Homosexuality "welcomed" by nuns

[Lisa_N]

springbreeze:

Dear friend

No what you are confusing is the state of being ‘homosexual’ with the actual act of ‘homosexual sex’ and even if someone committs that act that does not mean they are struck out of the church altogether. They may not be able to receive communion, but they may make spiritual communion within the church and this is the short-minded hatred i am opposed to, that hatred that rules people out of church because they sin, that is what i am opposed to!!!

This is the catholic church of saints and sinners is it not?

Personally I am not gay but I have gay catholic friends and to be honest in all other aspects I never met a better catholic, i wish i was so good a catholic as them.

Examine your own self before you would strike another out of God’s house. The church doesn’t strike gay catholics from it’s pews and neither should YOU

You are making sweeping statements in respect of those who possess no faith or desire no faith presently, just as the millions of promiscuous heretrosexual people who live in fornication. If they were our example then hell would reign on earth but they are not and neither should you look at what the gay population is doing by and large to form an opinion on the gay catholic just as the heretrosexual population by and large cannot be shown as a good example of the catholic population.

People have a skewed view and it has probably been skewed by the media

God Bless you and much love and peace to you

Teresa

Would you please read the post before responding?

I said SPECIFICALLY:

1. Homosexual inclinations and homosexual ACTS are two completely separate things.
2. They are not to be struck from the pews but welcome in the pews. However, that they are welcome does not mean their sins are to be supported anymore than any other sin
3. We are all sinners. I acknowledge my sins and I strive to avoid sinful behavior. That is the problem with SOME homosexuals. They want to ‘have their cake and eat it too’ in wanting to be absolved from sins but keep on sinning. I do not think that is correct thinking do you?
4. YOU are making sweeping statements that do not reflect my post at all
5. How can you be a “good” Catholic if you are in a state of sin and a state of denial? Again I am speaking of homosexuals who are not chaste
6. I have absolutely NO CLUE what point you are trying to make about “thousands of heterosexuals fornicating” You may well be right. However, that heterosexuals are fornicating doesn’t excuse homosexuals from fornicating. No one is holding up fornicating heterosexuals as role models. Further this has absolutely nothing to do with my point that you are naive to think that homosexuals who are in partnerships are living chastely. I think that is probably unlikely given the many studies on the promiscuity in the (male) homosexual community

Again, please respond to the statements instead of simply repeating your opinion so that we may engage in a dialogue instead of a monologue.

Thanks!
Lisa N

 

[springbreeze]

NightRider:

Teresa, this is a beautiful post. I also have a few gay friends who are Catholics and they are some of the most compassionate people I have ever known. Nonetheless, much hatred is directed at them, by people who feel threatened by their homosexuality.

My adoptive mother was gay. When I was in seventh grade the “vigilantes” in our small town burned our house down when they discovered my mother’s orientation. A few years later, in another city, I was harassed out of my highschool, all because some very mean students found out about my mother’s orientation. Our car was egged and damaged. When I transferred to another highschool some more students heard about my mother and many of them wouldn’t even speak to me, even though I am not gay. Several of my friends were forced by their Catholic parents to sever their friendships with me. Homophobia is a cancer whose only cure is re-education. That is a powerful ministry! Thank God for the Catholics who pursue that ministry and stop homophobia right in its tracks! Homophobia has killed people and those good sisters know that.

Thank you for speaking up, Teresa. I, for one, appreciate it immensely. There is way too much ignorance about homosexuality in the world. God bless you, dear!

Dearest friend

I am so very sorry for the bigotted acts that led to so much suffering for you and your family.

Dear other friends

You are not reading my posts , your mind sets just deny it before you even absorb it, I am thinking my words are truly futile here.

It seems whatever I say to explain the true church precepts to people, they will just say, hey if you are homosexual you are a huge sinner and so get out of our churches, why should we entertain you???

Well entertain gay people because you do not know if you are entertaining an angel. That may seem an old fashoined thing to say, but it surely it isn’t.

If you cannot extnd the hand of kindness to the sinner whitout shouting sinner at them then you are not truly understanding the works of mercy, do you expect people to leap into full catholic faith in an instant? did you do that? or was it a slow lead up and dveleopment? I am sure it was slower for God than it was for you in your short miniscule life. Hmm what patience and mercy God has, but we cannot show our brothers and sisters the same patience and mercy.

It is one thing to love the rules of the church, it is purely another to persecute humanity with them. THAT is not your premise, that is God’s, your premise is to love and in doing so, love and accept the sinner as they are becuase those who love you, love you and accept you as you are, the scarlet sinner you are.

If all you see is a persons sexuality then you totally omit the person and their soul. See the person first with your heart , love them as another human first and love them as you love yourself, when you do this maybe you will be kinder to them…

I have the distinct feeling that people are talking out of ignorance rather than the love and kindness of Christ.

