Mary, Joseph, and Jesus put in a Detention Cage

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Cathoholic said:
Here it is again . . .
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she said it, but is what she said consitent with the facts?

www.latimes.com

The Trump administration says it's a 'myth' that families that ask for asylum at ports of entry are separated. It happens frequently, records show

A woman named Mirian and her 18-month-old son reached Brownsville, Texas, early this year after fleeing Honduras, where the military had teargassed their home.
www.latimes.com www.latimes.com

https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/4567220-ACLU-Judge-Sabra-Order.html

www.humanrightsfirst.org

Asylum Seeking Families, Too, Are Being Separated - Human Rights First

Mothers and fathers who arrive with their children at an official port of entry to lawfully seek asylum are being forcibly separated from their children. Under Session’s “zero-tolerance” policy, migrants and refugees who cross the border between ports of entry are being referred for criminal...
www.humanrightsfirst.org www.humanrightsfirst.org

www.aclu.org

Fact-Checking Family Separation | ACLU

www.aclu.org www.aclu.org

If you read nothing else, please read Judge Sabra’s finding of facts and court order.
 
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Bro you are dead wrong. Klinefelter syndrome affects men and causes them to develop female secondary sex characteristics. Note I said secondary. They have an extra X chromosome that causes this. They aren’t men who suddenly turn into women during puberty. At no point do they suddenly develop ovaries. They are men with a genetic disorder. You will note that all the scientific literature defines it as a male genetic disorder. You are either confused or being intellectually dishonest.
 
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FirstFiveEighth said:
Bro you are dead wrong. Klinefelter syndrome affects men and causes them to develop female secondary sex characteristics. Note I said secondary. They have an extra X chromosome that causes this. They aren’t men who suddenly turn into women during puberty. At no point do they suddenly develop ovaries. They are men with a genetic disorder. You will note that all the scientific literature defines it as a male genetic disorder. You are either confused or being intellectually dishonest.
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Some are born with ovaries and fallopian tubes. Look it up.
 
Show me. Their are disorders where one can have both male and female genital tissue. One or both of these will usually be underdeveloped and non-fuctioning. Klinefelter syndrome is not one of them. If one has Klinefelter syndrome and has both male and female genetalia, this is an additional disorder to the Klinefelter syndrome. All of this is irrelevant, as even the presence of both male and female genetalia does not make one both male and female. It is one, or the other.
 
FirstFiveEighth said:
Show me. Their are disorders where one can have both male and female genital tissue. One or both of these will usually be underdeveloped and non-fuctioning. Klinefelter syndrome is not one of them. If one has Klinefelter syndrome and has both male and female genetalia, this is an additional disorder to the Klinefelter syndrome. All of this is irrelevant, as even the presence of both male and female genetalia does not make one both male and female. It is one, or the other.
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I am not an expert in genetic disorders, but the person in the documentary said she had Klinefelter’s syndrome and had one ovary and one testicle. She began her life living as a man and then switched to living as a woman.

The bottom line is that intersex people are real. God created them neither male nor female.
 
dvdjs . . . .
If you read nothing else, please read Judge Sabra’s finding of facts and court order.
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I read much of (admittedly not all-time constraints) of Judge Dana M. Sabraw’s document.

https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/4567032-ACLU-5-Declarations.html

I think the separation that occurred UNTIL YOU can verify these are in fact proper parents is appropriate.

You don’t give over children to potential NON-parent smugglers and potential child rapists just because they SAY they are “mom” or “dad”.

As to separation based upon “criminal status”, that is reasonable too.

They are not “illegal” just because they are non-citizens (at a port of entry).

I think it was you that said in an earlier post (maybe even another thread) that said the Government should ignore the misdemeanor offences and concentrate on the “bad hombres” (ICE for some reason is evidently concerned that SOME of these people ARE “bad hombres”).

Well there is NO “misdemeanor” upon presentation at a port of entry.

So whatever crime that the Government suspected SOME of these (notice it was not “all”) ICE apparently had a reason.

Kids get separated from criminal parents too.

That’s just the way it is. Ask any “dad” down at your local jail.

I’m not saying you are wrong by the way (yet).

