C
Catdan
Guest
Your Right KathleenGee, it started off really well until Javl and Greggy got invovled. It’s happened with every other post that they get invovled with.
sad really.
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sad really.
K
KathleenGee
Guest
Well it is the same going around…and what is the point…if people are so entrenched with their convictions then it is bound to go no where.
J
Javl
Guest
There is plenty of proof, other than “Catholic proof”. Time magazine for one had an article on this. Also, how can you prove that “thousands of Catholics have come home” to the SDA?
PAX DOMINI
Shalom Aleichem
J
Javl
Guest
I agree with you, Catdan. It is sad. As soon as Greggy and I get involved to present the TRUTH and refute some of the lies, myths, and mis-conceptions that the SDA have about the Catholic Church and present to and about the SDA, Greggy and I are labled and claimed to be “rabble rousers”. Ah, well. I guess that old saw about the truth hurting must be so, since I hear nothing but moans and groans , etc. from the SDA when Grggy and I try to set the record staright.Your Right KathleenGee, it started off really well until Javl and Greggy got invovled. It’s happened with every other post that they get invovled with.
PAX DOMINI
Shalom Aleichem
C
Catdan
Guest
Problem is Javl, every time a reasonable answer is provided it is either dismissed or it goes on another tangent. At least we Love and are all looking forward to our Saviours soon return.
God Bless:thumbsup:
God Bless:thumbsup:
K
KathleenGee
Guest
Javl and Greggy,
Some how when we come to the SDA topic it tends to go this way…fruit loops.
Some how when we come to the SDA topic it tends to go this way…fruit loops.
G
greggy53
Guest
Personal insults do not contribute to fruitfull discussions.
G
greggy53
Guest
Yes this is not the first time we have been called trolls for asking for explanations, and evidence while those who do the name calling insist that their motives are pure. I believe I have kept my conversation civil, and do not consider it un charitable to question those who question my beliefs.I agree with you, Catdan. It is sad. As soon as Greggy and I get involved to present the TRUTH and refute some of the lies, myths, and mis-conceptions that the SDA have about the Catholic Church and present to and about the SDA, Greggy and I are labled and claimed to be “rabble rousers”. Ah, well. I guess that old saw about the truth hurting must be so, since I hear nothing but moans and groans , etc. from the SDA when Grggy and I try to set the record staright.
PAX DOMINI
Shalom Aleichem
K
KathleenGee
Guest
How can you be trolls on CAF???
The point is, they are not coming here to dialogue.
What I find with the SDA’s is that their understanding of Christ is very limited…thought about the fruit loops…
May be just resource Christology and extend to them our faith in Him, and how great the Lord is to us…
But when I pick up on the loops, then as you know…it really does not bear a good spirit in me.
The point is, they are not coming here to dialogue.
What I find with the SDA’s is that their understanding of Christ is very limited…thought about the fruit loops…
May be just resource Christology and extend to them our faith in Him, and how great the Lord is to us…
But when I pick up on the loops, then as you know…it really does not bear a good spirit in me.
G
greggy53
Guest
Well I’m not sure I understand the analogy of “fruit loops”. It does sound like name calling to me…Why are they here? don’t know, but it looks to me like they are here to sow seeds of doubt amongst the faithful. That is why I think it important to stand up to them when they attack our Christian faith.
K
KathleenGee
Guest
Calling you, Greggy or Javl, ‘fruit loop’?
Heck NO!
It is the thinking process of going in circles and bearing no fruit.
But yes, I would focus on Christology and share with them how much Christ means to us.
Heck NO!
It is the thinking process of going in circles and bearing no fruit.
But yes, I would focus on Christology and share with them how much Christ means to us.
R
RonTheNewJew
Guest
Hi Andrewv.
As has been pointed out earlier, it is not the lineage that makes any difference where salvation is concerned. The RCC cannot historically point to their popes as being connected through an unbroken line, since they also claim in this forum that even though the first Christians were in fact Jews, that they somehow were still “Catholic.” This is an historical fallacy. But, the line is not the issue. The teachings of Jesus are the issue. He changed nothing that had “gone out of (His) lips.”
The Catholics say that the Christians were “persecuted because they were Christians.” They were, in fact, persecuted because they observed and taught the same religious calendar as did the Jews. The Jews had often rebelled against Roman pagan rule. Their drive for freedom from Roman political rule is a large measure of why Jesus was crucified. The Jews were looking for a political deliverer, not a Messiah who would save them from their sins. They did not realize that had they accepted Jesus as Messiah, he, knowing that they loved Him, would have done as He did when He delivered Israel from Egyptian bondage.
Because the Jews did not trust God, or His Son, they not only accepted a murderer as a free man so that the Romans could crucify Jesus, they demanded that the Christian Jews rebell against Roman rule. Though the Christian Jews did not rebell against the Romans, the non-Christian Jews did. The Roman pagans knew little of either branch of Judaism. So, because of the outward appearance of nearly complete religious similarity between Christian Jews and non-Christian Jews, the Romans persecuted both.The non-Christian Jews rebelled at around 132 AD, until about 135 AD.
The Christians began, at that time to separate themselves, doctrinally where religious days and ways were concerned, from non-Christian Jews. Then, they began looking to ways to incorporate the surrounding pagan religions and people into their own brand of Christianity. The non-Christian Jews kept on observing the God-given religious days and ways as God gave them at Mount Sinai, to Moses. Then the Christians began to have religious councils so they could formalize what they were, in some cases, already observing.
Essentially, the above is how we got where we are today. The point here is that the non-Christian Jews need to learn of their own Messiah. We need to go back to the religious calendar that the Messiah gave at Mount Sinai. That is, the Jews need Jesus. We need the religious calendar of the Jews. God said of Himself that He is a jealous God, and does not change.
As has been pointed out earlier, it is not the lineage that makes any difference where salvation is concerned. The RCC cannot historically point to their popes as being connected through an unbroken line, since they also claim in this forum that even though the first Christians were in fact Jews, that they somehow were still “Catholic.” This is an historical fallacy. But, the line is not the issue. The teachings of Jesus are the issue. He changed nothing that had “gone out of (His) lips.”
The Catholics say that the Christians were “persecuted because they were Christians.” They were, in fact, persecuted because they observed and taught the same religious calendar as did the Jews. The Jews had often rebelled against Roman pagan rule. Their drive for freedom from Roman political rule is a large measure of why Jesus was crucified. The Jews were looking for a political deliverer, not a Messiah who would save them from their sins. They did not realize that had they accepted Jesus as Messiah, he, knowing that they loved Him, would have done as He did when He delivered Israel from Egyptian bondage.
Because the Jews did not trust God, or His Son, they not only accepted a murderer as a free man so that the Romans could crucify Jesus, they demanded that the Christian Jews rebell against Roman rule. Though the Christian Jews did not rebell against the Romans, the non-Christian Jews did. The Roman pagans knew little of either branch of Judaism. So, because of the outward appearance of nearly complete religious similarity between Christian Jews and non-Christian Jews, the Romans persecuted both.The non-Christian Jews rebelled at around 132 AD, until about 135 AD.
The Christians began, at that time to separate themselves, doctrinally where religious days and ways were concerned, from non-Christian Jews. Then, they began looking to ways to incorporate the surrounding pagan religions and people into their own brand of Christianity. The non-Christian Jews kept on observing the God-given religious days and ways as God gave them at Mount Sinai, to Moses. Then the Christians began to have religious councils so they could formalize what they were, in some cases, already observing.
Essentially, the above is how we got where we are today. The point here is that the non-Christian Jews need to learn of their own Messiah. We need to go back to the religious calendar that the Messiah gave at Mount Sinai. That is, the Jews need Jesus. We need the religious calendar of the Jews. God said of Himself that He is a jealous God, and does not change.
K
KathleenGee
Guest
Ron,
There was a protestant theologian who disputed the succession of the apostles through the papacy.
I wish I could find the source…he said after doing 27 years of painstaking research, he found our conviction true.
Have you visited Hebrewcatholic.org? They may have a some more insights to share with you. I would see them as the answer to your concerns about the Catholic Church.
There was a protestant theologian who disputed the succession of the apostles through the papacy.
I wish I could find the source…he said after doing 27 years of painstaking research, he found our conviction true.
Have you visited Hebrewcatholic.org? They may have a some more insights to share with you. I would see them as the answer to your concerns about the Catholic Church.
M
me_again
Guest
There was a false prophecy that Jesus would return to the earth in 1844. When He didn’t come, Ellen G. White later said that in 1844, the Lord Jesus actually “entered the Holy of Holies” in heaven and He purportedly began judging the living and the dead in preparation for His Second Coming. Rexpi, do you believe this?
The SeventhDay Adventist (SDA) teachings espouse that the “Spirit of Prophecy” are the revelatory writings of Ellen Gould White (EGW) e.g. that the writings of Ellen White were inspired by the Holy Spirit.
If you go to Google and enter “Spirit of Prophecy, EGW” then you will get a significant number of hits and you can begin reading their beliefs about this topic.
In a nutshell, the SDA’s believe:
- SDA’s teach: That the Mark of the Beast is forced Sunday worship in lieu of the Saturday Sabbath e.g. after you are made aware that Saturday is the Sabbath – and if you continue to worship on Sunday – then you have voluntarily received the Mark of the Beast by assent.
- SDA’s teach: When your mortal body dies, you cease to have consciousness, either in heaven or in hell, until resurrection day.
- SDA’s teach: Jesus entered the “holy of holies” in heaven in 1844 and He purportedly began judging the living and the dead in preparation of His second coming. This is based on the fact that He did not return to the earth in 1844, as promised by William Miller.
- In the last days, just before the return of Christ, the food supply will become so contaminated that people will have to become vegetarians to survive in a healthy way. Thus, they believe that adopting some sort of vegetarian lifestyle now is a good thing.
Many Adventists are extremely devoted and religious and have a genuine love for Jesus, but conversely, many SDA pillars are built upon theological sand and false doctrines.
G
greggy53
Guest
The Church can certainly historically demonstrate an unbroken line of Apostolic succession from St Peter to the present… You may not agree with it but we have the names and the documents. If you want links listing the Papal succession let me know I’ll send to you. If you have evidence to the contrary of your own I would like to see it.
A lengthy discourse full of opinion and conjecture with no references given at all only to point out why you need to go to church on Saturday like the Jews, and not Sunday like Christians?
P
Protestant101
Guest
I don’t think so. Since when does your church have the only source of loving outreach?
P
Protestant101
Guest
It wasn’t a prophecy by Ellen G White.There was a false prophecy that Jesus would return to the earth in 1844. When He didn’t come, Ellen G. White later said that in 1844, the Lord Jesus actually “entered the Holy of Holies” in heaven and He purportedly began judging the living and the dead in preparation for His Second Coming. Rexpi, do you believe this?
P
Protestant101
Guest
A list of Papal successions proves absolutely nothing about “the first Church.”
M
me_again
Guest
You are correct e.g. it was a prophecy by William Miller e.g. William Miller predicted that the Second Coming of Christ would occur in 1844. However, when Jesus didn’t return, Ellen White said that William Miller was misinformed and Ellen White prophesied that in 1844, Jesus entered the Holy of Holies to begin judging the living and the dead in preparation for His Second Coming. This begs two questions of you, Protestant101:
- Is this an accurate statement?
- Do you believe that Jesus entered the Holy of Holies in 1844?
- (optional): Do you have any proof that Jesus entered the Holy of Holies in 1844, other than what Ellen White said/wrote?
B
benidict
Guest
hello me again. i have read many of E.G. Whites books. you are right. she was a prolific author. i am actually having a very good discussion with an adventist via private e-mail. and am also in dialouge with people from one of their newsletters i am receiving in my e-mail. currently, im discussing the manhattan proclamation with them, and discussing their views on revelation 12:14. and revelation and daniel in general. actually been a very good discussion. they are having one of their pastors answer me. should be interesting to see where this goes. there is a strong anti Catholic basis for their views. but the conversations im having with them are friendly enough. peace
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