God Bless you all much love and peace to you

Teresa

 

[StJeanneDArc]

Please inform me, who’s been ignorant in this thread? Please inform me, who’s been unkind on this thread?

The only name-calling has been done by those of you who don’t support naming homosexual acts as sinful.

It’s very strange and altogether to frequent to be called ignorant and unkind for reiterating Catholic teachings.

 

[StJeanneDArc]

If all you see is a persons sexuality then you totally omit the person and their soul. See the person first with your heart , love them as another human first and love them as you love yourself, when you do this maybe you will be kinder to them…

That’s exactly the point. Why do “gays” feel the need to assert their sexuality up front and flagrantly and demand that the Church accept their sexual acts as good?

It’s apparent to me that these are terribly wounded souls. Do we just pat them on the head and say everything is fine? That’s what this community of sisters is advocating, and it’s destructive to their souls.

 

[Trelow]

springbreeze:

Dearest friend

I am so very sorry for the bigotted acts that led to so much suffering for you and your family.

Dear other friends

You are not reading my posts , your mind sets just deny it before you even absorb it, I am thinking my words are truly futile here.

It seems whatever I say to explain the true church precepts to people, they will just say, hey if you are homosexual you are a huge sinner and so get out of our churches, why should we entertain you???

Well entertain gay people because you do not know if you are entertaining an angel. That may seem an old fashoined thing to say, but it surely it isn’t.

If you cannot extnd the hand of kindness to the sinner whitout shouting sinner at them then you are not truly understanding the works of mercy, do you expect people to leap into full catholic faith in an instant? did you do that? or was it a slow lead up and dveleopment? I am sure it was slower for God than it was for you in your short miniscule life. Hmm what patience and mercy God has, but we cannot show our brothers and sisters the same patience and mercy.

It is one thing to love the rules of the church, it is purely another to persecute humanity with them. THAT is not your premise, that is God’s, your premise is to love and in doing so, love and accept the sinner as they are becuase those who love you, love you and accept you as you are, the scarlet sinner you are.

If all you see is a persons sexuality then you totally omit the person and their soul. See the person first with your heart , love them as another human first and love them as you love yourself, when you do this maybe you will be kinder to them…

I have the distinct feeling that people are talking out of ignorance rather than the love and kindness of Christ.

God Bless you all much love and peace to you

Teresa

You don’t love someone by leting them recive the Holy Eucharist while in a state of mortal sin.

You don’t love someone by accepting thier God rebuking deviant lifestyle.

You love them by pastoring to their immortal soul.

There is a grave difference between having SSA, and being a sodomite. Between having a physiological disorder and embracing mortal sin.

Giving someone a hug isn’t love. Letting someone know they are on the fast track to hell is.

 

[Jermosh]

Actually homosexual behavoir is very prevelent in most social mammels and birds under normal situations. Sea mammels are very prevelant for some reason. Dolphins have sex for pleasure as well. Penquins actually take lifelong SS mates.

 

[TheGarg]

TarAshly:

thats my point. im more afraid of people like you and LisaN running our church than these nuns.

Why are you in favor of a bunch women condoning homesexuality? you seem to imply that your a member of the Catholic Churc, but yet you don’t talk like one?..How can you praise these “nuns” for promoting something that is “an abomination[homosexual activity] to the Lord” ?

 

[springbreeze]

Dear friends

I sincerely apologise if my comments have offended anyone. I have not called anyone unkind or ignorant personally.

I think we will have to agree to differ and I will continue as I am and you continue as you are.

God Bless you and much love and peace to you

Teresa

 

[Perry5]

First came man,then came sex and lastly came cultism and demagoguery.

 

[fix]

In almost every one of these threads about those with SSAD we see the homosexualists coming here to spread proaganda. The tune never changes. These folks have infiltrated the Church and try very hard to usurp teachings and lead others astray.

It seems to me to be a considerable problem. It is one thing to accept we each are a sinner and to confess our sins and try to amend our lives. It is another thing to be closed minded, hijack the language ( using the term “gay”), and vilify those who try to preach the truth in love.

I can almost see why the Vatican has had such a hard time disciplining these errant nuns and others. These type of people seem to lead their entire lives with one goal. That goal is to change the hearts and minds of most people. They want everyone to embrace error as truth.

 

[FightingFat]

Another way of looking at it might be that discrimination is bad.
I think we have to deal with these people as people first and foremost. Most are struggling with their sexuality anyway. I’m not denying the truth of the Church’s teaching in this regard, but I would rather we had an inclusive attitude and reached out as an organisation for all God’s people.

 

[fix]

FightingFat:

Another way of looking at it might be that discrimination is bad.
I think we have to deal with these people as people first and foremost. Most are struggling with their sexuality anyway. I’m not denying the truth of the Church’s teaching in this regard, but I would rather we had an inclusive attitude and reached out as an organisation for all God’s people.

