Is it Possible...a non-Catholic Saint?

[SPOKENWORD]

tru_dvotion:

Dear Word,

Apologia is correct in his/her explanation. But have you red it all? What about the following: “So, we Christians here on earth are saints, because we are called to separate ourselves from the worrys of the world. **However, not everyone who starts on the earlthy pilgramage ends in the Promised Land. Many fall off the path.” **(Apologia)

Obviously, what this thread asked and what some of us tried to address is the question: are there non-Catholics among the blessed in heaven or are there non-Catholics who’s earthly lives would warrant sainthood or could the Church even pronounce them to be saints? Those men and women the Catholic Church declares saints do not fit into the broad understanding of holiness or being set aside, as Apologia explained. Our Catholic Saints have overcome all the obstacles and were victorious during their lives on Earth and we are certain they are already among the blessed in heaven. The saints of Revelation will be yet another type of saints; specific to an age and the type of martyrdom that will be required of them.

Ok ,I agree that not all who claim to be saints will get in but those who finish the race. Many are called few are chosen.The question is are there noncatholic saints in heaven? Of course im going to assume that noncatholic means christian .I believe so. Oh when the saints go marching on. Great song.

 

[SPOKENWORD]

Continued

SPOKENWORD:

Ok ,I agree that not all who claim to be saints will get in but those who finish the race. Many are called few are chosen.The question is are there noncatholic saints in heaven? Of course im going to assume that noncatholic means christian .I believe so. Oh when the saints go marching on. Great song.

P/s By the way you dont want me to lose my hope,do you? Faith, Hope And Love.

 

[bones_IV]

tru_dvotion:

Bones, I disagree.

Source: Pope John Paul II, Apostolic Exhortation http://www.aloha.net/~mikesch/star.gif RECONCILIATION AND PENANCE, dated December 2nd, 1984.

The Pope is saying that a Catholic must seek out a priest to confess their sins and ask forgiveness ***only through the priest,***and that this “sacrament” of confession/penance is undermined by those who think they can directly approach God directly for forgiveness. This makes the Catholic priest essential in the process of salvation, since he stands in the place of God, as another mediator between man and God. This is not a novel teaching in the Catholic Church, is has a long history.

The Pope is right yes. A catholic has to go to confession. What I meant is that Protestants, Muslims, Jews and others are in the communion of saints in a broad sense, they ask for God to forgive them remember they don’t have the sacrament of Repentence. The Protestants have what we would call baptism of desire, assuming they are ignorant of Christ and his church. Reread my post tru devotion, I never said anything about Catholics not having to go to confession. The Catholics who don’t go confession and are in state of mortal sin aren’t Catholic except legally. I repeat, non-catholics who are ignorant of christ and his church are in a broad sense in the communion of saints if they are in a state of grace. Can a protestant be declared a saint by the church? Nope. Even they did, it wouldn’t be valid. It would be encouraging Catholics to live in disobedience to God.

Padre Pio “Don’t worry, work and pray.”

 

[tru_dvotion]

Reread my post tru devotion, I never said anything about Catholics not having to go to confession.

I agree, this is what you said:

Originally Posted by bones_IV

When we state the apostles creed the part “I believe in the communion of saints” means those in heaven, in purgatory and those in a state of grace on earth are in the communion of saints. Are the non-catholics in state of grace in the communion of saints. Yes they are, in a broad sense, but yes.

However, what you imply here is non-Catholics can be in a state of grace on Earth. I disagree with that. They are in a state of grace at the time of their baptism. But with no Sacrament of Penance available to them, any mortal sin they commit after their baptism would remain on their souls.

 

[SPOKENWORD]

tru_dvotion:

I agree, this is what you said:

However, what you imply here is non-Catholics can be in a state of grace on Earth. I disagree with that. They are in a state of grace at the time of their baptism. But with no Sacrament of Penance available to them, any mortal sin they commit after their baptism would remain on their souls.

Tru, I didnt realize that you have the gift of reading souls to know who is and who isnt in the state of Grace. And like Padre Pio [ST now I believe ] you might have a good shot to be declared a SAINT. How does it feel playing God? I think its best to leave it up to our Lord who will be saved and who wont. By the way I try every day to walk in His Grace for the Lord is my Redeemer.

 

[beng]

SPOKENWORD:

Tru, I didnt realize that you have the gift of reading souls to know who is and who isnt in the state of Grace. And like Padre Pio [ST now I believe ] you might have a good shot to be declared a SAINT. How does it feel playing God? I think its best to leave it up to our Lord who will be saved and who wont. By the way I try every day to walk in His Grace for the Lord is my Redeemer.

Tell me what is the possibility of a person never comitting mortal sin after baptism and then I’ll tell you how even I could read soul.

 

[beng]

SPOKENWORD:

In my oppinion there are many non catholic saints in heaven. I may be one of them God willing. Everyone is making assumptions because no one really knows. No one has come back to let us know. Wait were those Catholic saints in Johns vision in revelation.?

All the saved person in Heaven are Catholic. There are no non-Catholics in Heaven. A very few people might (i’m highly speculating) not be a Catholic when they were alive and only become Catholic at the last nano second of their death.

You can’;t enter Heaven if you’re not a Catholic. This is given and not an assumption.

 

[Apologia100]

I just thought about it, in Heaven, there are no distinctions for denomination. If you are in heaven, you are a saint, not a Catholic, Methodist, or Unitarian. Technically, since you are still part of the Mystical Body of Christ, you would be part of the Catholic (Universal) Church. Heaven makes for no artificial distinctions.

 

[beng]

Apologia100:

I just thought about it, in Heaven, there are no distinctions for denomination. If you are in heaven, you are a saint, not a Catholic, Methodist, or Unitarian. Technically, since you are still part of the Mystical Body of Christ, you would be part of the Catholic (Universal) Church. Heaven makes for no artificial distinctions.

No. In Heavens all are Catholic with Catholic believes of Petrine Primacy, 7 Sacraments and all the canon of Trent, Vat 1, Orange, Nicea I etc.

Beside member of the catholic Church NO ONE, not even Lutheran, Pentacostal, Orthodox, is a member of the body of Christ.

Read Mystici Corporis by Pius XII.

 

[SPOKENWORD]

beng:

All the saved person in Heaven are Catholic. There are no non-Catholics in Heaven. A very few people might (i’m highly speculating) not be a Catholic when they were alive and only become Catholic at the last nano second of their death.

You can’;t enter Heaven if you’re not a Catholic. This is given and not an assumption.

Beng, Another candidate up for cannonazation. Now you can join Tru,another person with this Gift of reading souls.How does it feel to play God?

 

[SPOKENWORD]

beng:

No. In Heavens all are Catholic with Catholic believes of Petrine Primacy, 7 Sacraments and all the canon of Trent, Vat 1, Orange, Nicea I etc.

Beside member of the catholic Church NO ONE, not even Lutheran, Pentacostal, Orthodox, is a member of the body of Christ.

Read Mystici Corporis by Pius XII.

May the Lord have Mercy on you tongue.Be careful, you by your own tongue might
be in the goat corral? .

 

[SPOKENWORD]

beng:

Tell me what is the possibility of a person never comitting mortal sin after baptism and then I’ll tell you how even I could read soul.

Beng you tell me,your the one with this Gift.

 

[beng]

SPOKENWORD:

Beng, Another candidate up for cannonazation. Now you can join Tru,another person with this Gift of reading souls.How does it feel to play God?

Surely “strawman” is not your middle name.

 

[beng]

SPOKENWORD:

May the Lord have Mercy on you tongue.Be careful, you by your own tongue might
be in the goat corral? .

Do you even understand the Catholic faith?

Have you ever read a single encyclical or even CCC?

 

[beng]

SPOKENWORD:

Beng you tell me,your the one with this Gift.

Answer the question:

“What is the possibility of a person never comitting mortal sin after baptism?”

 

[Apologia100]

beng:

No. In Heavens all are Catholic with Catholic believes of Petrine Primacy, 7 Sacraments and all the canon of Trent, Vat 1, Orange, Nicea I etc.

Beside member of the catholic Church NO ONE, not even Lutheran, Pentacostal, Orthodox, is a member of the body of Christ.

Read Mystici Corporis by Pius XII.

Maybe you should try reading Vatican II.

 

[beng]

Apologia100:

Maybe you should try reading Vatican II.

Quote me.

I have LOTS AND LOTS of experience with Catholics who’ve been intoxicated by the so called “spirit of vatican II”. I managed to upheld the constant teaching of the Church that is not contradicted by the TRUE spirit of Vatican II.

 

[Apologia100]

beng:

Quote me.

I have LOTS AND LOTS of experience with Catholics who’ve been intoxicated by the so called “spirit of vatican II”. I managed to upheld the constant teaching of the Church that is not contradicted by the TRUE spirit of Vatican II.

So, you are saying that the ONLY way to get into heaven is to be a baptised, Church going Catholic. Am I correct on that?

 

[Jenlyn]

I still hold to my original post. No one can enter heaven with sin on their soul. No one! Unless by the grace of God He allows it. Name a person who God has done this to. I’m curious to know. I also stand by if you are not Catholic you will not go straight to Heaven. There is no possible way for you soul to be completely clean without the sacrament of confession. Venial sins get you to purgatory, mortal sin gets you to hell.

The ultimate goal is heaven, that’s where our saintlyhood really begins. To agrue about being a saint here on earth is pointless. We are saints-in-the-making until the day we die. Remember, we can always stray. To say that a person never sins is ridiculous! Even the Saints sinned on earth. What did they do? They went to confession. We are human and only through the grace of God will we be Saints. We must follow his commandments, Jesus’s teachings and the Catholic teachings passed down through the apostles.

All these harsh words are screaming of pride! Be careful that the devil does not insnare you. Otherwise you will have sin on your soul and will be in need of confession.

 

[SPOKENWORD]

beng:

Surely “strawman” is not your middle name.

Whats a strawman? Is that a scare tactic,like a scarecrow?