Who Will Win the US Presidential Election

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CatholicGuy22 said:
Just like the same way that abolishing abortions would mean nothing to those hungry and no where to sleep.
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Bl. Mother Teresa would not agree to that statement. She would say the exact opposite. There is more to life than food and drink.
 
CatholicGuy22 said:
I hate politics and i wish i didnt have to vote but my mind is more open and i want to vote on all the issues. The church has no business telling how to vote. We are not mindless sheep. I love my church but i dont worship her.
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So when one follows the teachings of the Church they are mindless sheep?
 
rlg94086 said:
So…if those who are hungry and have no where to sleep wish to kill someone to obtain those things, you are okay with that from a moral perspective? Which is the greater evil?
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Thomas Aquinas said the ends never justifies the means.
 
CatholicGuy22 said:
I hate politics and i wish i didnt have to vote but my mind is more open and i want to vote on all the issues. The church has no business telling how to vote. We are not mindless sheep. I love my church but i dont worship her.
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Excuse me, Catholics have the OBLIGATION to form their consciences correctly:

“1783 Conscience must be informed and moral judgment enlightened. A well-formed conscience is upright and truthful. It formulates its judgments according to reason, in conformity with the true good willed by the wisdom of the Creator. The education of conscience is indispensable for human beings who are subjected to negative influences and tempted by sin to prefer their own judgment and to reject authoritative teachings.”

" 1792 Ignorance of Christ and his Gospel, bad example given by others, enslavement to one’s passions, assertion of a mistaken notion of autonomy of conscience, rejection of the Church’s authority and her teaching, lack of conversion and of charity: these can be at the source of errors of judgment in moral conduct. "
 
estesbob said:
So when one follows the teachings of the Church they are mindless sheep?
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Because VOTING is not the same way as me directly supporting abortions. Not everything bishops say is correct. The magisturium says nothing on voting.
 
iloveangels said:
Excuse me, Catholics have the OBLIGATION to form their consciences correctly:

“1783 Conscience must be informed and moral judgment enlightened. A well-formed conscience is upright and truthful. It formulates its judgments according to reason, in conformity with the true good willed by the wisdom of the Creator. The education of conscience is indispensable for human beings who are subjected to negative influences and tempted by sin to prefer their own judgment and to reject authoritative teachings.”

" 1792 Ignorance of Christ and his Gospel, bad example given by others, enslavement to one’s passions, assertion of a mistaken notion of autonomy of conscience, rejection of the Church’s authority and her teaching, lack of conversion and of charity: these can be at the source of errors of judgment in moral conduct. "
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Its funny you mention the Gospels because Christ had lots to say about the poor which Romney can give a rats tail about.
 
CatholicGuy22 said:
Because VOTING is not the same way as me directly supporting abortions. Not everything bishops say is correct. The magisturium says nothing on voting.
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So you deny that the teaching of the bishops counts for something in the Church?

The Church has spoken about this election and very directly and specifically as well. I can put links up if you’d like.
 
CatholicGuy22 said:
Thomas Aquinas said the ends never justifies the means.
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Indeed. Therefore, the ends (taking care of the poor through bloated, federal bureaucracies) doesn’t justify the means (voting for politicians who support intrinsic evils like abortion, gay marriage and euthanasia).

I’m glad St Thomas Aquinas’ teaching is helping you to come around to my way of thinking. 👍
 
CatholicGuy22 said:
Its funny you mention the Gospels because Christ had lots to say about the poor which Romney can give a rats tail about.
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The references to the section in the Catechism of the Catholic Church on abortion are also from Scripture and they CONDEMN abortion. There are also references from the Didache and the teachings of the Church Fathers as well as other teaching documents of the Church. I can post them if you wish.
 
rlg94086 said:
Indeed. Therefore, the ends (taking care of the poor through bloated, federal bureaucracies) doesn’t justify the means (voting for politicians who support intrinsic evils like abortion, gay marriage and euthanasia).

I’m glad St Thomas Aquinas’ teaching is helping you to come around to my way of thinking. 👍
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I am not justifying myself! I just wished Catholics would not forget those poor for the sake of one issue. Our minds need to open and see the need for justice in all life not just the unborn!👍
 
CatholicGuy22 said:
I forgot Jesus was a registered republican 😃 Jesus was with the poor and marginalized and Romney will only make things worse for them with those budget cuts of his. There are waaaaay more issues.
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We spend over a trillion dollars more than that which is taken in through taxes as a country. Technically, the government is currently paying for welfare and other things through taxes that have yet to be collected by the young, and unborn. We ultimately will all bear the burden of the costs of the failed “leaders” in this country on both sides of the aisle.

But you are correct, there are many issues that face our country. For me personally, the first priority is life. The federal government doesn’t have a “Federal Death Penalty law,” that is handled by the states when they deal with criminals convicted of crimes within their jurisdiction. Obama and his currenty party platform call for Federally subsidizing abortions for women. Romney’s “record” on abortion is pretty poor from what I researched, but at least now he is “talking” the Pro-Life talk…
 
CatholicGuy22 said:
I am not justifying myself! I just wished Catholics would not forget those poor for the sake of one issue. Our minds need to open and see the need for justice in all life not just the unborn!👍
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When you open your mind, you have to be sure not to open it so much your brains fall out.
 
losnlee02 said:
Well, He Man, why don’t you try then? I asked why Biden and Pelosi have not been excomminicated from the church as of yet for having such different views than the Church requires us to hold to be Catholic.:confused:
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You also asked how they can consider themselves Catholics according to the Catholic Church which I explained. If they are excommunicated, they are still considered Catholic by the Catholic Church by virtue of their Baptisms which made them members of the Catholic Church and gave them a permanent indelible mark upon their souls at least according to the Catholic Church. Being excommunicated they would only be told they should not receive Sacraments such as the Eucharist nor hold parish roles until reconciled.
 
CMatt25 said:
You also asked how they can consider themselves Catholics according to the Catholic Church which I explained. If they are excommunicated, they are still considered Catholic by the Catholic Church by virtue of their Baptisms which made them members of the Catholic Church and gave them a permanent indelible mark upon their souls at least according to the Catholic Church. Being excommunicated they would only be told they should not receive Sacraments such as the Eucharist nor hold parish roles until reconciled.
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Excommunicated is excommunicated. Are you saying, CMatt, that it’s a good thing to be excommunicated?
 
iloveangels said:
When you open your mind, you have to be sure not to open it so much your brains fall out.
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When you close it you dont allow the Holy Spirt to work. You put God in a small box and refuse to believe anything outside of it.
 
CatholicGuy22 said:
I am not justifying myself! ** I just wished Catholics would not forget those poor for the sake of one issue.** Our minds need to open and see the need for justice in all life not just the unborn!👍
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We don’t. We take care of the poor and vote to prevent innocent human beings from being killed by those who don’t value their lives. At ~1 million per year, I guess I could say I just wish Catholics wouldn’t forget those precious lives for the sake of one issue (the poor).
 
CatholicGuy22 said:
Because VOTING is not the same way as me directly supporting abortions. Not everything bishops say is correct. The magisturium says nothing on voting.
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Actually the Bishops ARE the magesterium-and they have said plenty-much of which has been posted here and you told us to ignore.
 
estesbob said:
Actually the Bishops ARE the magesterium-and they have said plenty-much of which has been posted here and you told us to ignore.
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They never said voting for a pro-choice canidate is an evil act. Supporting abortion is evil but not voting for a canidate who does.
 
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