I think we all agree with that. The problem is that the Church has a mission to preach the truth, not compromise it. The “gay” population must be open to hearing the truth. Their questions have been answered many times. There are organizations like Courage that help folks.

St. Augustine said it best. He said accpet first and understand second. For any of us to be faithful to Christ requires obedience. Few today, homosexual or heterosexual, accept the concept of cheerful obedience.

 

[Lisa_N]

Jermosh:

Actually homosexual behavoir is very prevelent in most social mammels and birds under normal situations. Sea mammels are very prevelant for some reason. Dolphins have sex for pleasure as well. Penquins actually take lifelong SS mates.

You are comparing apples and oranges about dolphins having sex for pleasure although do you actually know that is the case? IOW it could be some form of mating behavior rather than simply dophins gone to hedonism. Some animals masturbate. So I guess that’s sex for pleasure. It is not the same as being exclusively attracted to the same sex or having a biological basis for SSA. I’d really like to see some documentation. As I recall “Ken” brought up the penguin story and it was easily debunked.

Whether you believe in God or not, the reality is that all creatures live to procreate. That is the strongest drive they have being mere survival. Doesn’t matter if you are an ant or a human being. Any genetic anomoly that would prevent procreation would be considered abnormal. Ergo, homosexuality is ABNORMAL. Even if you don’t think it’s a sin, it’s not a positive thing for any species.

Lisa N

 

[Lisa_N]

FightingFat:

Another way of looking at it might be that discrimination is bad.
I think we have to deal with these people as people first and foremost. Most are struggling with their sexuality anyway. I’m not denying the truth of the Church’s teaching in this regard, but I would rather we had an inclusive attitude and reached out as an organisation for all God’s people.

Why do you and Springbreeze and all the other homosexual apologists fail to acknowledge that homosexuals are NOT excluded from the Church? No one is standing at the door with a “Gaydar Radar” and turning people away (despite that ludicrous commercial by UCC).

However, this behavior is unhealthy, unwise, non life affirming, abnormal and according to the Church a grave sin. Do we affirm the SIN? Is THAT the measure of 'inclusion?" Do you do a homosexual any favor by saying well keep in sinning because that’s the loving approach? Would you have that same response to an alcoholic? An adulterer? I don’t think so.

Because homosexuals feel their struggle is ever so much harder than anyone else’s they apparently think they ought to be given a free pass and not have to acknowledge their sins or try to avoid the sin in the future.

I don’t understand that rationale but maybe one of the homosexual apologists can explain it to me.
Lisa N

 

[FightingFat]

fix:

I think we all agree with that. The problem is that the Church has a mission to preach the truth, not compromise it. The “gay” population must be open to hearing the truth. Their questions have been answered many times. There are organizations like Courage that help folks.

St. Augustine said it best. He said accpet first and understand second. For any of us to be faithful to Christ requires obedience. Few today, homosexual or heterosexual, accept the concept of cheerful obedience.

Cool! We are in cahoots!

I suppose I think I would trust my religious and just try and be ‘Christ-like’.
Homosexuals are a challenge! I am determined no to be a bigot.

 

[FightingFat]

Lisa N:

Why do you and Springbreeze and all the other homosexual apologists fail to acknowledge that homosexuals are NOT excluded from the Church? No one is standing at the door with a “Gaydar Radar” and turning people away (despite that ludicrous commercial by UCC).

Sorry!

Lisa N:

However, this behavior is unhealthy, unwise, non life affirming, abnormal and according to the Church a grave sin. Do we affirm the SIN? Is THAT the measure of 'inclusion?" Do you do a homosexual any favor by saying well keep in sinning because that’s the loving approach? Would you have that same response to an alcoholic? An adulterer? I don’t think so.

I think they would need to study the Catachism and reach their own conclusions about what it says and why it says it.

If asked, I would always point out the Church’s teaching on the subject. As a Catechist, I have been asked a few times. I try to accentuate the bit that says “[homosexualitys] physcological genesis remains largely unexplained” that it constitutes a trial for most of them, that “every sign of unjust discrimination in their regard should be avoided” and that these persons are “called to fulfill God’s will in their lives and to unite with the sacrifice of the Lord’s Cross the difficulties they may encounter from their condition” without ignoring the fact that the Catechism notes that the condition is gravely disordered. So basically, I think that sin is a matter of grace between the sinner and the priest and God and not for me to pass judgement on, unless my opinion is consulted. I see a homosexual couple as being perfectly capable of love, of genuinely caring for one another. They must reconcile that with their faith and I see that they will need m love and support in coming to terms with stuff like that- which is going to be very tough.
It’s just how I feel.
Lisa N:

Because homosexuals feel their struggle is ever so much harder than anyone else’s they apparently think they ought to be given a free pass and not have to acknowledge their sins or try to avoid the sin in the future.