According to this document that you recomended, these suspected crimes have not been expounded upon (but since this is at a port of entry it should not be the “crime” of presenting yourself because that is NOT a crime).

So far you have presented nothing that changes my mind.

I might, but I need MORE information.

I’ll try to read all 49 pages perhaps later, but from what I have read,
I think ICE was right
and Judge Sabraw was hasty.
 
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jagged . . .
I’m not sure what’s selective about that. Republicans run all branches of the government . . .
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What is “selective” is your assumption that just because they are a “Republican” they are monolithic.

These are complex issues.

The “Democrats” didn’t even TRY to solve this when they had their last trifecta of power.

As I mentioned, foreign countries are perplexed too.

Even some Latino foreign countries.
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Europe Migration Crisis World News
And not just Europe. Consider Colombia South America (from MARCH 2, 2018) . . . . Nowhere is the crisis more acute than here in Colombia, where 3,000 troops are fanning out across the 1,400-mile border to contain an influx of Venezuelans fleeing a collapsing economy and an increasingly repressive socialist regime. Roughly 250,000 Venezuelan migrants have surged into Colombia since August, with 3,000 a day still arriving. The sheer numbers have led to a backlash in Colombian cities and town…
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Jagged . . .
it’s on the Republicans because they are in charge.
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I already told you why this is incomplete. It is a partial truth.
 
jagged . . .
Ok, what is the Republican excuse for the current mess of immigration?
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Ok, what is the Democrat excuse for the current mess of immigration?

Ok, what is the German excuse for the current mess of immigration?

Ok, what is the Columbian excuse for the current mess of immigration?

Ok, what is the Swedish excuse for the current mess of immigration?

Ok, what is the French excuse for the current mess of immigration?

As I said jagged. These issues go beyond America.
 
jagged . . .
So, the Republican excuse is that it’s hard and they can’t be expected to govern?
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I already told you (but you won’t listen).

The “Republicans” are not monolithic.

You can’t even define what you mean by “immigration reform”.

Nor can anyone seem to, at least with a substantial unified front.

Why? Because they all have different directions they want to go with this that’s why.

You said . . .“Who cares” concerning immigration problems internationally.

Well I care. And the fact that you don’t care implicitly suggests this is “politics” over “people” to me.

And you don’t run around “emotionally fixing” things when you cannot even intellectually define the problem adequately otherwise you run a high risk of CREATING more problems than you solve.

You cannot even define reasons for the almost universal immigration problems, yet you think YOU have solutions?

I have said before on this forum we need new ideas in the area of immigration. You do not need to have a majority for that.

When the Democrats had your majorities, you didn’t even attempt to substantially “fix” immigration.

Why not? For the same reasons I already outlined.
 
Jagged . . .
I know it’s a mess because of Trump’s policies
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Sure jagged.

It was Trump’s fault when immigration was a mess under Obama too.

And Bush, and Clinton too.

And it’s Trump’s fault that immigration is a “mess” in Sweden.

Etc. etc.

My hamburger is too salty. Must be Trump’s fault.

A fly just got into the home. Must be Trump’s fault.

It’s time to get a new cell phone battery. Must be Trump’s fault.
 
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Jagged emotionally appealing . . .
they own fixing what’s wrong with immigration in America now.
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As Chesterton would say jagged . . .
“You cannot grow a beard in a moment of passion.”
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Luke6_37 said:
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JonNC:
The discussion regarding gender dysphoria is not about klinefelter. Conflating the two muddies the water.
That said, perhaps we will see a development in their comments about migration.
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The existence of humans created by God who are physically both male and female is certainly relevant to the assertion that God created humans to be either male or female.
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Take up that omission (about klinefelter’s) with the bishops.
 
jagged said:
Ok, what is the Democrat excuse for the current mess of immigration?
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In 2010, the Democrats has a filibuster-proof majority in the senate and control of the House.
Obama still had to lie in order to get ACA passed.
During that entire time, what did the Democrats do to fix the problem of illegal foreign nationals? What did they do to fix immigration?

More importantly, where were the protesters when the same things were happening during the Obama administration?
https://www.google.com/amp/www.foxn...children-was-also-slammed-by-critics.amp.html
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