
My work week begins on a Monday and my Sabbath day is Sunday. I AM NOT in violation of the commandment..

I see you felt the need to underline and bold the last sentence in your post. Who are you trying to convince? If God says that the Sabbath is “the seventh day”; you are in violation of that teaching.

 

[Richard_Kastner]

Did the SDA pick this bit from the Jehovahs Witnesses, or vice versa? If you would only open your eyes and mind, and submit to the Holy Spirit, you will see that scripture is full of references, and proof, that the soul is immortal and that there is no such thing as “soul sleep”.

Satan has surely blinded the SDA to the immortal existence of the soul. Also, one scriptural reference should be sufficient proof, since scripture is the word of God. Or don’t you believe that either?

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

Ezekiel 18:4
Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die.

Ezekial says the soul is not immortal.

John11
11These things said he: and after that he saith unto them, Our friend Lazarus sleepeth; but I go, that I may awake him out of sleep.

12Then said his disciples, Lord, if he sleep, he shall do well.

13Howbeit Jesus spake of his death: but they thought that he had spoken of taking of rest in sleep.

14Then said Jesus unto them plainly, Lazarus is dead.

Jesus says that death is a sleep.

So here is two passages. Should be sufficient right?

 

[Javl]

Well, the first question I would have for you is if this is so what you say; fine. But why can’t you also explain the scriptures we give to show our point of view? “The dead know not anything” (Eccl 9:5) is pretty clear to me. Why isn’t it to Catholics?

Quoting that passage shows that there is contradiction in the Bible. One passage says no, and the other says yes. We do know, though, that the Bible is the Word of God and therefore there can be no contradiction. So what is the answer?

That passage is taken out of context. In reading all of Eccl 9, it is given that the dead know nothing of whatever occurs on earth. The Early Church Fathers, such as Tertullian, expounded on the immortality of the soul and its continuing awareness after the body’s physical death. Now, if the Church Fathers taught this, I am quite sure that they are not only not mistaken and understand Eccl 9, but I know that they know much more than the SDA theologians.

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

 

[Javl]

I see you felt the need to underline and bold the last sentence in your post. Who are you trying to convince? If God says that the Sabbath is “the seventh day”; you are in violation of that teaching.

And again I state that I am not in violation of that commandment. My work week is six days and I rest on the seventh. God worked six days and rested on the seventh. He commands us to work only six days and then to rest on the seventh. He did not say that Saturday must be the seventh day. That is man’s choosing and decision!

Also, since the Early Christians kept Sunday as the Lord’s Day ( the Sabbath ) and again the Early Church Fathers agreed and expounded on it, I am sure that they knew what they were doing

. And again, I reiterate, whether or not you believe it or accept it, The Chaurch has the authority from God to keep the Sabbbath on Sunday.

You have presented your reason and understanding and we accept it as your explanation for doing so and do not judge you… We have presented our side and you refuse to accept it and judge and condemn us for our understanding and reason. I thought this forum and thread was to be an exchange of information, not a theological battle?

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

 

[greggy53]

I see you felt the need to underline and bold the last sentence in your post. Who are you trying to convince? If God says that the Sabbath is “the seventh day”; you are in violation of that teaching.

And you are in direct violation of God’s command by refusing to acknowledge the authority he gave his Church.
Rev 5 And he that sat on the throne, said: Behold, I make all things new. And he said to me: Write, for these words are most faithful and true.

Jesus made ALL things new. You seem to reject that by clinging to the old law…Law that you cannot follow and only condems those who cling to it. Read the bible

Gal 2: 16 But knowing that man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ; we also believe in Christ Jesus, that we may be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: because by the works of the law no flesh shall be justified.

 

[me_again]

When my friend who joined SDA started researching it, they left because of Ellen.

I once knew a delusional (schizophrenic) woman who was a devout Seventh-day Adventist. She believes all the SDA heresies. In conjunction with believing the SDA heresies and Ellen White’s false prophecies, she also believed:* That my father was a member of the Illuminati and that he was secretly controlling global affairs.