I don’t understand that rationale but maybe one of the homosexual apologists can explain it to me.
Lisa N

“homosexual apologists”

Heh-heh.

I suppose I don’t feel the need to show them what terrible sinners they are. I have enough sin of my own to deal with. I’m not denying how difficult some of these situations are…Openly condoning stuff is different from not condemning it. Still, I don’t feel outrage serves much useful purpose. Can these people cease to exist? Should they stop being gay? It must be a very lonely place to be. If you believe you have been born homosexual, where do you go once you have come to terms with your sexuality? Are we saying that they should never come to terms with it?

 

[Norwich]

Trelow:

You don’t love someone by leting them recive the Holy Eucharist while in a state of mortal sin.

You don’t love someone by accepting thier God rebuking deviant lifestyle.

You love them by pastoring to their immortal soul.

There is a grave difference between having SSA, and being a sodomite. Between having a physiological disorder and embracing mortal sin.

Giving someone a hug isn’t love. Letting someone know they are on the fast track to hell is.

If Jesus loves you, how do you know he doesn’t love them?

You talk about pastoring to their immortal soul, you talkj about embracing mortal sin as if they themselves didn’t know but, they do know, they are aware of catholic teaching as the rest of us and knowing that they will have to answer to God for their behaviour as much as you will for yours or I for mine.

If they recieve the Eucharist in a state of mortal sin, it is no longer the Eucharist.

Like Jesus you don’t condemn their lifestyle, you point out its wrongness and the choice is then theirs. They believe or not.

You love them for being the IMAGE OF OUR LORD, as all people are.

You do not judge their “illness” or whatever, “Do not judge lest ye be judged” Remember?

Giving someone a hug and telling them you love them no matter what their faults and not condemning them IS LOVE.

As my old granny used to say: “There but for the grace of God go any of us”

Sounds like somebody could do with some “Humility” pills.

 

[Trelow]

Norwich:

If Jesus loves you, how do you know he doesn’t love them?

Love is wanting for them what God wants for them, not giving them a rainbow sticker with a smiley face on it.

You talk about pastoring to their immortal soul, you talkj about embracing mortal sin as if they themselves didn’t know but, they do know, they are aware of catholic teaching as the rest of us and knowing that they will have to answer to God for their behaviour as much as you will for yours or I for mine.

If they recieve the Eucharist in a state of mortal sin, it is no longer the Eucharist.

It’s sacrilege. Letting someone damn themselves isn’t love

Like Jesus you don’t condemn their lifestyle, you point out its wrongness and the choice is then theirs. They believe or not.

We are responsible for things we fail to do as well.

You love them for being the IMAGE OF OUR LORD, as all people are.

You do not judge their “illness” or whatever, “Do not judge lest ye be judged” Remember?

You don’t judge wither they are in heaven or hell, you do judge their actions, it’s fool’s talk to say otherwise.

Giving someone a hug and telling them you love them no matter what their faults and not condemning them IS LOVE.

That compassion, not agape love.

As my old granny used to say: “There but for the grace of God go any of us”

Sounds like somebody could do with some “Humility” pills.

There is a difference between being humble and being asleep at the guard.

 

[fix]

Norwich:

If Jesus loves you, how do you know he doesn’t love them?

You talk about pastoring to their immortal soul, you talkj about embracing mortal sin as if they themselves didn’t know but, they do know, they are aware of catholic teaching as the rest of us and knowing that they will have to answer to God for their behaviour as much as you will for yours or I for mine.

If they recieve the Eucharist in a state of mortal sin, it is no longer the Eucharist.

Like Jesus you don’t condemn their lifestyle, you point out its wrongness and the choice is then theirs. They believe or not.

You love them for being the IMAGE OF OUR LORD, as all people are.

You do not judge their “illness” or whatever, “Do not judge lest ye be judged” Remember?

Giving someone a hug and telling them you love them no matter what their faults and not condemning them IS LOVE.

As my old granny used to say: “There but for the grace of God go any of us”

Sounds like somebody could do with some “Humility” pills.

I am sorry but posts like this get it almost totally backwards. It is not that Christians are unloving for being angry at those that promote the “gay” agenda that is the problem. It is the idea that some "gay’ folks want to change morality that is the problem.

It is not unloving to fight error. Many see their children’s souls at risk with the great acceptance of deviant behavior as normal. It is as if some think speaking out against violations of the moral law is unloving.

We all agree to love sinners, but authenic love, not touchy feely love. When did we decide that it was no big deal to allow so many to lead others into sin?

 

[FightingFat]

Well I think Norwich got it absolute right. Well done Norwich! I’m with you!

:clapping: