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dochawk
Guest
So a person’s level of dehydration or starvation depends upon their legal status?
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CatholicSooner
Guest
That’s not what I said. I was referencing Father Mcgiviny and the knights. From what I remember, they were helping legal Irish immigrants.So a person’s level of dehydration or starvation depends upon their legal status?
So don’t try and use te knights for your own political opinions bc they weren’t helping illegal immigrants from day 1
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dochawk
Guest
You should really read the above posts before saying something that ridiculous. (and if I actually revealed my politics on the matter, you’d look even more foolish than you’ve managed with your rejection of basic charity )
Handing a starving person water and food is appropriate regardless of his legal status.
Handing a starving person water and food is appropriate regardless of his legal status.
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CatholicSooner
Guest
Again, I was simply responding to the post about mcgoviny and the knights. Nothing more and nothing less.
Tis_Bearself
Patron
Yup. The British Army would occasionally kill some civilians for fun as well.
The history of “British Occupation of Ireland” was nasty and awful.
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Theo520
Guest
So you are convinced it’s not political and they will fill a useful role, but you can’t imagine what it might be?
LeafByNiggle
Well-known member
I take the Knights at their word.
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kainosktisis
Guest
Those were different circumstances. That had to do with the taking of the land Promised to the Israelites. I do not see them as one & the same.
I don’t disagree with this. My point is that they feel called to serve those coming into the country. I don’t see a problem with that.
I agree with your point about obligations, but if they are already following the law of the land - even better - they are following God’s law, how is this wrong?
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PJH_74
Guest
Hopefully reminding people of the fact that US interests (proxy wars…or as Regan used to call them “freedom fighters”) have caused a substantial part in the lawlessness in in Guatemala and El Salvador. The Honduras is the original Banana Republic.
That these people are being made a political football and treated poorly is as bad as burning someone’s house, blaming them for it, and treating them as pariahs when the come asking for help. Sorry to get a bit political, but blaming funding for the state of the facilities we are using to house these refugees is absurd. If we can redirect billions of military spending to build some sort of wall, surely we can find Billions for what has become a well documented, frankly what appears to be deliberate, humanitarian crisis. Let’s be clear, someone who crosses our boarders and presents themselves for an asylum claim is not an “Illegal” They are following legitimate and lawful processes to obtain the right to remain in this country. Just because they don’t do this at official ports of entry does not change this, they are following international norms that we are party to.
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PJH_74
Guest
Those that are asking for asylum are not here illegally, they’re following a legitimate, legal process. They are not coming up here on some asylum tour bus that heads straight to a legal boarder crossing. They are poor people giving up everything to travel around 1000 miles traveling on foot, hopping dangerous freight trains, and the like to be here. A huge percentage of the women end up being raped on the way and all often being taken advantage of. Not all Mexicans are kind and I’m sure they have an accent that makes them stand out. There are places on the boarder where a legal crossing point is a few days walk away, they also probably don’t have good maps and almost certainly no GPS. I ask you what you would do if you had no real idea of where to cross legally but had finally found the boarder?
The most telling thing is that all refugees are being presented as “illegals” by some talking heads when you know there plenty who have crossed the boarder legally and are still being treated the same way. Wanting to escape persecution is not illegal and hiding behind this idea that they inherently have crossed in violation of Federal Law is thinly disguised xenophobia and nationalism.
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pnewton
Guest
They can provide them with food, water, shelter. There is no legal obligation to report or turn them in.
That is a different topic. Yes, politicians were posturing and playing politics with the welfare of those in detention. However, there is no obligation to fund more vigorous enforcement. That is one of the balances of power the legislative branch has on the presidency.
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pnewton
Guest
There is no law against charity, and no obligation to cooperate with immigration enforcement. So the KC is following the laws of the land. Should that change, as one state tried to do, such a law would be unjust. Catholic doctrine allows for defiance against unjust laws. I hope our nation never goes down the path of others though, as history shows where such laws end.
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pnewton
Guest
Not in the eyes of God. Are you aware the Catholic Church even has prison ministries and helps all kinds of serious criminals. I think even Jesus mentioned this as one of the things considered at the final judgement. I do not see Jesus giving a pass for those who refused to help Him, as he was with one of these here illegally.
Yep, nothing in there about the legal status. It looks to me like the leadership in the Knights have a clear of the gospel. Remember, they are Catholic, not Republican.
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Theo520
Guest
It sounds like you are suggesting an underground railroad, run by the Knights.
But in truth, well over half the illegals want to be ‘turned it’ so they can start the long rejection process for asylum and start saving money.
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Loud-living-dogma
Guest
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LeafByNiggle
Well-known member
If you must know, there is another way they can help. With the “stay in Mexico” policy the US has adopted, there are many migrants stuck on the other side of the border with no place to stay, no food, etc. The Diocese of El Paso is also helping in this regard, sending supplies over the border to help those who are staying there, awaiting their hearing in the US.pnewton:
It sounds like you are suggesting an underground railroad, run by the Knights.
But in truth, well over half the illegals want to be ‘turned it’ so they can start the long rejection process for asylum and start saving money.
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F_Marturana
Guest
It costs 750 dollars a day to hold these migrants.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.truthorfiction.com/does-it-cost-750-a-day-to-house-migrant-children-in-camps/%3Famp
But the Knights helping them is a problem?
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.truthorfiction.com/does-it-cost-750-a-day-to-house-migrant-children-in-camps/%3Famp
But the Knights helping them is a problem?
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CatholicSooner
Guest
I don’t disagree with this. My point is that they feel called to serve those coming into the country. I don’t see a problem with that.CatholicSooner:
Those were different circumstances. That had to do with the taking of the land Promised to the Israelites. I do not see them as one & the same.
If the US were to let anyone to come into the country that wanted to without proper vetting, the country would cease to exist in a relatively short amount of time.
I agree with your point about obligations, but if they are already following the law of the land - even better - they are following God’s law, how is this wrong?
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I agree with all of this.
My point of bringing up the old testament readings where God instructs the Israelites to strike down innocent while taking hte promised land is to show how it is wrong to take things out of context in an argument. Quoting old testament scripture to support modern issues rarely works imo.
LeafByNiggle
Well-known member
Many of Jesus’ disciples turned away from him when he announced that his followers must eat his flesh and drink his blood. Jesus turned to his closest friends and asked “will you also leave me?” and Peter said “Lord, to whom could we go?”
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Loud-living-dogma
Guest
Well there are plenty of other Catholic (or any other organizations) that JimmyTolder can join!
This isn’t exactly a basic point of Catholic dogma!
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