• That my mother is a satanic witch.
• That my sister-in-law was secretly being tortured, as is evidenced by the large size of her eyes.
• That the U.S. government is sending electromagnetic pulses into her home to control her mind, as is evidenced by the fact that her dog has one eye that is slightly larger than the other eye.
• et al

The bible says that in the last days, the Lord will allow these liars to believe “strong delusions.” That’s the only spiritual explanation.

 

[RonTheNewJew]

Thanks for your help, but it’s really just double talk. They were gathered to worship and share the Eucharist (break bread) on the 1st day, Sunday. But even if it was Saturday night after sundown Sabbath was over. Just another SDA smoke screen, a way around the truths of the Bible.

And when did Christ rise from the dead?..On the first day Sunday.

If St John had meant the Sabbath when he said “The Lords Day” being a jew he would have said “I was in the spirit on the Sabbath”, but he didn’t. Therefore one can only conclude that he did not mean the Sabbath. And Jesus being Lord even of the Sabbath rose from the dead on Sunday the first day of the week.

What does this have to do with Sunday worship? Nothing, just more SDA double speak to muddy the waters, and sow confusion.

“even if it was on Saturday night after the sun had set…” It says that "they (the women) brought the spices “after they rested on the Shabbat (seventh-day of the week/Sabbath), according to the Commandment.” The text there is saying that the Shabbat was still the Commandment of God after the death of Jesus (the "testator who made no change in the weekly day of worship before His death) as found in the Ten Commandments which are the basis of the New Covenant in Exodus 34, which Christ said His blood ratified (“This is My blood of the New Covenant.”) This paragraph explains the relationship between the New Covenant and the keeping of the Shabbat after Jesus’ death.

I have not been able to find a command in either the Tenach, including the prophets, or in the Torah that says Judeo-Christians should keep a special day to honor the resurrection of Yeshua (Jesus). There is, in the days of unleavened bread, the day of early first fruits which always happens on the third day of Passover. But, understand that the day, each year, for when Passover begins is different from one year to the next among Jews who keep the God-given (and never changed by command of God) lunar religious calendar.

During the particular year when Yeshua gave His life in sacrifice for our sins, early first fruits happened on the first day of the week. The next year and for years afterward, it happened on a different day of the week. It still does. Early First Fruits always happens on the third day of Passover which, as I indicated, starts on a different day each year.

PS. You say that what I have said is something like SDA smokescreen…, whatever it was.I am a Messianic Jew. Not SDA. Thank you. If they agree with us Jews that the Sabbath day is on the seventh day each week, then we agree with the Adventists on that. Afterall, God gave all the Law and the prophets to the Jews, including the Ten Commandments which are the summation of all the laws, stututes and judgments that Christ and His disciples/later apostles kept and observed and taught the Goyim (Gentiles) to keep and observe

Torah only allows for worship on those days which God gave, in both the Ten Commandments, then the laws, statutes and judgments which were spoken to Moses at Mt. Sinai. Yeshua said, “I came not to destroy the Law or the prophets.” If He didn’t come to destroy those laws, then “fulfill” cannot mean to destroy or change them. He said of the Covenant, "I will not alter that which has gone out of My lips. This obviously refers to the laws, statutes and judgments which God spoke to Moses. The Ten Commandments were written by the finger of God the Son.

Also, for Catholics and Adventists, alike, the English word, “covenant” means an agreement between two or more parties to do, say or keep something, with benefits accruing to both (people can gain salvation by the grace of God/God then has His people to love and care for). In the instance of the New Covenant (the second one given at Mt. Sinai, but with the other laws, statutes and judgments because Israel broke the first agreement not to break the Ten Commandments), the laws, statutes and judgments remain the same as under the Covenant that Israel broke. God gave no new laws after the on given the second time at Sinai.

In Collosians 2, vss. 13 through 17, Paul says that the new moons, feast days and the Shabbat are “shadows of things to come.” Having been stated, and Paul having observed the weekly Shabbat and the new moons and feast days after the Jerusalem Council, means that the “days and many of the ways,” of the “Jewish” (misnomer; the lunar religious calendar was given to the Jews by God, Himself) calendar remain, as long as there is no animal sacrifices and no requirement of circumcision for salvation, remain.

 

[me_again]

For violating which of the 10 commandments are Christians authorized to stone people to death?

Why can’t Christians stone people to death for violating the 10 commandments?

Jesus wrote the 10 commandments with His own finger-in-stone**;** and Jesus was nailed to the cross**;** the Finger of God was nailed to a cross**:** we are now free from the law.

Christians now have a new commandment written on the fleshly tablets of their hearts. Jesus said, “a new commandment I give you, that you love one another, even as I have loved you.” If we do this, then we fulfill the intent of the 10 commandments.

However, SDAs are not free from the law. Ellen Gould White preached that you must worship on the Saturday Sabbath – or you are going to hell with the SDA mark of the beast.

Adventism is littered with doctrines of demons.
BibleTruth;6807861:

So you’re free to commit adultery…nice.

No, you’re deductive reasoning is flawed**;** you are not allowed to commit adultery or fornication because the New Testament says that adulterers and fornicators will not enter the kingdom of heaven. However, nowhere in the New Testament does it say that failing to honor the Saturday Jewish Sabbath will cause someone to go to hell.

 

[me_again]

You don’t fully understand Colossians 2:13-17. The ceremonial laws were nailed to the cross because they all looked forward to Jesus Christ; He is the fulfillment of the entire sanctuary service which included annual Sabbaths. If you read Leviticus 23, you’ll see that the seventh-day Sabbath was set apart from the annual Sabbaths.

Ms. SDA BibleTruth, you freely admit that under the New Testament, a person can’t be stoned-to-death for failing to keep the Saturday Jewish Sabbath. Do you also admit that the Finger-of-God, which wrote the 10 commandments, was nailed to the cross to pay the full penalty of the law, to include the penalty for violating the OT statutes and ordinances, as well as the 10 commandments? Is the full penalty paid**:** yes or no?

Subsequent to the crucifixion of Jesus on the cross, the apostles wrote that Christians must obey all nine of the moral commandments, but the Saturday sabbath commandment was not mentioned by the apostles because the apostles began meeting on the Lord’s day (Sunday) since that’s the day Jesus rose from the dead.

You have eyes to see, but you cannot see the truth**;** and you have ears to hear, but you cannot comprehend the truth. In the last days, cult members will believe strong delusions that go against the Catholic Church. Ellen White propagated these delusions with her stories about Enoch visiting a planet with four moons and her allegation that some American slaves will never be resurrected. The list of these delusions is endless.

 

[me_again]

The SDAs and JWs force the scriptures to say things that the Lord did not intend. Here is an example**:**

The Lord Jesus is God, so He knows exactly what happens when the mortal body dies. As an illustration of what happens immediately after death, God (Jesus) said that when Lazarus and the rich man died, the angels came and took them away. The angels took the rich man to a place of torment**;** and he was conscious of his torment. Lazarus was taken to be with Abraham**;** he was conscious of this event. Instead of soul sleeping without consciousness until the resurrection (as the SDAs and JWs teach), both men were conscious of their afterlife surroundings. God said it, but the SDAs and JWs argue against it. That’s an example of how the SDAs “put their own spin on scripture.”

Furthermore, Adventists teach that when Jesus died on the cross, He ceased to have consciousness until His resurrection e.g. SDAs teach that Jesus soul slept. Richard, as a devoted SDA, will you please confirm this heresy? :yup:

Jesus is God, so He cannot cease to have consciousness for three days in the grave. :extrahappy:
BibleTruth;6807875:

With all of the overwhelming texts that CLEARLY reveal that death is a sleep, is this PARABLE your only text to back up your position?

There are many supporting texts.

In the story of Lazarus and the rich man, it’s interesting to note that Jesus said “There was a certain rich man…” It is not a parable. However, this message of life-after-death by the Lord Jesus does not mesh with Ellen White’s heresy of soul sleep – and that’s why the SDAs and JWs must conjure up fabricated stores to discredit Jesus’ testimony.

In all of the scriptural parables, they are always identified as parables**:*** Hear ye therefore the parable of the sower… (Matt 13:18)

• Another parable put he forth unto them, saying… (Matt 13:24)
• Another parable put he forth unto them, saying… (Matt 13:31)
• Now learn a parable of the fig tree… (Mark 13:28)
• And he spake also a parable unto them… (Luke 5:36)
• This parable spake Jesus unto them… (John 10:6)
• et al